The Elcano Challenge: Ground-Based Circumnavigation (4th)

[Scarecrow71]

And finished!  Finito!  The end of the journey!

As I stated in the post, that was TEDIOUS.  Physics warp helped, but you gotta be careful using that.  And you have to pay attention; you can't simply set warp to 3x and start perusing the internet.  But I finished.  Thankfully.  Just need @18Watt to verify please!

[18Watt]

2 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

As I stated in the post, that was TEDIOUS.

This challenge has been around for a long, long time.  And the list of players who have completed it is pretty short.  There's a reason for that.  Although the list is a little longer today!

2 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

And you have to pay attention; you can't simply set warp to 3x and start perusing the internet.

Don't worry.  If your sound is turned on, you'll know when it's time to pay attention to KSP again.  Mysteriously, the sound of a rover exploding is simulated pretty well, even in a vacuum!

Nice job!

[18Watt]

2 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

Just need @18Watt to verify please!

Verified, and added to the leaderboards!

By the way, I’m making a third run at the No Contract Challenge.  I currently have two ships sitting on Minmus which don’t have enough DV to do all the biome hopping I’d like to do.  However, they do have the small (crummy) rover wheels.  So I’m looking at the prospect of doing a drive around Minmus to collect science, with the worst rover wheels in the game.

So I feel your pain!  Long distance driving in KSP is a real challenge.

[Scarecrow71]

36 minutes ago, 18Watt said:

third run at the No Contract Challeng

I'll be scrapping my current run at that and starting over at some point.

[Poppa Wheelie]

I've been playing KSP since December 2019.  First time posting.

I circumnavigated both Minmus and the Mun in a single mission, which I called Twofer II (Twofer I was a flyby of both), between July of 2020 and February of 2021 (after work, on weekends, etc.  You know the drill).  I wasn’t aware of the Elcano Challenge until recently, so I didn’t set out to finish each circumnavigation at exactly the same place that I started it.  My objectives were to visit every biome and maximize science.  I did have my own goal of circumnavigation for each moon:  since I was travelling basically westward, my criteria was that I had to do more than 360 degrees westward, and finish further west than I started. 

Here are some screenshots and maps.  Enjoy!

77 images for the entire mission - both circumnavigations.  Spoiler Alert:  includes photos and locations of some special geographic features.

 

To Moderator, 18Watt:  I couldn't  figure out how to post individual photos in this forum. I also couldn't figure out how to change my profile image, or how to apply the badges to my signature line.

[Admiral Fluffy]

3 hours ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

To Moderator, 18Watt:  I couldn't  figure out how to post individual photos in this forum. I also couldn't figure out how to change my profile image, or how to apply the badges to my signature line.

Those don't happen until you have more posts.

Impressive how you did bolth in one mission!

[Poppa Wheelie]

1 hour ago, Admiral Fluffy said:

Those don't happen until you have more posts.

Impressive how you did bolth in one mission!

Thank you, Admiral Fluffy.  No problem, I'll wait until I have a sufficient number of posts.

[MythicalHeFF]

On 1/9/2022 at 2:50 PM, Poppa Wheelie said:

 

To Moderator, 18Watt:  I couldn't  figure out how to post individual photos in this forum. I also couldn't figure out how to change my profile image, or how to apply the badges to my signature line.

You can post individual images by individually linking them from Imgur. Just right click the image you want to post, click “copy image link”, and paste. The link should turn into the image proper after a few seconds.

Edited January 11, 2022 by Jack Joseph Kerman

[MythicalHeFF]

I completed my Duna circumnavigation, but the crew is currently stranded with a craft that has too low of a TWR to make it back to orbit because I pulled a Matt Lowne and didn’t bother to test whether my SSTO could ascend back to orbit from Duna or not. So that’s another thing for me to sort out once I get back home.

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 12, 2022 by Jack Joseph Kerman

[18Watt]

On 1/9/2022 at 2:50 PM, Poppa Wheelie said:

I've been playing KSP since December 2019.  First time posting.

Welcome to the forums @Poppa Wheelie!  I'm not sure if anyone has used the same rover to circumnavigate two bodies before, that was interesting.

On 1/9/2022 at 2:50 PM, Poppa Wheelie said:

so I didn’t set out to finish each circumnavigation at exactly the same place that I started it.

Unless anyone has any objections, I'll add you to the leaderboard- you certainly covered enough distance.  Technically the rules specify starting and ending at the same place, but I believe you met the spirit of the challenge.  Congratulations!

9 hours ago, Jack Joseph Kerman said:

I completed my Duna circumnavigation,

Nice!  I'll get you added also.

9 hours ago, Jack Joseph Kerman said:

but the crew is currently stranded with a craft that has too low of a TWR to make it back to orbit

No requirement to recover the crew to Kerbin, or even get them back to orbit.  I did Eve a few years ago, that crew is still sitting on the surface waiting for me to figure out how to get them back to orbit.  Nice rover, and the deployment from the Mk3 cargo bay looks graceful.  It looks like the rover wheels are mounted on I-beams, with hinges between the I-beams and body?  And then an engineer added struts after the wheels were deployed?  I'm curious how that setup worked for you?  Getting a wide, flat rover to fit inside things is a challenge, I like how you accomplished that!

