[1.1.3] KSO (Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter) Legacy Packs & Development Updates

[smotheredrun]

11 hours ago, panarchist said:

It's outdated, though, and doesn't incorporate RoverDude's latest rebalancing - unless @Deimos Rast has submitted one to replace the one I wrote.  Also, there were parts of it that never worked 100% correctly - it was one of the first MM patches I did.

Ah!  I see.  I have never used USI-LS before. In fact, I am only just doing my first run through with TAC-LS.

Deimos did throw a number of patches my way when he was active during our testing. I'll take a look for another one when I get back later tonight

[smotheredrun]

12 hours ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

@smotheredrun the Super 25 it is! My career game payloads are enormous and the launchers are always too expensive. It looks like I have a way out.

So... guess what.... I should have mentioned that the current downloads that are available for the 2 orbiters don't work in 1.2.x the way they did in 1.1.x.  Specifically, Squad changed the stock aerodynamics, SAS, and another host of things.  All of this lead to the 2 orbiters performing "differently" shall we say.  A group of us were testing them out and some changes have been made to them.  Testing in 1.2.x continues.

So.......  use the current versions with your "B" Team guys.... They may not survive the ascent, let alone descent and return.  However, if you follow the guide in the PDF file that's included in the downloads - it will make the effort a little bit easier.  

[NISSKEPCSIM]

4 hours ago, smotheredrun said:

So.......  use the current versions with your "B" Team guys.... They may not survive the ascent, let alone descent and return.

So it's realistic?

[smotheredrun]

Lol

[sp1989]

I hate to be that guy but...... any recent developments on this? 

[Raptor22]

@sp1989 You're not alone. It's been ages since Helldiver, Nazari, or Avalon have replied.

But seriously, are any of the mod devs still here?

Ground control to major @helldiver! Ground control to major @helldiver! Take your energy drink and put your headphones on!

@Nazari1382? What's going on?

@Avalon304? Any status?

Can anyone involved with the development of this mod give us any status? I don't care about an ETA. I just want to know if work is being done, or if there's IRL stuff getting in the way, or if they've just given up. If you are unable to do it, would you be able to pass it off to someone who can?

[Nazari1382]

8 hours ago, Raptor22 said:

 

@Nazari1382? What's going on?

@Avalon304? Any status?

Can anyone involved with the development of this mod give us any status? I don't care about an ETA. I just want to know if work is being done, or if there's IRL stuff getting in the way, or if they've just given up. If you are unable to do it, would you be able to pass it off to someone who can?

 

PM me gamebreaking issues you are running into, and I will take a look. The existing shuttles were supposed to become legacy parts, but we have no idea when the new shuttle helldiver was working on will be finished, because he is busy with real life. I barely play KSP but my intent is to keep the parts useable.

[sp1989]

On 2/27/2017 at 0:31 AM, Nazari1382 said:

PM me gamebreaking issues you are running into, and I will take a look. The existing shuttles were supposed to become legacy parts, but we have no idea when the new shuttle helldiver was working on will be finished, because he is busy with real life. I barely play KSP but my intent is to keep the parts useable.

There is a third shuttle being made?! Wow! I understand it's not coming soon but still that's cool. My interest in the whole pack was always the beautiful station parts. Anyway take your time I was just wondering if this was still being maintained and updated because it's just one of those glorius packs that would be a shame to die. But such is life with ksp. Thank you guys.

[Vanamonde]

Some posts have been trimmed from this thread. 

Modders are volunteers who work at their own pace, and they do not owe anyone explanations or timetables. 

[Spire]

11 hours ago, sp1989 said:

There is a third shuttle being made?! Wow! I understand it's not coming soon but still that's cool. My interest in the whole pack was always the beautiful station parts. Anyway take your time I was just wondering if this was still being maintained and updated because it's just one of those glorius packs that would be a shame to die. But such is life with ksp. Thank you guys.

The third shuttle is a lot of posts back, but I'll put it in an edit, the 3rd shuttle is meant to replace the dauntless, yet its the biggest of them all. EDIT:

 

Edited March 1, 2017 by HawkedUpSpace

[sp1989]

10 hours ago, HawkedUpSpace said:

The third shuttle is a lot of posts back, but I'll put it in an edit, the 3rd shuttle is meant to replace the dauntless, yet its the biggest of them all. EDIT:

 

Woah!!! Ok now I'm excited!! Will the other shuttles be maintained? I mean I understand they won't be part of the pack but they are too beautiful to just discard. Also the station parts will still be part if the pack? 

[Raptor22]

Sorry about those long posts. 

