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[1.9.x] QuizTech Aero Pack Continued

linuxgurugamer

By linuxgurugamer
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Non-Newtonian

Non-Newtonian

Posted
Posted
On 13 February 2017 at 2:46 PM, Quiznos323 said:

Here is the Blend file for anyone who want to try and monkey with it. I'll warn you, I took a quick look at it and it's really messy and unorganized, but if someone wants to put in the time that I don't have, by all means:

K-35B.blend

That was a fun craft to build :)

I must say that it is of superb quality.

Thank you for creating this content for us all to enjoy. 

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TMasterson5

TMasterson5

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Quiznos323 said:

I'll chime in here. When I last looked at the .blend, the nozzle itself was rotated slightly off center from the world grid. For it to be fixed, the animation is likely going to have to be redone.

Good to know thanks for the insight!

4 hours ago, Svm420 said:

@TMasterson5

If at all possible it would benefit recreation if the nozzle had a second animation for a  45* setting as the real F35 engine sets at 45* for short takeoffs.

Im gonna work on just fixing it first :P 

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linuxgurugamer

linuxgurugamer

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1 hour ago, linuxgurugamer said:

I see it, will get it added this evening.

Thank you!!!!!

Made some time, here is a test release, please let me know how it is:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8e5xdlld7kzejc1/QuizTechAeroPackContinued-1.3.8.zip?dl=0

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TMasterson5

TMasterson5

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Svm420 said:

Can't wait, thanks again!

@TMasterson5

Do you think a second 45* animation is possible?

possible yes, but I dont have the time to do it right now sorry

2 hours ago, linuxgurugamer said:

I see it, will get it added this evening.

Thank you!!!!!

here for you sir

43 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Made some time, here is a test release, please let me know how it is:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8e5xdlld7kzejc1/QuizTechAeroPackContinued-1.3.8.zip?dl=0

youre more than welcome man! Thanks for continuing this mod :)

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linuxgurugamer

linuxgurugamer

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Posted
42 minutes ago, Svm420 said:

@TMasterson5@linuxgurugamer

I am not sure what happened but upon loading the new test DL the engine has the wrong model. It has the Mk1 lift fan model, aka the cyclone. Fresh install with just the mod as packaged...

 

I realized I made a mistake a little while ago, I'll fix it in an hour.  Which is why I said it was a test release 

Thanks

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Svm420

Svm420

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

I realized I made a mistake a little while ago, I'll fix it in an hour.  Which is why I said it was a test release 

Thanks

 

No worries just not a usual problem so kinda surprised me. I do appreciate everything you both are doing. Thanks!

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linuxgurugamer

linuxgurugamer

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Posted
4 minutes ago, Elite-Steel said:

Question.  Im still pretty new to PC gaming, so im not sure of the correct procedure for updating mods.  Are you supposed to delete the mod in the game data folder and replace it with the new download, or what?  any help is greatly appreciate it.

If you are installing by hand, that's usually the best thing to do.

Personally, I use and support CKAN, which takes care of it for me

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  • 2 weeks later...
eberkain

eberkain

Posted
Posted

Just a heads up.  FAR isn't released yet but loading this and the dev version throws a number of errors about missing modules.  

[LOG 05:16:03.851] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/K-10/K-10/quizTechMk1K10Cockpit'
[ERR 05:16:03.854] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARControlSys'

[LOG 05:16:03.873] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/K-10/K-10/quizTechMk1K10Cockpit' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:03.881] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'quizTechMk1K10Cockpit'
[LOG 05:16:03.900] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/Mk1_Eagle/eagle/quizTechMk1EagleCockpit'
[ERR 05:16:03.904] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARControlSys'

[ERR 05:16:03.907] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARBasicDragModel'

[LOG 05:16:03.925] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/Mk1_Eagle/eagle/quizTechMk1EagleCockpit' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:03.933] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'quizTechMk1EagleCockpit'
[LOG 05:16:03.951] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/Mk2ProbeNose/Mk2NoseProbe/mk2ProbeNose'
[ERR 05:16:03.956] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARControlSys'

[LOG 05:16:03.969] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/Mk2ProbeNose/Mk2NoseProbe/mk2ProbeNose' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:03.974] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'mk2ProbeNose'
[LOG 05:16:03.996] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/Mk2_Thunderbolt/thunderbolt/quizTechMk2ThunderboltCockpit'
[ERR 05:16:04.000] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARControlSys'

[ERR 05:16:04.002] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARBasicDragModel'

