KSP2 EA Grand Discussion Thread.

[Lukamundo]

Quote

This model is still complex enough to hit all the user stories I’ve defined earlier so as not to compromise our commitment to reality.

Not to be a negative Ned, but I find it funny that they want all this realism, but yet they also said in another post that they think wobbly rockets are a part of Kerbal DNA and great fun, and fail to see that wobbles are NOT a lot of fun! Here is a quote from Nate Simson's post: Calvinball? More like Spherical Hydrogen Tank-Ball!

Quote

Wobbly rockets are sometimes fun and funny. A big part of what originally got many of us hooked on the original KSP was the silliness and emergent problem solving that came from playing World of Goo with rocket parts. Broadly, we see this as part of the Kerbal DNA, and want to preserve it in some form....

I just hope they really see the foot-in-mouth moment that they just created. Don't get me wrong, I loved this whole post about the implantation of thermal physics, but I hope they will almost see how inconsistent they just made themselves about making a real simulation game vs a wacked-out physics mess. I hope they completely remove the wobbling from all components (except, maybe for side mounted ones - and even that should be limited). Solid steal structures don't wobble! - especially in cylindrical shapes.

I hope they see that if they are trying to make a system realistic, they should do that in all aspects of the game, not just one.

As Matt Lowne had mentioned in one of his recent videos, it might have been a funny bug back in the day, but we all want it gone. We don't want to base our creations around wobble and inconsistence. Besides, KSP2 is supposed to be better than its predecessor.

Sorry about the venting, I just had to say something. I had to laugh when I read "reality"

 

 

 

[Spicat]

41 minutes ago, JPR said:

The foundation for KSP2 should have been built upon the KSP1 experiences with RSS +RO + Principia. Flying realistic rockets in the real world with real engines. They could have also kept the parts count down with procedural tanks.  Difficulty could be scaled N-Body Physics (Higher Difficulty) vs 2-Body Physics (Lower Difficulty) the same for complexity of live support.

No and no.

That's interesting for only a very small minority and this is the main thing that should only exist in the realm of mods.

Edited July 24, 2023 by Spicat

[Guest]

51 minutes ago, JPR said:

The heat model in KSP2 seems to be worse than KSP1, as the developers have chosen to move away from KSP1's detailed simulation approach in favor of a deterministic model.  KSP1 with RSS (Real Solar System), RP1 (Realistic Progression 1) and RO (Realism Overhaul) installed is a much better game than KSP2. The foundation for KSP2 should have been built upon the KSP1 experiences with RSS +RO + Principia. Flying realistic rockets in the real world with real engines. They could have also kept the parts count down with procedural tanks.  Difficulty could be scaled N-Body Physics (Higher Difficulty) vs 2-Body Physics (Lower Difficulty) the same for complexity of live support.

I'm sure there's a public for a hardcore space simulator, but it's not the KSP public, most of it anyway. I for one would be out, I don't have the time for that kind of thing

[m4inbrain]

53 minutes ago, JPR said:

KSP1 with RSS (Real Solar System), RP1 (Realistic Progression 1) and RO (Realism Overhaul) installed is a much better game than KSP2. The foundation for KSP2 should have been built upon the KSP1 experiences with RSS +RO + Principia. Flying realistic rockets in the real world with real engines. They could have also kept the parts count down with procedural tanks.  Difficulty could be scaled N-Body Physics (Higher Difficulty) vs 2-Body Physics (Lower Difficulty) the same for complexity of live support.

Speak for yourself please, and not like it's an actual fact. I don't want procedural tanks (or too many procedural parts in general - see Juno for that) - and i also very much don't want a fully realistic sim with "real stuff". That quite literally is the opposite of what KSP is supposed to be. Now we can argue about the level of sillyness that's desirable, but not about the actual fact that KSP at the core is lighthearted and accessible. And i very much hope it stays that way.

[darthgently]

13 minutes ago, m4inbrain said:

i also very much don't want a fully realistic sim with "real stuff". That quite literally is the opposite of what KSP is supposed to be.

But, respectfully, you should speak for yourself also. It seems like most vitriol in the forums comes from assumptions about what KSP is "supposed to be".

Ideally, I would think, KSP2 would provide core functionally and a base game that covers common players' tastes and then mods and DLCs would add the twists to suit more niche groups (detailed life support, more aero/physics realism,  advanced scripting control,  etc).

[RocketRockington]

5 hours ago, PDCWolf said:

Excuse the quotes as it is not a direct reply to your posts, but I do need it to kickstart the following. I will say that I've already had this post in Reddit in a much more... direct way, but I think it is good to bring it up for discussion here where the much more dedicated "fans" are, as it got some upvotes but really no discussion or challenge at all so here it goes: What's the point of KSP2? Even including all the stuff that's planned.

$50 for a graphics makeover, and the chance to sell DLC to everyone without being tied to Squad's old giveaway promise.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, JPR said:

KSP1 with RSS (Real Solar System), RP1 (Realistic Progression 1) and RO (Realism Overhaul) installed is a much better game than KSP2.

If a game has to stand on the strength of third-party mods (attached to obfuscated code, I might add, at least while I was modding) then it's not really that good of a game.

[Alexoff]

22 minutes ago, regex said:

If a game has to stand on the strength of third-party mods (attached to obfuscated code, I might add, at least while I was modding) then it's not really that good of a game.

And if the game is based on one modmaker, accepted into the developer's staff?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Alexoff said:

And if the game is based on one modmaker, accepted into the developer's staff?

Which game is that? I'd have to base my judgement on the game itself.

[Alexoff]

3 minutes ago, regex said:

Which game is that? I'd have to base my judgement on the game itself.

