Your wishes for KSP 2? (Thread Revival)

[Immashift]

Originally I replied to a thread with this title, but didn't realize I'd necro'd it. So a kind mod moved it to a new thread before I realized my mistake.

Nevertheless, anyone else have wishes for KSP 2? Anything goes.

I'm aware there's another thread with current replies for this topic as well. I didn't mean to take anything from that thread or its creator, and my apologies this turned into a thread dupe. Any mod can merge (if possible), or just delete this one and I'll post in that one. 

 

Here's my initial post:

More interactive science, long term habitation.

Full ISRU systems, no magic tin cans that do everything.

Full life support, using ISRU functions that make sense.

AMP HOURS. EC is a stupid resource. Tell me how many amps my modules take, how many my panels produce and how many A/h my batteries have. Make it realistic.

Easier resource transfer micromanagement and automation. Doing my 75th refuel run up to my fuel hub space station is boring. Why not give me a tool to automate deliveries? Take the funds, take time to construct, time to launch, and do it completely automatically. Extra points if the system uses a ship I design and actually launches it and puts it in space, then autodocks it while I'm doing other stuff. I want to amazon order a can of oxygen up to my KSS. It's not that I can't do it myself. It's just I've launched that specific vehicle about a hundred times for simple haulage purposes and it gets boring. It trivializes LKO stuff, sure, but once I'm routinely messing with stuff around Jool or Duna, it's sort of a given that I can shove X tonnes of stuff into LKO with vehicle Y. Extra extra points if I can summon that vehicle to a particular SOI, and, with correct computer tech progression and sufficient supplies, mission control can guide that vehicle to me eventually.

 

I did a venture once back before 1.0 where I did a grand tour with two ships to every planet and moon (outer planets mod), landed on everything feasibly, and burned the two ships almost simultaneously every time. It was fun to have two sister ships. One entirely crew focused, and one entirely automated and surface base oriented. I'd land all my surface base units, then the crew, and then spend some time gaining life support resources for the journey to continue. Anything to make that venture easier would make me want to do it again. Along with random failures mods, it was the most fun I've had in KSP. Equipment had to be well designed, and last for decades against random and cumulative failures. So yeah, tools for that.

Edited February 8, 2020 by Immashift

[Vanamonde]

@Immashift, I have moved your post to its own thread in the KSP2 sub since that other thread is obsolete now. Feel free to edit the title if you wish. 

[mcwaffles2003]

19 hours ago, Immashift said:

More interactive science, long term habitation.

have you tried the science mechanism of kerbalism 3.0?

19 hours ago, Immashift said:

AMP HOURS. EC is a stupid resource. Tell me how many amps my modules take, how many my panels produce and how many A/h my batteries have. Make it realistic.

Also, I realize I am nitpicking here, but with mods as they are producing power in watts, I think Wh would be more prudent as Ah requires you know the voltage at which the charge is being stores and I've never seen the unit of a volt in the game

19 hours ago, Immashift said:

Easier resource transfer micromanagement and automation. Doing my 75th refuel run up to my fuel hub space station is boring. Why not give me a tool to automate deliveries? Take the funds, take time to construct, time to launch, and do it completely automatically. Extra points if the system uses a ship I design and actually launches it and puts it in space, then autodocks it while I'm doing other stuff. I want to amazon order a can of oxygen up to my KSS. It's not that I can't do it myself. It's just I've launched that specific vehicle about a hundred times for simple haulage purposes and it gets boring. It trivializes LKO stuff, sure, but once I'm routinely messing with stuff around Jool or Duna, it's sort of a given that I can shove X tonnes of stuff into LKO with vehicle Y. Extra extra points if I can summon that vehicle to a particular SOI, and, with correct computer tech progression and sufficient supplies, mission control can guide that vehicle to me eventually.