[LOG 05:16:04.020] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Command/Mk2_Thunderbolt/thunderbolt/quizTechMk2ThunderboltCockpit' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:04.028] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'quizTechMk2ThunderboltCockpit'
[LOG 05:16:04.049] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2TwinTurboJet/Mk2TwinTurboJet/Mk2TwinTurboJet'
[LOG 05:16:04.073] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2TwinTurboJet/Mk2TwinTurboJet/Mk2TwinTurboJet' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:04.081] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'Mk2TwinTurboJet'
[LOG 05:16:04.106] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2TwinTurboJet/Mk2TwinTurboJetAB/Mk2TwinTurboJetAB'
[LOG 05:16:04.130] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2TwinTurboJet/Mk2TwinTurboJetAB/Mk2TwinTurboJetAB' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:04.140] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'Mk2TwinTurboJetAB'
[LOG 05:16:04.178] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2vtol/cyclone/cyclone'
[ERR 05:16:04.188] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARBasicDragModel'

[LOG 05:16:04.202] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2vtol/cyclone/cyclone' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:04.209] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'cyclone'
[LOG 05:16:04.238] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2vtol/k35B/K-35B'
[LOG 05:16:04.259] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2vtol/k35B/K-35B' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:04.266] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'K-35B'
[LOG 05:16:04.307] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2vtol/KFAN/KFAN'
[ERR 05:16:04.317] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'FARBasicDragModel'

[LOG 05:16:04.332] PartLoader: Part 'QuizTechAeroContinued/Parts/Engine/Mk2vtol/KFAN/KFAN' has no database record. Creating.
[LOG 05:16:04.339] DragCubeSystem: Creating drag cubes for part 'KFAN'

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
Daniel Prates

Daniel Prates

Posted
Posted (edited)

@linuxgurugamer, There is something strange with that intake RCS part, intnended  to guide planes through the atmosphere (as the part info say). 

So it's description states that it comsumes intakeair. I follow.  It is supposed to be redirecting air, in RCS fashion. The idea is great - it allows you to stabilize a jumpjet or other VTOL or even STOL craft, somethig which is always tricky. Having it controlled by the RCS system really simplifies guidance. And it is realistic too - to my knowledge the Harrier did just that through a series of well-placed ports, only, redirecting exaust instead of the air intake. 

The problem is... as far as I could see, it generates thrust in impossible situations -  even if the aircraft is stopped in the ground, without any engines working, and without consuming no EC or anything. 

Intake is merelly the air passing through the  maw of the airplane. It may be sucked in if the air-breathing engine is turned on, or it may be being pushed inside by atmospheric pressure if the airplane is moving through the air (more speed, more of it is pushed in). But if the vessel is completelly stopped at the runway, engines turned off.... there can be no intake. And still the part can thrust like hell - and pretty strongly too. A few of them can take a several-tons beast of the ground.

My point is, intakes in the game generate the 'air intake' resource even if stopped, but that should be understood only as a game convention. To my knowledge the game generates 'intake air resorce' all of the time because, in most situations, it makes no difference - or maybe, because it presumes that there is an engine there sucking it all of the time, so hence it is being generated all that time too. The paradox rises when you build a vessel that is nothing except a command pod and an intake, just standing there like a rock, and the generated 'intake' is nevertheless abundant.  To me that proves that the consumable provided in the part tooltip is just a game convention. It shouldn't indeed be producing anything usable in a stopped, engines off situation.

And still, the Quizteck intake thruster generates, all by itself, a lot of thrust. A third possibility, if we want it to make sense, is this part having it's own built-in 'fans' or turbines or something, which is acceptable in principle, but then it should be consuming something - EC, for instance! 

For the sake of realism, this should be tweaked, I think. Otherwise the part is merelly "motto perpetuum", something quite strange in a phisics-based game! 

Lastly, me b#%tches only because me cares! This is an excellent mod and this minor adjustment should deserve some meditation, me thinks.

Congrats on an excellent mod! 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Daniel Prates
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XOC2008

XOC2008

Posted
Posted

I only ever turned those on when the engines were on, thus simulating the thrust coming from what the engine was pulling in and redirecting to those ports. The easy solution, rather than rewriting the cfg, is to just turn off the RCS when you're not moving. :)

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linuxgurugamer

linuxgurugamer

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Posted (edited)
On 3/6/2017 at 3:09 PM, Daniel Prates said:

@linuxgurugamer, There is something strange with that intake RCS part, intnended  to guide planes through the atmosphere (as the part info say). 

So it's description states that it comsumes intakeair. I follow.  It is supposed to be redirecting air, in RCS fashion. The idea is great - it allows you to stabilize a jumpjet or other VTOL or even STOL craft, somethig which is always tricky. Having it controlled by the RCS system really simplifies guidance. And it is realistic too - to my knowledge the Harrier did just that through a series of well-placed ports, only, redirecting exaust instead of the air intake. 

The problem is... as far as I could see, it generates thrust in impossible situations -  even if the aircraft is stopped in the ground, without any engines working, and without consuming no EC or anything. 