I understand that you have to fit this in in your own time, and that it's not a commitment. It'd be nice to hear from you guys once in a while, letting us know what's going on. Perhaps you bring some new people onto the team to help out - people with more free time. It's sad to see this mod get left in the dust.

I would help, but sadly I can really only fiddle with config files, changing a couple values here and there, so I wouldn't be much help.

Anyways, I do have a few questions, things to report, and suggestions. Take them as you will.

Firstly, what made you guys decide to make the original two shuttles legacy parts? I don't get why they'd need to be phased out. I mean, then you'd have a full fleet. Is it because it's a pain to maintain, or is it because of another reason? I saw that in the SpaceDock page, for the original KSO shuttle, it says that it'll be retired soon. 

By the way, for that shuttle, on the SpaceDock page, it says that it's the Dauntless, but in the game it shows it as the Resolute. I looked through the mod files and it's there as well. Perhaps you can dig through some of the old textures and replace it (or even better, re-implement the texture switch. I really miss that feature).

I think I saw something about allowing custom names for the EX. Will that be added to the other two shuttles, kept just for the EX, or simply scrapped? I haven't seen anything like that, and it seems like a daunting task to come up with an entire plugin. Perhaps you can have it like the old way, where you'd post a blank shuttle and let people add their own names, using the creation kit. 

 

Also, I have an idea for something to add to the EX. Since it's supposed to be the all-new, high-tech, next-generation shuttle, perhaps you can add a robotic manipulator arm, custom made for it. I have tried using parts along with Infernal Robotics, but it just looks ugly. An arm in the KSO style would be nice.

While on the topic of Infernal Robotics, I'm not sure if you'll be able to use it, since it still hasn't been updated since 1.1.2. I don't know if the plugins for @RoverDude's Konstruction pack will work. I know that they have servos in there.

Seeing what you have done in the past, I'm sure that you'll be able to find a way to make it work. I think that having an arm would be a nice touch. Since the shuttle is both high-tech and a complete overhaul of the previous designs (single-tail and protruding OMS pods, etc.), it should have another unique touch. Besides, capturing or releasing things won't be like docking and undocking, and more like the actual space shuttle (which is what I think you're aiming at), and potentially less frustrating (such as when you forget to add RCS thrusters to your payload, and then have to move the entire shuttle around and dock).

I wish you guys the best of luck, and hope that you find the time to be able to work on this.

It's one of my favorite mods, and I'd hate for you to have to abandon it to rust in the boneyard of closed mods.

[smotheredrun]

1 hour ago, Raptor22 said:

*snip* Asked questions

I know I can answer some of those questions. Hang tight.  i need to be in my office at home to do that. My phone doesn't like anything Internet.

In a few hrs

[smotheredrun]

@Raptor22

The KSOS mod is not abandoned....  That much I know.

 

Regarding the Dauntless/Resolute thing:  They are one in the same.  See below.

 

Regarding shuttle naming:   As you mentioned, a long while ago you could swap shuttle names/rename/have different textures each with unique names.  I believe it may have been part of a firespitter thing? - a long time ago.  I asked almost verbatim what you just asked a few pages (5 or 10 back maybe? - search bar is your friend - even got a config tweak to make texture-switching possible), the response was that anyone who previously had other textures was free to share them.  To date, no joy on that. Maybe dig through the 0.90 KSO thread?

There is at least one mod that lets you make custom decals in various sizes that you could use to cover up the Resolute/Ascension names with some of your own.  I believe it is called Decals.....  You can do a forum search for Nebula Decals.... that will get you started.  I am trying (and failing miserably  ) to make my own decals with said mod.... and have discovered I need to dig out my old text books for Corel Draw/other old software I have.  Not a reflection on the mod, but on my skills (or lack thereof) with making layered pictures.

 

Robotic Arms:  Cool!  There are a few mods (Kanadarm for one) that do this exact thing.  I have made a few IR arms with the "retextured" pack and they look cool.  Unfortunately, I don't use IR in any of my "good" saves as parts are doing goofy things (ie flipping 180 degrees on vessel load or switch), it is in Dev still, so that's ok, I can wait.  Also, docking parts with robotic arms is REALLY tedious.

Have you tried Konstruction with the KSO?  Give it a go and see what happens.  If you make something you like, take some screenshots and share them!  I for one would like to see them!

 

Remember, good things come to those who wait.

[Raptor22]

Thanks. I'll check that out later.

There is a texture switch config, but they never said where to put it, and thus it didn't work.

also, the kanadarm is too large even for the super25, and I can't find a good place to put it even if I scale it down.