I've been thinking about this a while as I think in KSP 2 resource transfer will become much prevalent and I dont think any of us want this to become Kerbal Space Trucker. Maybe after running 1 haul with a payload of X mass that trip could be recreated automatically every time the same launch window appears 

Edited February 4, 2020 by mcwaffles2003

[Immashift]

6 hours ago, Vanamonde said:

@Immashift, I have moved your post to its own thread in the KSP2 sub since that other thread is obsolete now. Feel free to edit the title if you wish. 

My bad. Didn't mean to necro. Feel free to delete the thread if it fizzles.

[Immashift]

6 hours ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

have you tried the science mechanism of kerbalism 3.0?

Also, I realize I am nitpicking here, but with mods as they are producing power in watts, I think Wh would be more prudent as Ah requires you know the voltage at which the charge is being stores and I've never seen the unit of a volt in the game

I've been thinking about this a while as I think in KSP 2 resource transfer will become much prevalent and I dont think any of us want this to become Kerbal Space Trucker. Maybe after running 1 haul with a payload of X mass that trip could be recreated automatically every time the same launch window appears 

I haven't tried Kerbalism since its early days. When I first tried it, it did some weirdness on high timewarps and ended up killing one of my kerbals, so I promptly uninstalled it. I suppose I've gotta try it again.

I realized that after the fact. Voltage might be fun to designate though I suppose - might even be fun to have different tiers of vessel electronics. But I imagine it would get a bit messy. Wh is fine but a little more vague. I'd just like to see a realistic power unit that isn't EC. EC transfers near instantly between components, batteries don't need to be heated, etc. I'd like a more in-depth power system. 

I would imagine if it becomes that prevalent there'd be some form of automated resource transfer / harvesting. I do enjoy micromanaging resources to an extent. But you're right, eventually it gets grindy and repetitive enough I want to cheat things into orbit just for supply runs once I know I can do it for real.

Edited February 5, 2020 by Immashift

[Clockwork13]

A proper API for modders.

[mcwaffles2003]

5 hours ago, Immashift said:

I haven't tried Kerbalism since its early days. When I first tried it, it did some weirdness on high timewarps and ended up killing one of my kerbals, so I promptly uninstalled it. I suppose I've gotta try it again.

The maker has made a science only version which un-includes life support mechanics and all the rest of the features of the mod other than science

https://github.com/Kerbalism/Kerbalism/wiki

Science

Experiments don't return their science output instantly, they require some time to run. Some complete in minutes, others will take months. Not to worry, experiments can run on vessels in the background, you don't have to keep that vessel loaded.

There are two different kinds of experiments: sensor readings and samples. Sensor readings are just plain data that can be transferred between vessels without extra vehicular activities, they also can be transmitted back directly. Samples however require the delicate handling by kerbals, and cannot be transmitted but have to be recovered instead. They also can be analyzed in a lab, which converts it to data that can be transmitted. Analyzing takes a long time, happens transparently to loaded and unloaded vessels alike, and can't be cheated to create science out of thin air. An interesting method is used to bridge existing stock and third-party experiments to the new science system, that works for most experiments without requiring ad-hoc support.

Transmission rates are realistic, and scale with distance to the point that it may take a long time to transmit data from the outer solar system. Data transmission happens transparently in loaded and unloaded vessels. The resulting communication system is simple, yet it also results in more realistic vessel and mission designs.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I dont see it happening, but I would love to see something like this in KSP 1. I think it would be even better if the science in this game unveiled features of the planet as well. Just as SCANsat reveals biomes and mineral deposits, barometers and thermometers should unveil the pressure and temperature profiles of the astronomical bodies under study and so fourth.

Edited February 5, 2020 by mcwaffles2003

[Immashift]

On 2/5/2020 at 3:44 AM, mcwaffles2003 said:

1 - The maker has made a science only version which un-includes life support mechanics and all the rest of the features of the mod other than science

2 - Experiments don't return their science output instantly, they require some time to run. Some complete in minutes, others will take months. There are two different kinds of experiments: sensor readings and samples. Sensor readings are just plain data that can be transferred between vessels without extra vehicular activities, they also can be transmitted back directly. Samples however require the delicate handling by kerbals, and cannot be transmitted but have to be recovered instead. Transmission rates are realistic, and scale with distance to the point that it may take a long time to transmit data from the outer solar system. Data transmission happens transparently in loaded and unloaded vessels. The resulting communication system is simple, yet it also results in more realistic vessel and mission designs.