 

[MythicalHeFF]

9 hours ago, 18Watt said:

It looks like the rover wheels are mounted on I-beams, with hinges between the I-beams and body?  And then an engineer added struts after the wheels were deployed?  I'm curious how that setup worked for you? 

 

Mounting the wheels’ I-beams on hinges is exactly what I did. Originally, I was just going to make the rover very narrow, but doing so would have made it too easy to flip over (and considering this design itself flipped more than a few times, it looks like I made the right call.) Once the rover, the Fortitude, had been unloaded from the cargo bay, I activated the action group to turn the hinges and unfold the wheels. Engineer Gerwig Kerman then manually added struts for increased structural integrity.

Ill probably use the Fortitude model for future Elcano runs, as it proved to be highly reliable and lightweight. I probably won’t use an SSTO for future missions though, instead I’ll just open a fairing on a lander and drive the rover out.

[Nazalassa]

Trying the Elcano Challenge for the very first time!

[Akagi]

Here we gooooooooooooooo!

 

 

[Poppa Wheelie]

I just completed a Kerbin Sea Circumnavigation

Why would I do this?

Spoiler

I haven’t gone interplanetary yet, but I have some Eve and Gilly contracts, and a launch window coming up in my Career game.  If I get a contract to plant a flag or something, I’ll include a land and return.  If I do that, I’ll want to get all the science.  So I’ve been thinking about how I will circumnavigate Eve.  I’ll need something amphibious.

So I built an amphibious rover, adjusted it some for “decent” performance, and even tested it in the Eve simulator.  To get some real experience with it, and to go ahead and get the rest of the Kerbin land science that I didn’t already have, I decided to go ahead and circumnavigate Kerbin.

The Rover (3 images)

Spoiler

Here’s the rover, which I named “Spout”. 

• Top Speed on water, daytime:  40.4m/s, which I could maintain for long periods.
• Top Speed on water, night time:  25.7, which I could maintain for long periods
• Top Speed on land:  unknown.  I didn’t allow myself to go over 40m/s, but the vehicle could have gone MUCH faster.  I went long stretches on land between 30 and 35m/s.

The Route (1 image)

Spoiler

I went the western route, in order to maximize daylight time each day.  And it worked out fairly well that several of my nights were moving mostly south or north.  Although the challenge description recommends doing the land crossing at the red or green areas, I chose the blue, for two reasons: 1) to get Badlands biome science (there’s a little speck of Badlands biome right there where I went ashore), and 2) to have the shorter ocean voyage at the end when I got back in the water.

Highlight Photos (16 images)

Spoiler

Doing Desert biome science:

Got science at the Southern Ice Shelf:

Doing science at the Tundra biome:

Beginning of the big land cross-country leg:

Badlands biome science, including scan of a Baobab tree:

Grasslands science on the way to the mountains:

Highlands biome science on the way to the mountains:

Mountains biome science here:

Heading downhill from the mountains:

After crossing a lot of grasslands, at night, I can finally see the ocean again:

Doing Shores biome science:

Halfway through the long ocean trip back to the KSC:

I can see the Island Runway!

And there's the KSC!

Heading back to the runway:

All done!  Team shot:

The Entire Album (61 images):   https://imgur.com/a/gZyBbwg

Circumnavigation Markers (7 images)

Spoiler

Lessons Learned

Spoiler

I got 432.4 Science from this mission – enough to open one tech.  And I get a signature badge!  But I also learned a few things that I can apply to future missions.

1. Land cross-country is a grind, and even water crossings are boring (but at least I can be doing something else while paying attention to a long water crossing with only half of one eye).  I need a better amphib that is both a faster boat, and a much faster land vehicle.  For Eve, I’ll see if there’s a route to just “touch” the liquid a few times, so that I can concentrate on a much faster land vehicle even if it means a slower boat.
2. A better land vehicle will have to use wheels other than aircraft landing gear.  I did the big cross country here with large grasslands sections moving 30 to 35m/s.  The vehicle could have gone much faster, but I didn’t feel in “control” going any faster than that.  I’ll want this much faster land vehicle if I intend to circumnavigate Eve by land, or Duna.
3. The biggest water speed limitation with this boat is that it wants to nose in once we get just over 40m/s.
4. A better boat needs some adjustments to the pontoons (probably longer pontoons would have allowed better speed), and I’ll probably fiddle with the angle the rotors drive thrust through the vehicle.  I may also play with airfoils.  I have until Laythe to figure this one out.
5. I need a computer upgrade.  I had some serious time lag with this.  I timed several sections and found that it was taking 2.6 real-world seconds for each in-game second.  A 3 hour in-game water crossing would take me over 7.5 hours of real time.  Only on the last day of the mission, I figured out that I could get 1 in-game second for 1.6 real-world seconds (instead of 2.6) by removing the crew cameras from bottom right, adjusting setting to remove camera bouncing, and zooming in to a part of the vehicle (I used the very front window) so that nothing needed to change or update on the screen from moment to moment.  I wish I would have figured this out earlier in the mission.  Staying in map view did not improve performance.

