[1.12] Extraplanetary Launchpads v6.99.3

[Tex_NL]

For a long, long time EPL is one of those mods I would really like to use but can't bring myself to actually do it as it is at the same time one of the very best and very worst out there.

In concept it's brilliant. It offers a feature that KSP desperately needs. But in execution it fails horribly.
When I look at the models the hex-cans makes me want to puke. And they are among the best looking parts in the entire mod. The models for EPL have been far below anything that's out there from the very start. And sadly they still are. And that's despite a large number of excellent model makers in the community.

So I beg you @taniwha, on my bare knees. Please, PLEASE strike a bargain with one of them and update the models. Look for example what @Nils277 has done for KPBS with EPL. His models look great, very stock-a-like. Not something that belongs in the recycler.

Please don't get me wrong; the mechanics behind EPL are great. I've used it in the past and I really want to use it again but the models always have kept me from installing it.
I am actually considering installing EPL and stripping it bare to it's core and just use the KPBS parts instead.

[DStaal]

@Tex_NL:

 

[Tex_NL]

1 minute ago, DStaal said:

@Tex_NL:

 

 

Great example of what I am NOT talking about.

Yes, those models look pretty neat. But that is yet another mod to install only to ADD extra models. And I already have KPBS for that. It does not update the hopelessly outdated EPL models to the current standard.

[Kwarazi]

@Tex_NL You could argue that he provides the framework for others to Mod around and if you require better models then add them yourself or find someone who does.

The concept is as you know that KSP is very mod friendly and a lot of those mods are very open to being modded them selves.

Plus I don't think using words like "fails horribly" "makes me Puke" and "Worse out there" is going to encourage the mod author to do a lot about your observations.

 

[taniwha]

@Tex_NL: I am well aware that most of the models for EL are... not great. Even the few that I made (the workshop, the orbital dock, and the recycling bins (especially)) need more work. Oh, I made the survey stake and mallet too, but I'm mostly happy with them (could do with better materials).

As Kwarazi says, using such hyperbole as you have is really not on. Fortunately for you, I'm not one to get into a hissy fit over it.

 

Anyway, it's not that I can't model, but rather than I have dedicated my insufficient time to EL's reliability (how other parts+functionality modders do what they do is beyond me). I am working on a set of models that I'm currently debating whether to put into EL or to make a separate mod, but I doubt they'll ever be "beautiful" (more functional). Also, it's going rather slowly.

[Agnemon]

Don't know if I am being particularly dense atm or are we missing storage for scrap metal for the latest upgrade. Just recycled a ship and got 500 scrapmetal for it

 

[goldenpsp]

@Tex_NL

 

Here you go.  This should help you get started so you can put your money where your mouth is.  I'm sure @taniwha would be happy to accept model donations from the community and you could learn a great skill.

 

 

[taniwha]

@Agnemon: Yeah, sorry, forgot about the storage issue. For now, I suggest Modular Fuel Tanks (linked in the OP) and maybe even Talisar Parts: the spherical tanks look quite nice, and with Fire Spitter installed the textures are switchable (part of why I forgot: I always use MFT and TP)

[cgwhite4]

Agnemon: While I would not call this optimal, there is one workaround that I can think of: putting a smelter (of any size) on your recycler.  Of course, the biggest smelters would be more efficient (allowing you to consume larger pieces of junk without wasting scrap metal), but you may have to be careful if you are operating in high gravity conditions (such as the surface of Eve), as a recycler rover with the largest size smelter has been installed would likely be quite top-heavy, and thus prone to tipping over (which could in turn result in Rapid Unscheduled Disassembly).  It is probably just better to wait until taniwha provides us with more appropriate storage, but if you are in a hurry to get your recycling program up and running again, this can serve as a stopgap.

taniwha: It sounds like we need some scrap metal tanks similar to the red ones for metal ore and blue ones for metal.  Perhaps green for scrap metal?  Seems to be the most logical color since scrap metal is typically recycled into metal, and recycling is a "green" process.  Since I would rather not have to replace my JunkEater rovers twice to get back to the same level of storage efficiency, I'll suspend recycling operations for the time being.  It will be interesting to see what color you choose for the scrap metal tanks, and I hope to see them soon in an upcoming patch.

[影之瑒]

I have to say I love this Mod,and I suggest that you can make some Unmanned workshop (it'is just like a robot factory), Otherwise If we have used Life support system like Kerbalism or TAC life support and other Mod like Remotech,that will be very hard to bulid an extraplanetary launchpad in space

 

[Agnemon]

Keriden dynamics make storage tanks that take Scrap metal, they also have a 3D printer that makes rocket parts without Kerbals.