[smotheredrun]

Texture switch config would go anywhere in game data folder. for the sake of organization,  you could place it in your KSO folder.  That said, you need actual shuttle textures that have different names for it to work.

Have you tried any IR rework parts? There are some small parts, and you can scsle them

Edited March 7, 2017 by smotheredrun
Massive typos.... time for a new phone?

[MarethyuGamer]

Any updates regarding the new shuttle or the mod being updated?

[Bomoo]

7 hours ago, MarethyuGamer said:

Any updates regarding the new shuttle or the mod being updated?

Scrolling back a page or two should answer your question. To the best of my knowledge, news and updates for this project are not posted anywhere else.

[MarethyuGamer]

13 hours ago, Bomoo said:

Scrolling back a page or two should answer your question. To the best of my knowledge, news and updates for this project are not posted anywhere else.

I scrolled, and I've read what they say. I meant to ask if anyone knows something more recent than two-three weeks ago, and nudge the devs to maybe release some new info. However if there aren't any updates elsewhere, and devs don't reply, I guess that is an answer to my question.

[smotheredrun]

Nothing new from the couple of us testing them.  I am trying to track down a visual  (maybe?) bug with the wing control surfaces on both orbiters - upon ET separation, the roll and pitch controls get visually swapped (Dauntless) or just don't reflect the inputs of the user (Super 25). They both still fly (the test versions) so not like it's a game breaker. 

The Dauntless' issue can be band-aided in orbit by sliding the two control authority controls to opposite ends.  A (hacky) solution, but if someone has a way of making it never happen, even better.

One thing I'd like to do, school permitting, is go through the part files to get some of them to appear in the new categories in the VAB. Low on the list though....

[shdwlrd]

I've forgotten about this gem. I've haven't used KSOS since the .90 days. I would like to give it another go. Is the version 4.4 the most current version, or are there updated patches floating around somewhere?

[smotheredrun]

The ones from spacedock are the most current.  There is a small group of us with some patches that make the orbiters "mostly work" in 1.2.x.  Nazari (mod maintainer) has those too.  The big thing to figure out right now (I think) is the best way to maintain shuttle stability on ascent.  For the most part, they're both mostly stable.  Sometimes having the booster's gimbals switch off and on at different parts of ascent via action groups sometimes helps.  Landings are vastly improved, especially dependent on user skill though.

Orbital maneuvering, well it's fairly par for the course when compared to other vehicles with off set thrust....

[shdwlrd]

On ‎3‎/‎23‎/‎2017 at 4:29 PM, smotheredrun said:

The ones from spacedock are the most current.  There is a small group of us with some patches that make the orbiters "mostly work" in 1.2.x.  Nazari (mod maintainer) has those too.  

Thanks for the info, good to know. I was worried about the landing gear. After looking at the cfgs, the landing gear seem to be on par with Squad's. Most of the other things needed for 1.2.x I'll just hack together a MM patch.

On ‎3‎/‎23‎/‎2017 at 4:29 PM, smotheredrun said:

The big thing to figure out right now (I think) is the best way to maintain shuttle stability on ascent.  For the most part, they're both mostly stable.  Sometimes having the booster's gimbals switch off and on at different parts of ascent via action groups sometimes helps.  Landings are vastly improved, especially dependent on user skill though.

I'll try it with the latest dev release for MJ and TCA. I've had good luck with one or both getting my self created shuttles into orbit. For the landings, I'll try PA after re-entry. I'm ok at flying and suck at landings by hand. I'm lucky if I can land crafts on target and in one piece.

On ‎3‎/‎23‎/‎2017 at 4:29 PM, smotheredrun said:

Orbital maneuvering, well it's fairly par for the course when compared to other vehicles with off set thrust....

I definitely remember that. I use to use a pair of small engines inline to the com and an extra sas unit to help with the orbital maneuvers. Something I still do with some of my crafts today.

Edited March 25, 2017 by shdwlrd

[smotheredrun]

1 hour ago, shdwlrd said:

 

I definitely remember that. I use to use a pair of small engines inline to the com and an extra sas unit to help with the orbital maneuvers. Something I still do with some of my crafts today.

Yeah.  I usually bury a small inline RW at the back  of the cargo bay and clip it back into the body, just enough that you can see it but don't loose much in the way of usable payload space.

[NISSKEPCSIM]

My Space Centre Vehicles wheels don't have any friction with the surface. They can't move at all. It's no big deal, as I have different wheels that are the same size, but I was disappointed when I put one of the cars I needed to photograph a scene in my novel, 'Kontakt,' on the runway, and it didn't move.