3 - I dont see it happening, but I would love to see something like this in KSP 1. I think it would be even better if the science in this game unveiled features of the planet as well. Just as SCANsat reveals biomes and mineral deposits, barometers and thermometers should unveil the pressure and temperature profiles of the astronomical bodies under study and so fourth.

1. I'm going to have to check that mod out again. It was very early on when I tried it initially. Glad to see it's come a long way since.

2. Science experiments taking time is something that definitely should be a thing, along with life support. Maybe make certain experiments only complete-able by certain vessels, like a landed base with qualifications. So your petri dish experiment must be done on Duna, at a landed base, having at least a level x scientist in a lab, and takes x time, all the while your scientist is burning air/water/food. Then make the result fully transmit-able. 

One of the convoluted things about my science currently is I have research stations around 4 bodies at the moment, and I have to load and check each to transmit after each significant timewarp. I'd love just a simple UI (even a mod for current KSP), which takes stock of my science generated by my stations, and transmits it without loading anything in. All it would have to do is look at science rates, generate the science value, let me hit a button to transmit, then take that science away on next vessel load.

I like how there's storage for data in actual KB. The Jesus science box I constantly use having limitless experiment storage is sort of amusing. I'd love to see digital data storage in proper values for KSP2 (EVA to remove a hard drive from a returned probe? :D). Maybe also requiring a network capable of transmitting at a required speed or gain to accurately receive that data, meaning I'd have more incentives to try to return my probes to Kerbin at least early on, rather than having them scream past Moho at 8km/s, 500m above the surface, then transmit my science, and then proceed to not care where that probe is or is going for the rest of my game... unless it's like that one time that Moho probe then somehow found itself 100m/s from encountering Jool... Still dunno how that happened but I'll take the free science.

I haven't done anything with the Breaking Ground DLC science EVA thingies. I'm actually going to check them out right now, as I'm at a point in my save where it's gonna be several hundred days till my probes get where they're going (Duna/Jool/Moho probes are on their way :D). Playing with life support means excessive timewarp has me carting life support cans around my stations over and over. My Minmus and Mun ground bases don't have proper life support generation yet, though they finally do have recyclers.

3. I already really enjoy RemoteTech. The feeling of triumph when my probe receives its orders to turn & burn at exactly the time it reaches the point it needs to, billions of miles away, is a lot of fun. Transmission time delays are another thing I'd like in KSP2, perhaps only in higher difficulties. Maybe a slider from realistic to instant. Already in a savegame I like to get a SCANSAT probe going on the mun and minmus super early, as well as Duna / Laythe whenever I can realistically do it, just so that when I finally get to going there for real, I have the data to set down somewhere actually useful.

On 2/4/2020 at 10:52 PM, Clockwork13 said:

A proper API for modders.

I've never created a mod, but as someone who uses over a hundred of them, and really can't live without some of them, I wholeheartedly agree. Anything that makes mods easier to develop or update would be great. Especially heavy ones like Kopernicus. It's amazing these authors have hacked their way as far into the game as they have, but I gather it's a pile of work to update every game revision.

Edited February 8, 2020 by Immashift
Typos :(

[Guest]

My wishes would be too long to write @_@ but a few things off the top of my head...

-A better approximation of aerodynamics and heat management.

-Some more detailed aspect to scanning, mapping and sensors etc...

-More interesting science and exploration system.

-Way more optimised and smoother running!

-Better looking and more immersive planetary environments.

-Better looking parts and the ability to make more customisable and unique craft.

-More depth and variety in technologies to choose from.

-some form of basic robotics and propellers. Not necessarily a similar system as KSP1 but at least something so that KSP2 isn’t too lacking by comparison.