One problem I found with modular fuel tanks is that it removes the single content life support canisters from TACs life support (only left with the "Food, Water, Oxygen" tank in four sizes) which is an issue if you already have vessels / stations / bases built using them

[LastStarDust]

Is anyone having problems with "blank" staging in rockets built with EPL? Further in detail, each stage element is present but nothing is showing but the number 4. I'm asking here because I also use MKS and other 100 mods so if I am the only one it is (likely) an interference between different mods.

[cgwhite4]

I can only think of two things here.  First, sometimes I have to press the space bar twice to stage.  In such cases, it will make the engine activation noise on the first press of the space bar, but do nothing.  I am not even sure that is an EL issue (and in fact thought it was a KSP issue).  Second, you can have null stages when editing the staging in the Vehicle Assembly Building (VAB).  I have always corrected this before exiting the VAB though.  It may also be possible to have null stages if components of your vessel get destroyed before you get to them in the staging sequence (e.g., if something overheats during atmospheric entry).  However, it sounds like the issue you are experiencing is something different than this.  Most likely, if you are using 100 mods, a mod conflict is to blame, especially if you updated any of them right before this issue first occurred.

[LastStarDust]

Thank you for the answer. I am afraid the non of those conditions apply to me ... I must stress than once in a while (about 1 of 10) the staging is correctly displayed. Anyhow it is not so annoying as to make me uninstall one by one all 100 mods to spot the culprit.

Edited March 10, 2017 by LastStarDust

[Space Kadet]

ok so and anyone help me here, for some reason EPL isint working in 3rd party docks, on looking closer i cant see any part aside from the survey station, ive removed the 10 lins at the bottom of the USI_el config, and cleared out the MM cache, but still no el in my game. ive tried it with the Dsev and spacedock docks. but im at a loss whats screwing it up now. 

I can provide a mod list if needed but i have most of the big names! all updated a few days ago (thow ive not used EL properly for several updates.)


Edit----------------------------

it seemed to be a problem with the package i downloaded, i downloaded it again and installed (because i deleted the zip from 3 hours ago) and its working!

Edited March 11, 2017 by Space Kadet

[zabieru]

A gentle suggestion for Tex_NL: Think about what you actually want. You seem to be aware that there are pretty models available. Evidently that's not good enough for you. So what, exactly, is the issue?

Is it the presence of the ugly base-EPL models in the VAB even when you install KPBS/whatever? If so, a little MM patch will suppress them. This one's borrowed from MKS, I think originally written by RagingIrishman. You may need to comment out some lines depending on exactly what you have replacements for, but that's easy enough. Put it in a file ending in .cfg somewhere in your GameData folder.

 

Spoiler

/* Remove EPL parts. */
-PART[Magnetometer]:FINAL {}
-PART[exRunway]:FINAL {}
-PART[HexCanRocketParts*]:FINAL {}
-PART[Rocketparts*7x]:FINAL {}
-PART[ExWorkshop]:FINAL {}
-PART[RocketBuilder]:FINAL {}
-PART[ELTank*]:FINAL {}
-PART[Auger]:FINAL {}
-PART[SmallAuger]:FINAL {}
-PART[TinyAuger]:FINAL {}
-PART[exLaunchPad]:FINAL {}
-PART[exLaunchPad2]:FINAL {}
-PART[HexCanMetal*]:FINAL {}
-PART[HexCanOre*]:FINAL {}
-PART[Smelter]:FINAL {}
-PART[SmallSmelter]:FINAL {}
-PART[TinySmelter]:FINAL {}
-PART[OMD]:FINAL {}
-PART[ExSurveyStation]:FINAL {}

 

[Rehpic]

I'm seeing the missing Mallet and Survey Spike bug that @Trigonaut reported and I've found the cause.

Both parts have errors like this in output_log.txt:

Quote

 

PartLoader: Compiling Part 'ExtraplanetaryLaunchpads/Parts/Mallet/part/ExMallet'
 
(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/generated/common/runtime/UnityEngineDebugBindings.gen.cpp Line: 42)

PartLoader: Encountered exception during compilation. System.FormatException: Input string was not in the correct format
  at System.Int32.Parse (System.String s) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at PartLoader.ParsePart (.UrlConfig urlConfig, .ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
  at PartLoader+<CompileParts>c__Iterator62.MoveNext () [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 
 
(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/generated/common/runtime/UnityEngineDebugBindings.gen.cpp Line: 42)

PartCompiler: Cannot compile part

 

After looking through the configs I found that both parts had non-integer costs. When I changed the costs to be integers the errors went away and the parts appeared.

