[1.6.x] RasterPropMonitor - Development Stopped (v0.30.6, 29 December 2018)

[Manul]

14 minutes ago, panarchist said:

It's perfectly usable and has a number of items never implemented in RPM. It really just needs IVA makers.

Nobody says MAS is not as good as RPM because it's even better. But there are hundreds of awesome props in ASET props/avionics pack and lots of nice cockpits using them. And they all depend on RPM. So we need RPM to keep this or this working 

22 minutes ago, panarchist said:

I can't run RPM well anymore due to the hit on frame rate when running with my other mods

Does MAS affect the framerate less than RPM?

[MOARdV]

3 hours ago, Manul said:

But there are hundreds of awesome props in ASET props/avionics pack and lots of nice cockpits using them. And they all depend on RPM.

I have to agree, I think this is the biggest roadblock to MAS being used.  One of my goals early in MAS development was to create MAS versions of all of the ASET props, so that a (probably very large) MM patch could 'upgrade' RPM cockpits to MAS by replacing old props with new props.  However, with hundreds of MAS props, and a conversion that can not be completely automatic, it is something that would take many, many hours.  I've already spent hundreds of hours working on MAS over the last three years, and other things have happened in Real Life, so I no longer have many, many hours to spend writing the config files and testing the new props.

3 hours ago, Manul said:

Does MAS affect the framerate less than RPM?

I believe that it does.  I've measured the effect of MAS on framerate, and it is usually only a couple of milliseconds per FixedUpdate - and that is with a complex IVA that uses Lua scripts, multiple MFDs, and dozens of props.

RPM had inefficiencies in its design that were not easy to remove without breaking existing RPM cockpits.  One of those inefficiencies caused the upside down MFDs that happened with 1.8 (and with 1.5 or 1.6 - whenever we had the last big Unity update).  Another inefficiency is that literally every prop uses a few CPU cycles during Update and FixedUpdate, even if they're not doing anything differently than last the update.

RPM also was designed so some instruments and MFDs would not update as frequently, and that leads to a perception of lag, because you can see MFD values (like altitude) not updating continuously.  That does not affect actual frame rate, but it provides the impression that RPM lags.

More advanced IVA designs, like most of what alexustas created, would benefit a lot from the efficiency MAS adds for certain tasks.

About the only way I could make MAS faster is if I wrote a complete Lua to IL translator (instead of the partial one that MAS has), and I integrated it into core KSP code, instead of a mod.  Or I redesign KSP to use native code, instead of C# and Unity.  But that's far more work than I'm willing to do for a mod that doesn't provide me a paycheck. 

[Jacke]

4 hours ago, MOARdV said:

One of those inefficiencies caused the upside down MFDs that happened with 1.8 (and with 1.5 or 1.6 - whenever we had the last big Unity update).

That was 1.4 that last changed the Unity version (and had up to 1.4.5 in minor releases).

Do any existing MAS IVAs use parts of ASET Avionics and ASET Props?

[CSA]

15 hours ago, Manul said:

I'm currently using Defender Cobra M5 but I can not recommend anyone to use this monstrosity since it requires tons of upgrade parts from VKB-sim and these parts are not produced or sold anymore. I have future plans to use EJoy32 controller to join joystick and my custom built ECS (including RCS stick) into a single USB device and also add MOAR buttons, lights and adjustment knobs

Those are big words for me, although I would like to know how to do those things. I am using "Saitek ST90". It's very simple, I know, but it gives me better results in KSP, than the "Saitek X52", and I don't understand why.

[MOARdV]

8 hours ago, Jacke said:

That was 1.4 that last changed the Unity version (and had up to 1.4.5 in minor releases).

Maybe that was it.  I haven't kept close track of when the versions came out.

 

9 hours ago, Jacke said:

Do any existing MAS IVAs use parts of ASET Avionics and ASET Props?

Yes - some ASET "props" are inert (they don't have any modules attached to them) decoration or primitives for building panels.  Almost all of the rest of the MAS props use the meshes and textures from ASET Avionics and ASET Props.  There are no props in MAS that use the stock props, since they look really bad compared to alexustas's props.

[panarchist]

On 11/15/2019 at 11:22 AM, Manul said:

Nobody says MAS is not as good as RPM because it's even better. But there are hundreds of awesome props in ASET props/avionics pack and lots of nice cockpits using them. And they all depend on RPM. So we need RPM to keep this or this working 

Does MAS affect the framerate less than RPM?

Yes, a lot less.

[elpersonpl]

can someone tell me how to add VesselView and all that cause I placed it in game data JSI  and ASET and none of those things worked

[Manul]

On 11/16/2019 at 2:15 AM, MOARdV said:

I believe that it does.  I've measured the effect of MAS on framerate, and it is usually only a couple of milliseconds per FixedUpdate - and that is with a complex IVA that uses Lua scripts, multiple MFDs, and dozens of props.

