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Kerbal Joint Reinforcement - Next

Rudolf Meier

By Rudolf Meier
in KSP1 Mod Releases

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  • 3 weeks later...
MarcAlain

MarcAlain

Posted
Posted

I've experienced a kraken style event on a space station around Kerbin. I can prevent it from happening by un-installing KJR. No other mod removals seem to impact this issue.

 

This is a very long term sandbox save, with hundreds of missions and many landings, bases, and stations around the Kerbol System.

 

What I don't understand is why I've never had this issue before.

 

Is anyone else having any KJR next related issues?

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
Jognt

Jognt

Posted
Posted
On 12/4/2019 at 9:08 PM, MarcAlain said:

I've experienced a kraken style event on a space station around Kerbin. I can prevent it from happening by un-installing KJR. No other mod removals seem to impact this issue.

 

This is a very long term sandbox save, with hundreds of missions and many landings, bases, and stations around the Kerbol System.

 

What I don't understand is why I've never had this issue before.

 

Is anyone else having any KJR next related issues?

 

For what it’s worth: I use KJRc in 1.7.3 after several instances of KJRn bugging out while supposedly working fine for ‘everyone else’.

 

 

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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Jognt said:

For what it’s worth: I use KJRc in 1.7.3 after several instances of KJRn bugging out while supposedly working fine for ‘everyone else’.

Well, so good thing you have a choice and both are available for use. Just imagine how it would be if you were forced to use KJRn or not use at all? ;)

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Jognt

Jognt

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Posted
3 hours ago, Lisias said:

Well, so good thing you have a choice and both are available for use. Just imagine how it would be if you were forced to use KJRn or not use at all? ;)

Then I would just write my own mod or settle for a simple MM patch. My point mainly being that the “There are no reported problems.” response when someone is actually reporting a problem isn’t helping. 

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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Jognt said:

Then I would just write my own mod or settle for a simple MM patch. My point mainly being that the “There are no reported problems.” response when someone is actually reporting a problem isn’t helping. 

Problem is.... That's true! I still didn't found a problem with KJRn. I have some with IRn, I had some performance problems with KJRc, but until the moment, I have nothing to report about KJRn.

Since you are able to write Add'Ons, why not try to narrow the source of the problem on your machine? You are in the best position to do so, as the problem is happening on your instalment and it's easily reproducible by you.

What's really unhelpful are statements about how things allegedly are not working without information about how to reproduce the problem, so people could narrow down the search for reasons.

-- POST EDIT --

So, to make things absolutely clear, KJRn is working flawlessly on KSP 1.8.1. on a Mac Potato 6,2.  O just tested the latest 4.1.5 release. 

I made this thing weighting 1.960.47 tons, shoved 8 Launch Clamps on it, and launched. The thing is so heavy that the clamps bounced a bit, but didn't failed on me.

screenshot49.jpg

You can click on the image for more screenshots.

Edited by Lisias
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Jognt

Jognt

Posted
Posted

@Lisias Thank you for double/triple checking. Note that I’m not the person that is having issues with launch clamps and KJRn. I’m the passerby that recommended checking out KJRc to the person that is having this problem. 

My point isn’t that there’s flaws in any mod, my point is that “Not seeing this issue, could you post your log please?” is better than “There are no issues reported.”

It’s not our job to do tech support (or well, not here anyway), but it is just.. being kind to see if we can help people figure out what is causing the issue they are reporting. After all, they are reporting an issue and it wouldn’t be the first time that a bug in KJRn was found only when looking further. (Debug vs regular version anyone? ;) )

ps. My apologies if my post sounded grumpy. I don’t do well in Christmas crowds. 

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kcs123

kcs123

Posted
Posted (edited)

Well, the thing is that, whenever somone reported that he have issue and asked that he provide logs, reproducing steps etc. There is no second response after that to help him to narrow down issue. I have no doubt that people have problems with KJRn, but I can only guess what can be root of issues. It can be bad install, strange interaction with some other mod, can be specific part from some mod or certain craft designs.