 

 

 

[taniwha]

@Rehpic: odd, because cost is a float. Most importantly, it loads just fine here with the fractional cost.

While this does narrow down the mystery of why the Mallet and Survey Stake don't load, it makes no sense.

I did just have an idea, though: entryCost is an int. Might you have a MM config somewhere that calculates entryCost based on cost? (maybe one of the custom tech tree mods).

[edit] Easy way to check without digging through a zillion MM patches: look in GameData/ModuleManager.ConfigCache at the mallet's entry and check entryCost.

Edited March 13, 2017 by taniwha

[Rehpic]

2 minutes ago, taniwha said:

@Rehpic: odd, because cost is a float. Most importantly, it loads just fine here with the fractional cost.

While this does narrow down the mystery of why the Mallet and Survey Stake don't load, it makes no sense.

I did just have an idea, though: entryCost is an int. Might you have a MM config somewhere that calculates entryCost based on cost? (maybe one of the custom tech tree mods).

@taniwha, yes, I noticed in the MM cache that entryCost was also a float before applying the fix, and was an integer after I changed cost to be integer.

I'm not sure which mod is messing with entryCost.

 

[taniwha]

@Rehpic Still, at least we have a clue now. Thank you for the validation of that idea. Do you have a custom tech-tree mod installed? That would be the first place to look. Or maybe an upgrades mod.

[cgwhite4]

FYI, the build progress catch-up bug has persisted into 5.7.1, as just confirmed when I started building a metal mining rig for Dres at my Minmus base.  All previous EL builds since 5.7.1 came out were Gilly to Moho missions, so my Gilly base never managed to accrue enough backlog to trigger it in those cases.  I have not yet attempted the workaround since 5.7.1 came out, but have no reason to believe its efficacy would have been compromised.

On the other hand, of my Gilly launchpad's four KAS connector ports, two are always occupied by winches from the workshop module and fueling rig, and a third is being occupied by a second workshop module which originally served as a transport, allowing me to send 11 Kerbals to a base at once (it has a cupola on top for command purposes).  The fourth is now occupied by a derelict and detached workshop module (i.e., junk that needs to be recycled).  While I can still probably launch 2-3 more manned missions from that base before I would want to re-crew again, there would then be the problem of both possible connection points to the Launchpad being fouled by junk.  Even if I move it out of the way, junk would continue to pile up near the base until I have the means of efficiently recycling it into scrap metal.  This situation is most serious at Gilly with one connector already fouled, but my bases on Minmus, Ike, and possibly Moho (completed with the recent missions) would eventually be subject to the same issue.  I am hoping that Tex_NL's complaint has not deterred you from addressing the scrap metal storage problem.  I do not have any issue with the aesthetics of the current storage containers myself, and am more concerned with making a recycling rover that is compatible with the new system (and feeding the junk and the old recycling rover to it).

Edit: I can now confirm that, as suspected, the workaround for the build progress catch-up bug is still working.

Edited March 17, 2017 by cgwhite4
further information

[Agnemon]

@cgwhite4 Have a look at Keriden Dynamics, there are 3 sizes of storage cans for each standard diameter that can be configured for scrapmetal. They wll keep you going in the interim.

 

[cgwhite4]

Agnemon: An interesting thought, though I had hoped to only have to replace my recyclers once to reconfigure for EL 5.7.1 and beyond.

[betelphi]

I am wondering how to modify survey site ranges? When downloading from the github source, there is a Source/Survey/SurveyStation file that defines the ranges, but I do not know how to make those changes when downloading from CKAN or spacedock. My base is both wide and very tall so that I have to be fairly close the the center of my base in order to build anything, so for my personal use I want to modify the ranges to be larger. 

 

EDIT: I guess the root of my question is, how do I build the Gamedata from the github source? Is there a series of terminal commands starting from the github master directory that will produce a Gamedata folder that has EPL using the changes I make in the Source directory?

Edited March 19, 2017 by betelphi

[Agnemon]

@betelphi  

In theory you should be able to change those details with an "MM" patch providing the ranges are exposed by @taniwha.This would be far better than modifing the source and recompiling (something you would have to do for every release)