-an improvement on how you can build craft would be nice. I often find it not very precise and the viewing angles are a bit restricted. 

-less menus... KSP1 has 2 start menu screens... whyyyyy.... and then when you are ingame each building in KSC is basically another submenu which takes you out of the game. Some way of avoiding all the loading screens and menus would be good I think o_o

-

Edited February 8, 2020 by Guest

[mcwaffles2003]

3 hours ago, Immashift said:

One of the convoluted things about my science currently is I have research stations around 4 bodies at the moment, and I have to load and check each to transmit after each significant timewarp. I'd love just a simple UI (even a mod for current KSP), which takes stock of my science generated by my stations, and transmits it without loading anything in. All it would have to do is look at science rates, generate the science value, let me hit a button to transmit, then take that science away on next vessel load.

With kerbalism's science  you can not load data experiments to a lab (temperature, pres mat, magnetometer, etc...) but you can load samples into the lab (goo, materials bay, etc...) and the labs total sample capacity is pretty high so intervention is minimal. Be warned though, there are some data experiments that take years to fully run if using 1 vessel though most are minutes to weeks.

 

[Bej Kerman]

On 2/4/2020 at 8:56 PM, mcwaffles2003 said:

and I dont think any of us want this to become Kerbal Space Trucker

The only people against an automation tool would probably be those still playing Elite: Mailman.

[Vinhero100]

1 minute ago, Bej Kerman said:

The only people against an automation tool would probably be those still playing Elite: Mailman.

There's only one business in the galaxy that will get you this rich... 

[Bej Kerman]

5 minutes ago, Vinhero100 said:

There's only one business in the galaxy that will get you this rich... 

Purple spice trading? Selling freighters? Hijacking a ship and stealing a macguffin?

[Vinhero100]

18 minutes ago, Bej Kerman said:

Purple spice trading? Selling freighters? Hijacking a ship and stealing a macguffin?

No... Spending hours traveling to a remote system for an in

proportionate payment

[Bej Kerman]

26 minutes ago, Vinhero100 said:

No... Spending hours traveling to a remote system for an in

proportionate payment

Let's also not forget about how combat gives you 1 and you need 10 to repair your ship.

[I likeOxidizerrfuel]

I am thinking of submarines, underwater creatures, more underwater anomalies, undersea mountain ranges. So, pretty much anything with oceans because they need a huge revamp.

Just not too much Subnautica.

 

[Immashift]

59 minutes ago, I likeOxidizerrfuel said:

I am thinking of submarines, underwater creatures, more underwater anomalies, undersea mountain ranges. So, pretty much anything with oceans because they need a huge revamp.

Just not too much Subnautica.

 

Ooo. I like this. Underwater bases and some incentive to do them would be neat. Can be as simple as anomalies on the seafloor that give science, or maybe a resource that lets you use a particular set of good engines that can only be acquired there, a la Karborundum on Eeloo.

Integration with life support, maybe some failures of parts like DangIt but a little more specifically implemented. Have to take a base module to the surface to get water out after it floods, things like that.

4 hours ago, Bej Kerman said:

The only people against an automation tool would probably be those still playing Elite: Mailman.

Hey now I like me some Elite. I play it in VR with a Rift S, and even though the gameplay _can_ get stale, it really is a thing to behold in VR. I even have a desktop overlay behind my cockpit so when I'm doing multi-hundred LS supercruises I can swivel my chair and watch YouTube or something while I wait. 6 degrees of freedom combat is something that has never been done quite as well in any other game imo (FA: Off guy here :D).

 

7 hours ago, mcwaffles2003 said:

With kerbalism's science  you can not load data experiments to a lab (temperature, pres mat, magnetometer, etc...) but you can load samples into the lab (goo, materials bay, etc...) and the labs total sample capacity is pretty high so intervention is minimal. Be warned though, there are some data experiments that take years to fully run if using 1 vessel though most are minutes to weeks.