RPM had inefficiencies in its design that were not easy to remove without breaking existing RPM cockpits.  One of those inefficiencies caused the upside down MFDs that happened with 1.8 (and with 1.5 or 1.6 - whenever we had the last big Unity update).  Another inefficiency is that literally every prop uses a few CPU cycles during Update and FixedUpdate, even if they're not doing anything differently than last the update.

RPM also was designed so some instruments and MFDs would not update as frequently, and that leads to a perception of lag, because you can see MFD values (like altitude) not updating continuously.  That does not affect actual frame rate, but it provides the impression that RPM lags.

More advanced IVA designs, like most of what alexustas created, would benefit a lot from the efficiency MAS adds for certain tasks.

Looks like a reason to write some configs and place some props. I've spent hours writing and testing configs for RPM props (the idea was to make cockpit flexible by using various switchable indicators), now I am asking myself why I didn't do it with MAS. The possibility to use expressions in configs is awesome because creating custom variables for a single use is neither convenient or efficient. And engine groups... looks like an opportunity to create ultimate engine control for spaceplanes with a wild mixture of jets, scramjets, and nuclear/chemical rocket engines

[MOARdV]

11 hours ago, Manul said:

Looks like a reason to write some configs and place some props. I've spent hours writing and testing configs for RPM props (the idea was to make cockpit flexible by using various switchable indicators), now I am asking myself why I didn't do it with MAS. The possibility to use expressions in configs is awesome because creating custom variables for a single use is neither convenient or efficient. And engine groups... looks like an opportunity to create ultimate engine control for spaceplanes with a wild mixture of jets, scramjets, and nuclear/chemical rocket engines

Support for expressions was a top reason for making a clean break when starting MAS.  The custom variables in RPM are painful for anything more than a simple situation (to put it nicely).  I am still amazed at what alexustas did with RPM custom variables in the IVAs he made - if you want some mind bending complexity, look at something like the RPM DSKY custom variables, or the FDAI.

If you do switch over to MAS, take a look at the (poorly-documented) PropConfig tool.  It allows you to batch-process props that have a common look-and-feel without having to copy/paste/edit every single prop.  Hopefully, it's easy enough to figure out.  Otherwise, feel free to ping me for better instructions.

[Stig73]

Hello !
I am a big fan of ALCOR Capsule. I am back to KSP, on 1.8 and no rpm is working.
Is there an easy way to make it work with 1.8, like taking last source and compilling (i can learn to do that) or should i downgrade ksp until one day, ALCOR become MAS compatible ?

[Stone Blue]

@Stig73 Maintenance/updates on RPM has pretty much stopped since KSP 1.7.3.
User Tegmil made a patch to make RPM work on KSP 1.8.+.

Hopefully reading my post here, and the following comments, on this thread will help. I link to where you can find Tegmil's patch, and (hopefully) simple enuff instructions on how to install it *after* RPM v0.30.6 is already installed.
 

 

[Stig73]

OMG
@Stone Blue

MA - RRY - ME !!

I confirm it now works like a charm on ksp 1.8 (And on an heavily modded one).

ALCOR + RPM 
 

HUGE THANKS TO :
@Stone Blue @MOARdV @Tegmil @alexustas

Please, live eternally

[JonnyOThan]

Hi all,

I'm going to "officially" adopt this one - I've rolled @Tegmil's patch into a new github fork here: https://github.com/JonnyOThan/RasterPropMonitor/releases

I'm committed to at least providing new versions as KSP gets updated, but I'd also like to make some improvements, optimizations, and bugfixes.

Release thread: 

 

[MOARdV]

Thank you, @JonnyOThan, for picking up support for RPM.

[moguy16]

what mods can i use for stock ivas with MAS

[chipoku]

Please update to version 1.8

[Geonovast]

@chipoku Hello, and welcome to the forum.

If you'll look up a few posts you'll see that someone else has adopted this mod and started a new thread on it.

[MuriloMoreira]

I installed the mod together with the other VAT Extension mod, the monitors work correctly but the cameras do not appear in the VAB, they simply do not appear there as a piece for me to put on my ship, what do I do?

[JonnyOThan]

1 hour ago, MuriloMoreira said:

I installed the mod together with the other VAT Extension mod, the monitors work correctly but the cameras do not appear in the VAB, they simply do not appear there as a piece for me to put on my ship, what do I do?

Which version of KSP and which version of RPM are you using?  I’ve adopted this mod for KSP 1.8 and later; that thread is here: 

 

[MOARdV]

Since @JonnyOThan has taken over maintenance and development of RasterPropMonitor (thank you, once again), I'm going to have this thread locked to avoid future confusion.

Please check in at the link in the post directly above this one for current editions of RasterPropMonitor.

[Geonovast]

Thread locked at OP's request.