But how to help anyone when there is no response on any additional question that can help to narrow down issue ? I was having issue with early version of KJRn that was happening only on my machine and Rudolf was unable to reproduce bug on his side. But, with cooperation from testing KJRn on my machine and additional changes/logging in KJRn we have narrowed down issue and it is solved for all newer KJRn since that one.

Can only say that Rudolf is very supportive to help you solving issues that you may have, but also any user who ask for support have to also give some amount of cooperation so that developer can help him and possibly any other user with same problems. Saying only that KJRn is not working without any additional info is useless to any developer. There is dedicated post how to ask for help for a reason:

 

Edited by kcs123
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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, Jognt said:

My point isn’t that there’s flaws in any mod, my point is that “Not seeing this issue, could you post your log please?” is better than “There are no issues reported.”

Communication mismanagement. :P

Historically, KJR (both of them), on the very few times I saw something broken, it was about some idiosyncrasy on a intercaction between parts (or modules). These two things don't change anything on KSP itself, they act on a lower level, on Unity's guts. So things usually works fine, of completely blows up into the skies, no middle ground.

Empirically, and for now, I concluded that stock handles well things with 200 to 300 hundred tons, but this widely depends of your rig.

Since KJR* essentially are auto-struts with steroids,  and auto-struts costs CPU, KJR* costs more CPU - and Potato machines start to choke with them - and I suspect this is the root cause of a good part of the issues around here.

And it's the reason I used TweakScale on my tests to keep the part count low.

 

11 hours ago, Jognt said:

ps. My apologies if my post sounded grumpy. I don’t do well in Christmas crowds. 

The grumpyness is the natural state of the intelligent mind. believe me, I know - The Grumpyness is strong on my family, :P

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Jognt

Jognt

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Lisias said:

Communication mismanagement. :P

Historically, KJR (both of them), on the very few times I saw something broken, it was about some idiosyncrasy on a intercaction between parts (or modules). These two things don't change anything on KSP itself, they act on a lower level, on Unity's guts. So things usually works fine, of completely blows up into the skies, no middle ground.

Empirically, and for now, I concluded that stock handles well things with 200 to 300 hundred tons, but this widely depends of your rig.

Since KJR* essentially are auto-struts with steroids,  and auto-struts costs CPU, KJR* costs more CPU - and Potato machines start to choke with them - and I suspect this is the root cause of a good part of the issues around here.

And it's the reason I used TweakScale on my tests to keep the part count low.

 

The grumpyness is the natural state of the intelligent mind. believe me, I know - The Grumpyness is strong on my family, :P

Solid points. So one of the things people experiencing issues could try is to test with fewer parts to see whether that plays a factor?

@Autolyzed Yeast Extract worth a try I guess? :) if not, uploading your log file would help a lot in finding the cause. :)

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kcs123

kcs123

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Probus said:

I have a longish campaign save in which one of my craft has picked up a case of the wiggles.  I’ve not installed any joint reinforcement mods.  Do you think this would work mid game?

KJR* is not depended on prebuilding craft in SPH/VAB like mods with parts. So, yes, it is safe to install/uninstall KJR in the middle of playtrough, it will not going to break saved games. Make a backup just to be safe if KJR does not help in your case or if it introduce even stranger behaviour.

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Krzeszny

Krzeszny

Posted
Posted (edited)

If you're interested in how the 2 KJR version compare with each other:

KJR Next lowers my framerate by 3%

KJR Continued lowers my framerate by 5%

Tested with: pre-built FAR Shuttle 'Montauk', 172 parts.

Edited by Krzeszny
grammar
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kcs123

kcs123

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Krzeszny said:

If you're interested in how the 2 KJR version compare to each other:

KJR Next lowers my framerate by 3%
KJR Continued lowers my framerate by 5%
Tested with: pre-built FAR Shuttle 'Montauk', 172 parts.

It depends a lot on someone hardware. High end machines would not notice too much difference. Difference in performannce is much more noticable on weaker hardware and on more complex scene - crafts with high part counts and multiple crafts in close proximity at same time, like when you aproach space station to dock at, for example.

But, yes, people got choice to use anything that works better for them.

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