Ironman mode?

[mcwaffles2003]

If, and that's a BIG if, we see a game that has relatively few bugs somehow form out of all this should the game include an "Ironman" mode?

Basically no resets, and 1 save that auto updates somewhat frequently. 

Just curious.

[jimmymcgoochie]

You mean, just disable all reverts and set the auto save frequency to be every few minutes? You can already do that in KSP and I see no reason that it wouldn’t also be possible in KSP2.

[mcwaffles2003]

1 minute ago, jimmymcgoochie said:

You mean, just disable all reverts and set the auto save frequency to be every few minutes? You can already do that in KSP and I see no reason that it wouldn’t also be possible in KSP2.

You can still have multiple saves though, giving you a way out in a tough situation

[Toucan]

I thought you meant include parts to build an Ironman armour for Kerbals. Still voted yes.

[kerbiloid]

And "format c:" for permadeath like in good old times.

P.S.
Caution! If the notebook is parents', the permadeath after its formatting may be real.

[Superfluous J]

1 hour ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

You can still have multiple saves though, giving you a way out in a tough situation

Psst you can do that in most any game.

[Metallic_Hydrogen]

it may be challenging, but always reminding myself that I'm not the strongest sucks.

[Vanamonde]

I never understood the concept of ironman settings. You can play any game at any time that way by simply refraining from using the features you don't want. 

[Rocket Witch]

1 hour ago, Vanamonde said:

I never understood the concept of ironman settings. You can play any game at any time that way by simply refraining from using the features you don't want. 

I think the idea is that some people have really poor personal control and need that restriction to be imposed on them by an outside force for them to actually adhere to it.

It's also like the prestige of 'all stock' craft designs perceived by some people; if it's an official feature of the game then ironman is given some hard-to-define sense of extra validation in the eyes of some proportion of the playerbase.

Edited May 11, 2020 by Rocket Witch

[Incarnation of Chaos]

I legit thought you were talking about Kerbals being able to fly around Anthem style for a second. Then read the description, and voted no.

Mods will take care of this in KSP2 without a doubt.

[Superfluous J]

7 hours ago, Vanamonde said:

I never understood the concept of ironman settings. You can play any game at any time that way by simply refraining from using the features you don't want. 

For me personally I don't get it either. I do though get the idea of "beating it on ironman" being more prestigious than beating it normally.

Until you realize that save files still exist and backing up is a thing and ... well ... yeah there you go.

Either way it comes down to self control.

[mattinoz]

38 minutes ago, Superfluous J said:

For me personally I don't get it either. I do though get the idea of "beating it on ironman" being more prestigious than beating it normally.

Until you realize that save files still exist and backing up is a thing and ... well ... yeah there you go.

Either way it comes down to self control.

Exactly You'd have to encode the save files so the key to decode them is lost to time and back ups are useless.

[Superfluous J]

1 hour ago, mattinoz said:

Exactly You'd have to encode the save files so the key to decode them is lost to time and back ups are useless.

And then someone saves the game, goes on a 1-month trip, and freaks out because they can't complete their game.

Really the only way to do it would be like a server authentication. Then of course you wouldn't be able to play without Internet access, or if the server went down. And then people would still either complain or find ways around it.

[shdwlrd]

Ironman mode wouldn't work well for KSP. Outside of saves you can revert to when you mess up. There would be many opportunities to recover when you mess up, so much so that it deems the Ironman mode moot.

[mcwaffles2003]

8 hours ago, shdwlrd said:

Ironman mode wouldn't work well for KSP. Outside of saves you can revert to when you mess up. There would be many opportunities to recover when you mess up, so much so that it deems the Ironman mode moot.

Well thats the thing, it would include only 1 allowable save that updates itself often (or when the player manually saves), and reverts are not allowed (forced auto saves upon ship crash)

I feel self control for me goes out the window when Im trying to save a career but I also tend to be more reckless so a mode like this might push me to play in a more serious manner if I would like to.

9 hours ago, Superfluous J said:

And then someone saves the game, goes on a 1-month trip, and freaks out because they can't complete their game.

im confused, 1 month trip? why couldnt they complete their game?

9 hours ago, Superfluous J said:

Really the only way to do it would be like a server authentication. Then of course you wouldn't be able to play without Internet access, or if the server went down. And then people would still either complain or find ways around it.

I was thinking more like how dark souls does its saves. I dont see why a server or anything like that is necessary

10 hours ago, Superfluous J said:

For me personally I don't get it either. I do though get the idea of "beating it on ironman" being more prestigious than beating it normally.

Until you realize that save files still exist and backing up is a thing and ... well ... yeah there you go.

make it so every save overwrites the previous save for that game, only 1 save file allowed

18 hours ago, Vanamonde said:

I never understood the concept of ironman settings. You can play any game at any time that way by simply refraining from using the features you don't want. 

if only self control were so easy

17 hours ago, Rocket Witch said:

I think the idea is that some people have really poor personal control and need that restriction to be imposed on them by an outside force for them to actually adhere to it.

This

 

 

Anyway, I figure having the option couldn't hurt the game.

Edited May 12, 2020 by mcwaffles2003

[kerbiloid]

Steam should implement a "Put my money" / "Stand by my words" _{("Отвечаю за базар", "Пацан сказал- пацан сделал" in the Russian localization)} option in their API.

When it's on, the player's virtual death should withdraw all money from his Steam account.

Edited May 12, 2020 by kerbiloid

[brain__washed]

I like the idea of having the option. I do like to play Stellaris, and enjoy playing on Iron Man mode. For me, I notice I approach things more sensibly than I would otherwise knowing I can revert/reload a game.