Intake is merelly the air passing through the  maw of the airplane. It may be sucked in if the air-breathing engine is turned on, or it may be being pushed inside by atmospheric pressure if the airplane is moving through the air (more speed, more of it is pushed in). But if the vessel is completelly stopped at the runway, engines turned off.... there can be no intake. And still the part can thrust like hell - and pretty strongly too. A few of them can take a several-tons beast of the ground.

My point is, intakes in the game generate the 'air intake' resource even if stopped, but that should be understood only as a game convention. To my knowledge the game generates 'intake air resorce' all of the time because, in most situations, it makes no difference - or maybe, because it presumes that there is an engine there sucking it all of the time, so hence it is being generated all that time too. The paradox rises when you build a vessel that is nothing except a command pod and an intake, just standing there like a rock, and the generated 'intake' is nevertheless abundant.  To me that proves that the consumable provided in the part tooltip is just a game convention. It shouldn't indeed be producing anything usable in a stopped, engines off situation.

And still, the Quizteck intake thruster generates, all by itself, a lot of thrust. A third possibility, if we want it to make sense, is this part having it's own built-in 'fans' or turbines or something, which is acceptable in principle, but then it should be consuming something - EC, for instance! 

For the sake of realism, this should be tweaked, I think. Otherwise the part is merelly "motto perpetuum", something quite strange in a phisics-based game! 

Lastly, me b#%tches only because me cares! This is an excellent mod and this minor adjustment should deserve some meditation, me thinks.

Congrats on an excellent mod! 

 

On 3/6/2017 at 4:05 PM, XOC2008 said:

I only ever turned those on when the engines were on, thus simulating the thrust coming from what the engine was pulling in and redirecting to those ports. The easy solution, rather than rewriting the cfg, is to just turn off the RCS when you're not moving. :)

 

I took a look at this.

First, I found a small problem in the config, there are two entries for ModuleRCS, I'm fixing that, but it's not significant. I also found that it was looking for a missing module, "AnimatedRCS", I'll fix and release that soon

Second. to make this work only when the engines are running, I'd have to write a new module.  This isn't a simple config change, this needs some code behind it.  So it's not going to happen right away, sorry

Edited by linuxgurugamer
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StahnAileron

StahnAileron

Posted
Posted
On ‎3‎/‎8‎/‎2017 at 4:56 AM, linuxgurugamer said:

Second. to make this work only when the engines are running, I'd have to write a new module.  This isn't a simple config change, this needs some code behind it.  So it's not going to happen right away, sorry

If I recall, I do believe at one point there was talk in the original thread about possibly making the RCS jets use EC for balancing. I actually favor that for the simplicity and the fact that many jets/air-breathing engines include an alternator for EC generation. In theory you could only use those RCS jets extensive with engines running (EC generation) and/or lots of batteries. The idea was initially floated for the same reason @Daniel Prates outlined. (Makes no sense for IntakeAir to be the only input.)

I know RoverDude's Electric Ducted Fans have RCS jets that use EC and IntakeAtm. Doing the same for the QuizTech RCS jets would allow you to use them in any atmosphere (they currently use IntakeAir, which may or may not restrict them to Kerbin and Laythe; they don't check for oxygen, so I can't say for sure) and prevent you from having to bother with a new module.

The only other option I can think of would be to make them use another resource (BleedAir?) and patch jet engines to produce that like they do EC (scaled to throttle/thrust). However, patching engines to generate a new resource for one part is overkill, IMHO.

*Quick Google Search Later*

Ahaha! Seems I was the one to even bring all that up originally:

 

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Daniel Prates

Daniel Prates

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, StahnAileron said:

If I recall, I do believe at one point there was talk in the original thread about possibly making the RCS jets use EC for balancing. I actually favor that for the simplicity and the fact that many jets/air-breathing engines include an alternator for EC generation. In theory you could only use those RCS jets extensive with engines running (EC generation) and/or lots of batteries. The idea was initially floated for the same reason @Daniel Prates outlined. (Makes no sense for IntakeAir to be the only input.)

I know RoverDude's Electric Ducted Fans have RCS jets that use EC and IntakeAtm. Doing the same for the QuizTech RCS jets would allow you to use them in any atmosphere (they currently use IntakeAir, which may or may not restrict them to Kerbin and Laythe; they don't check for oxygen, so I can't say for sure) and prevent you from having to bother with a new module.

The only other option I can think of would be to make them use another resource (BleedAir?) and patch jet engines to produce that like they do EC (scaled to throttle/thrust). However, patching engines to generate a new resource for one part is overkill, IMHO.

*Quick Google Search Later*

Ahaha! Seems I was the one to even bring all that up originally:

 

My point exactelly, everything is overkill compared to simply making it bleed EC during use. Its just a single part anyway. The only problem is having such a powerful part, that gulps on nothing! 

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