 

I took a look at the Kerbalism page. I'm completely willing to install the whole thing again. The simple scripting and the radiation zones around stuff has me quite intrigued. Problem is, I have about ten space stations with crew currently using TAC parts. Most of them are modular, so I _can_ replace the life support modules. The bases not so much, of which I have two (Minmus, Mun). Switching from TAC to Kerbalism is going to be not so fun. Going to have to crew shuttle everyone home, then try and get my bases and stations to a no-life-support status, then swap mods over. But I'll give it a go. Sigh. Guess design of my Laythe mission is going to take a backseat for most of today... and then require complete overhaul for redundancy and habitation requirements and dealing with radiation.... Oh well. 3 days off work and nothing planned other than vacuum the house and play KSP.

Maaaaaaybe it's time to go all in and start a new save with Kerbalism... but I was just getting to the really fun mid-game of KSP. Sigh. I suppose I could start fresh and bang some stuff into orbit and go full steam on science acquisition with what I know now about how my mods all synergize. I just added Nertea's new exploration pack... Hmm. Maybe I'll throw a probes first science tree in there. Haven't done that for a while.

ONWARDS!

 

-- I'd like to see monthly budgets as an option at the start of a game save rather than contract based money. I don't like contracts as the sole means of money, other than specific checkpoints in my career. I'm head-canon-ing a race of Kerbals planetwide that have the sole wish to GET OUT THERE and go see what they can find and colonize stuff. I'm pretending that most of the planet is behind my space program, and it's the focus of my race of Kerbals. It's what I feel humanity -should- be doing right now. So my monthly budget keeps going up as I expand out, and I take contracts for reputation only to further public decision that space is indeed the thing we want to do in life. So, just more options to prevent constraining my gameplay to "you do this thing right now or you're broke", and more of my preferred gameplay of "hey that planet looks neat, let's put a nuclear powered blimp on it, because the full might of Kerbal-kind says why the hell not?".

 

-- I'd also reaaaaaaaally like some far future stuff. I don't want warp drive. Though I played the hell out of USLD? Jump Beacons back in I think it was .90. I had a whole planetary network of beacons and efficient freight ships moving stuff around all the time. My Kerbol system had around 20 vessels on route to various stuff at any one point and I also played with MKS then, which I suppose I should do again (but damn those resource trees, omfg). 

But I digress. Specifically I would love the hell out of something like an orbital ring, skyhook, space elevator, or just some far(ish)-future method of getting stuff into orbit, especially if we're not giving me launch and station rendezvous automation after my 100th orange tank run to my space station, and doubly especially if we're doing colonization on the scale the KSP2 trailer suggests. If you're unfamiliar with the technologies I'm referencing, I'm going to shamelessly plug Isaac Arthur's video on orbital rings, as the dude needs more subscribers and does a wonderfully detailed job explaining them, and is well worth your time watching.

 

Edited February 8, 2020 by Immashift

[dave1904]

I just wish it is stable. I'm sorry I am such a skeptic but I do not want to wish until I know its a working product. 

[Immashift]

1 minute ago, dave1904 said:

I just wish it is stable. I'm sorry I am such a skeptic but I do not want to wish until I know its a working product. 

KSP has yet to crash on me this version, even with my ~120 mods including three big planet packs. I swapped from my old AMD 8320 & GTX960 to a Ryzen 7 & RTX2070 Super last month and KSP has been WORLDS smoother overall. Can finally max out all the graphics settings with hundreds of parts and no time dilation.

But yes, the game needs to just work out of the box, with as few bugs as possible. Cutting some problematic features for stability and them putting them in later I'm all for, provided the game on launch does actually do something KSP1 does not.

[dave1904]

Just now, Immashift said:

KSP has yet to crash on me this version, even with my ~120 mods including three big planet packs. I swapped from my old AMD 8320 & GTX960 to a Ryzen 7 & RTX2070 Super last month and KSP has been WORLDS smoother overall. Can finally max out all the graphics settings with hundreds of parts and no time dilation.