Having the option, in my opinion, would be great as long as it's easy to implement. If it isn't, I wouldn't mind if it's not there. In that case: time to work on my self control I guess...

[Guest]

All for it, assuming the game is stable enough. I would probably use it.

If additionally the game had a mission simulator that let us design craft and practice missions, I even think that ought to be the recommended way to play. I often simulate this by having a separate sandbox game as my simulator, then porting the craft over. It's clunky, and if it was supported in-game without the clunkiness I would be thrilled.

[Superfluous J]

2 hours ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

make it so every save overwrites the previous save for that game, only 1 save file allowed

What stops someone from copying the save so they can restore it later?

2 hours ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

im confused, 1 month trip? why couldnt they complete their game?

That was a reply to someone coming up with an idea to keep you from backing up your save to use later to correct a mistake.

[shdwlrd]

2 hours ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

Well thats the thing, it would include only 1 allowable save that updates itself often (or when the player manually saves), and reverts are not allowed (forced auto saves upon ship crash)

 

38 minutes ago, Superfluous J said:

What stops someone from copying the save so they can restore it later?

This.

2 hours ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

I feel self control for me goes out the window when Im trying to save a career but I also tend to be more reckless so a mode like this might push me to play in a more serious manner if I would like to.

I get the idea, you need something to force you to play more conservatively than you typically would.

In my opinion, KSP2 would need a bunch QOL features to be able to do an Ironman mode. Other people posted a need to run simulations before you even launch. That would necessary to find faults with the craft, mission, and such. But there would also need to be a good stock autopilot, scripting, mission planning features, and full flight info outside of the IVA.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be possible, but I don't see it being a stock feature, at least when it releases anyway.

[kerbiloid]

Every time when I was wanting the realistic ironman way in Fallout or Skyrim, I recalled that the whole world of those rather realistically looking games is just ~5 km wide.
Irl it could be crossed by an artillery shell or anti-tank missile in several seconds and hit any visible object in the world.
Actually, their realism is limited by absense of realistic weapons and realistic distances.

So, while dreaming about realistic gameplay in KSP beyond the realistic T/W, delta-V, and resources from RO and so, we should recall that realistically every ~75th space flight has ended catastrophically.

So, the ironman player should plan his space career and space expansion fitting the ~70 spaceflight limit. An Ironblitzman.

Edited May 12, 2020 by kerbiloid

[Bej Kerman]

On 5/11/2020 at 11:53 AM, mcwaffles2003 said:

On 5/11/2020 at 11:50 AM, jimmymcgoochie said:

You mean, just disable all reverts and set the auto save frequency to be every few minutes? You can already do that in KSP and I see no reason that it wouldn’t also be possible in KSP2.

You can still have multiple saves though, giving you a way out in a tough situation

1. Poor personal control

2. So you have a game with no way out of the tough situation you've put yourself in. Now you have a worm that injects code into your PC stopping any current and future installs of the game from turning ironman mode off  and using extra save files, a liquided sibling who just wants to play KSP 2 normally, and a worm that has just sent itself to every computer that your computer has saved the Email address to. Not only would blocking every way out be complicated (probably illegal too), but it would be pointless and would also [where the forum censor replaced the P word with liquid] off some people who share computers either because of a lack of space or a lack of money.

Edited May 12, 2020 by Bej Kerman

[mcwaffles2003]

5 hours ago, shdwlrd said:

6 hours ago, Superfluous J said:

What stops someone from copying the save so they can restore it later?

This.

Nothing, there's definitely ways around, its just more inconvenient to do so. Ironman mode isn't a perfect system, but more like putting hotsauce on your finger tips to stop you from biting your nails type thing.

4 hours ago, Bej Kerman said:

1. Poor personal control

2. So you have a game with no way out of the tough situation you've put yourself in. Now you have a worm that injects code into your PC stopping any current and future installs of the game from turning ironman mode off  and using extra save files, a liquided sibling who just wants to play KSP 2 normally, and a worm that has just sent itself to every computer that your computer has saved the Email address to. Not only would blocking every way out be complicated (probably illegal too), but it would be pointless and would also [where the forum censor replaced the P word with liquid] off some people who share computers either because of a lack of space or a lack of money.

You've taken this to a strange, and frankly, nonsensical extreme.... Does every game that has an Ironman mode come complete with a semi-sentient worm that destroys a bunch of computers? Never noticed it on Xcom...

[shdwlrd]

34 minutes ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

Ironman mode isn't a perfect system, but more like putting hotsauce on your finger tips to stop you from biting your nails type thing.

Until you have a craving for that hot sauce and must have it everything. 

I agree, no Ironman system is perfect, but if someone wants to find a way around it, they will.

But people who are playing ironman in KSP is doing by choice, there's always that too.

Edited May 12, 2020 by shdwlrd
another thought

[Incarnation of Chaos]

5 hours ago, Bej Kerman said:

 

2. So you have a game with no way out of the tough situation you've put yourself in. Now you have a worm that injects code into your PC stopping any current and future installs of the game from turning ironman mode off  and using extra save files, a liquided sibling who just wants to play KSP 2 normally, and a worm that has just sent itself to every computer that your computer has saved the Email address to. Not only would blocking every way out be complicated (probably illegal too), but it would be pointless and would also [where the forum censor replaced the P word with liquid] off some people who share computers either because of a lack of space or a lack of money.

Step 1- Boot into a Ubuntu Live USB.

Step 2- Navigate to your KSP directory

Step 3- Find your save file, and use a text editor of choice to disable the ironman flag.

Step 4 - Profit!

Also note that KSP allows multiple independent save files/careers, so your sibling could just have their own save file with their own settings.

As much as this is something that i think should be left to modders, this is an extremely implausible situation. And even within it's confines could be worked around easily as i described above.