Oh God, forget it 

[Guest]

Just now, Alexoff said:

Oh God, forget it 

If you're trying to make some snide comment about Nertea to make a point about KSP2 you're not doing a very good job. I hardly think the game is "based on" him; there's an entire team there as well with tons of different people filling tons of different roles than "dev", not to mention some former modders who became devs that might not be named. Even if Nertea is the only former mod on the team that hardly speaks to his role and whether he's guiding the direction of the entire game.

[Dunas Only Moon]

i think that they made it too childish by removing stuff that might be deemed not so good for kids, but i think they took it too far with the tutorials, its much more made for little kids, i ask that they remove the childish parts, please @Nate Simpson why is your game made for kids?

sorry for ping

 

[Alexoff]

6 minutes ago, regex said:

whether he's guiding the direction of the entire game

That's noticeable

8 minutes ago, regex said:

there's an entire team there as well with tons of different people filling tons of different roles than "dev", not to mention some former modders who became devs that might not be named

Yes, some of them drew beautiful planets. And tutorials. But apparently there was no one to do the heating for all these years. Perhaps Nertea will finish with heating and will start with colonies that have not been shown to us for two years (not counting the very colony from spring 2020, which is often shown)

[Vanamonde]

Overlapping threads have been merged. Also, some off-topic comments removed. 

[The Aziz]

13 minutes ago, Vanamonde said:

Overlapping threads have been merged. Also, some off-topic comments removed. 

I.. think you messed up the merging order, by the looks of it

1 hour ago, Dunas Only Moon said:

i think that they made it too childish by removing stuff that might be deemed not so good for kids, but i think they took it too far with the tutorials, its much more made for little kids, i ask that they remove the childish parts, please @Nate Simpson why is your game made for kids?

sorry for ping

 

What did they remove?

Why are tutorials for kids only?

What are childish parts?

Why is this game for kids only?

[RocketRockington]

Lol attempt to bury another dissenting viewpoint at least temporarily foiled.

[PDCWolf]

I don't even know what I'm supposed to reply to anymore thanks to some heavy hands, so I'll just reply to the title *title of the thread this was moved to and from, which was "KSP2 is too childish" or something*:

Yes.

I don't care about the tutorials or PAIGE's voice or the countdown, but I do care about the challenge the game proposes, and it seems everything is getting dumbed down to make way for new features, which we also already know aren't super expansive. People like to think wobble was part of the challenge, well, in KSP2 it looks like it might as well be the only challenge.

1. No economics. (AMA 1)
2. No life support. (AMA 1)
3. Infinite Kerbal longevity. (Implied from 1)
4. Dumbed down heat system. (Devblog)
5. Menu-based colony building (AMA 1).
6. Orbital construction removes a big part of the original challenge. I do like the feature but let's be honest.
7. Automated shipping lanes, which the player has no direct control over (in the sense of how they work) (AMA 2).
8. Still going Kerballed first on the tech tree (AMA 2).
9. Still instantaneous, authoritative probe control (AMA 2).
10. No wind/weather systems (AMA 2).
11. Non-scaled re-entry heating (was a problem in 1, will remain in 2 when we get it).
12. Infinitely strong landing gear wheels and legs (problem in 1, still works that way in 2).
13. Infinite RTGs/Solar panels.
14. No radiation.

 

Edited July 25, 2023 by PDCWolf
Moved here, moved there, nothing makes sense.

[RocketRockington]

 

On 6/14/2023 at 5:28 PM, Dakota said:

Intercept Games has been hands-off when it comes to community moderation since KSP2's launch. I can't speak to how it was before I got here, but I've been pretty adamant about letting the community moderate itself. There have been quite a few times that the forum moderation team has reached out to me about a disputed situation and, they can attest, that my usual response is "here's my two cents, but I defer to your decision-making. You know what's best."

@PDCWolf  What are you talking about?  Look at this statement from @Dakota.  Truer words have clearly never been spoken in the history of man or kerbal.

[Vanamonde]

Fixed my goof. Sorry about the confusion, people. 

[Spicat]

1 hour ago, PDCWolf said:

Infinite RTGs/Solar panels.

RTGs have a lifetime in ksp2..

1 hour ago, PDCWolf said:

No radiation.

I’m actually not sure about that, they definitely thought about implementing it and I think we’ll see it in the far future:

https://youtube.com/watch?t=514&v=nnudM_iIDr8

For an additional source, we saw a radiation icon in the vab:

Definitely ask for it, they will likely add it.

Edited July 25, 2023 by Spicat

[Dunas Only Moon]

5 hours ago, The Aziz said:

I.. think you messed up the merging order, by the looks of it

What did they remove?

Why are tutorials for kids only?

What are childish parts?

Why is this game for kids only?

because the tutorials have cartoony feelings and... just look at them yourself

also dont remove my thread and post it onto a chain, it ruins the chance of me finding it

Edit: that was for mod

[RocketRockington]

20 minutes ago, Dunas Only Moon said:

also dont remove my thread and post it onto a chain, it ruins the chance of me finding it

Making it harder for people to see is why it was done.

[razark]

Indeed.  One has to search really hard to find people endlessly complaining about every single bit of the game.

[The Aziz]

2 hours ago, Dunas Only Moon said:

because the tutorials have cartoony feelings and... just look at them yourself

Yeah, I'm looking, and I like them, just like many others here, mr. Adult. Something being a cartoon doesn't mean it's for kids. If you look at the history of 2D animation over the last 80 years...

[Vanamonde]

2 hours ago, Dunas Only Moon said:

also dont remove my thread and post it onto a chain, it ruins the chance of me finding it

Edit: that was for mod

There is normally a pointer showing where something was moved, but not in this case because I screwed it up. Sorry.