But yes, the game needs to just work out of the box, with as few bugs as possible. Cutting some problematic features for stability and them putting them in later I'm all for, provided the game on launch does actually do something KSP1 does not.

I was going to upgrade and then 1.8.1 came out. My 4770K and Gtx 970 have a few years left in them yet  I do not know about you all but my FPS between 1.5.1 and 1.8.1 is around 30-50% better. I am sure some of the mods are also more stable and play there part too. I just googled your old cpu and yeah I believe you. Those old amd cpus had terrible single core performance. The 4770K is already 7 years old and is still amazing. I am now waiting for intels response to amd hammering them  Nothing better than some good competition!

For me personally I do not need anything other the game mechanics we have now, stable, axial tilt, nicer looking and easier to mod. The more we have the better but stability and moddabily is all that matter

[Immashift]

21 minutes ago, dave1904 said:

I just googled your old cpu and yeah I believe you. Those old amd cpus had terrible single core performance. The 4770K is already 7 years old and is still amazing. I am now waiting for intels response to amd hammering them  Nothing better than some good competition!

 I LOVED my 8320, had it overclocked to a clean & reliable 4Ghz. It had TONS of life left in it for what I used it for. Anything multi-core it absolutely BREEZED through. Video encoding, which I do constantly, was amazingly fast. You're right on single core stuff though. Although I have limited knowledge of what stuff is done multicore, threading, etc. I need to take a bit of a crash course on modern CPU stuff. I just know what fits with what, and what is regarded as good  Enough to throw together a system anyway. The sole reason I upgraded to the Ryzen 7 was my motherboard at the time had a USB3 controller that HATED my VR headset (damn ASMedia). I wanted something with support for it out of the box.

However, nothing touches this CPU on KSP performance compared to what I had. I see now why people suggested I upgrade the CPU for better KSP performance, though much of my framerate increase has to be down to the 2070 Super rather than the 960GT. It was expensive, but soooooooooooo worth it.

My old 8320 I gave to my dad, as a free upgrade from the quad core AMD FX I also gave him years ago... which was an upgrade to the old dual core AMD I gave him before that lol. He loves my free hand-me-downs. I'm gonna give him my old 120GB SSD next as soon as I pull the trigger on a pair of M2 SSDs. He's still running a craptastic SATA 1 120GB hard drive that's slow as molasses... as his main Windows drive...hoh boy. He's 71 and spends a lot of time making slideshow videos with his massive picture library in... Windows Movie Maker (insert gut-wrenching here). I'm trying to get him on Adobe Premiere, and he loves the added controls, but finds it daunting. He loves the power the 8320 has for video stuff though. He finally has a system that can comfortably run modern creation software and it's a massive upgrade to him. The only thing the 8320 ever did bad was thermal handling. It overheated on me quite a few times, even before overclocking from 3.5 - 4Ghz... During video encodes in Handbrake especially it liked to roast itself at a balmy 85+C. I eventually bought a MASSIVE heatsink for it that promptly fixed that issue though. His PC now comfortably sits at 8 degrees celcius at idle at room ambient 22C. My Ryzen 7 does much better, stock heatsink running KSP at max settings is mid-50s. Think I'll overclock it and watercool it at some point.

Edited February 8, 2020 by Immashift
Typos, adding stuffs. Can't resist wall-of-texting.

[I likeOxidizerrfuel]

I would also like there to be cities in KSP and more launch sites (pretty much Kerbin side). Also, since multiplayer will be available, maybe a voice chat option, just make it good. Folders to sort out your crafts from stock crafts that come with the game would be nice. 

 

But one question I have is, will it run on my computer? It seems like the graphics are gonna get pretty high.

I would really like colonies to have the ability to build rockets on the surface (or in orbit).

[Guest]

1 hour ago, I likeOxidizerrfuel said:

I would really like colonies to have the ability to build rockets on the surface (or in orbit).

Already confirmed and seen in the trailer, the thing they land on at the end is a Colonial VAB/Launchpad and the structure the big Jool interstellar star-in-a-bucket ship departs from is a orbital VAB.