OK, that’s it!  Hope you enjoyed this.  And I welcome any suggestions for a faster land vehicle for Eve, and a faster water vehicle for Laythe (eventually).  Or a faster amphibious vehicle for both!

And, one more question for anyone:  what’s the best way to drop photos into Imgur?  I dropped 61 images at once.  They were in date stamp order, and the filenames were in alphabetical order.  Imgur totally rearranged them in some other crazy order.  Do I have to drop these one at a time?

[18Watt]

4 hours ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

I just completed a Kerbin Sea Circumnavigation

Awesome!

4 hours ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

Here’s the rover, which I named “Spout”. 

I like it!

4 hours ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

I chose the blue, for two reasons:

That’s interesting that you can get Badlands biome that way, I didn’t know that.  Most amphibious vessels are difficult to operate on land, the northern (Red squares..) route seems to be the least dangerous.

5 hours ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

And I welcome any suggestions for a faster land vehicle for Eve

Electric propellers work extremely well on Eve, even for land vehicles.  However, I’ve found propellers do not like physics warp at all, so that is a caution.  If you use aircraft gear on Eve, I suggest using the next larger size.

5 hours ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

faster water vehicle for Laythe (eventually)

I’ve built propeller boats that can hit 70 m/s or more, but jet engines work even better.  Can’t use jets at Eve (no oxygen), but jets work great at Laythe.  I had several entries in the previous version of this challenge, which is linked on the first post.  One advantage to jets is they play nicer with physics warp.

5 hours ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

what’s the best way to drop photos into Imgur?

Here’s what works for me.

• I rename the images on my computer as Boat0001, Boat0002, etc.  It’s easy on the Macs I use, pretty sure Windows also has an easy way to batch rename files.
• Then I drop the renamed images into Imgur.
• Finally, in the Imgur folder, choose ‘Sort By Original Filename’

Otherwise, you are right, Imgur does not organize files in a useful way.  The method I described works well for me.

[Poppa Wheelie]

48 minutes ago, 18Watt said:

That’s interesting that you can get Badlands biome that way, I didn’t know that.

I've found this site very useful for maps, including biome maps:  https://ksp.deringenieur.net/

49 minutes ago, 18Watt said:

I’ve found propellers do not like physics warp at all

I agree.  I read that some people were able to at least go to warp 2 with propellers.  I tried it on this mission - no luck.  I also tried in map mode - also no luck.  I did the whole thing in slower than real time.

51 minutes ago, 18Watt said:

Finally, in the Imgur folder, choose ‘Sort By Original Filename’

Ah!  This probably would have done it.  My filenames were already in alphabetical order.  I'll look at this next time.

And thanks for the suggestions on future land and water rovers!

[18Watt]

23 minutes ago, Poppa Wheelie said:

And thanks for the suggestions on future land and water rovers!

Here’s a link to my Eve entry.  I was able to travel at 94 m/s on water, while using 2X physics warp.  I’m sure it could have hit those speeds on land, too, but I found anything over 35 m/s was almost certain to end in an explosion.  Although my Eve rover/boat was extremely lightweight, I used the larger landing gear.  I really recommend using the bigger landing gear on Eve..  Here’s a link to my entry.

 

[MythicalHeFF]

My Mun circumnavigation is complete! I decided to just stick with the Fortitude design of rover, which is what I used in my previous Duna Elcano. The mission's setup was a little bit different, however, as this time I did not use an SSTO, but rather a simpler rocket and lander setup. Once landed on the Mun, the rover would simply just drive off of the fairing plate onto the Munar surface. Originally, I wanted to create a ramp using hinges, but this was cancelled when the hinges ultimately failed and would barely budge despite having their motor power set to 100%. 

Launch of the Fortitude III:

Mun Landing (near the location of the Armstrong Memorial):

Armstrong Memorial:

Monolith!

More major landmarks/milestones:

Spoiler

First Mun Arch

Germund Kerman, veteran commander of the Odyssey Tylo Elcano mission, on the arch

Double-Decker Crater

Second Mun Arch (not sure why I only took this one crappy screenshot). This is the location where another rover expedition from my nearby base took place, with a flag being planted here (visible in foreground).

East Crater Rim

Visiting my Munar Hotel:

Complete with ion hovercraft!

The crew taking a rest for the night in one of the private hab units:

Sunrise

Departure

Floating Boulder

The Rim Bridge:

Passing near a previous Mun landing site

Ohio

Nebraska

Trying some night driving (not very successful, as the Fortitude only has a single RTG, and thus relies almost entirely on solar power to run)

Spooky 

Nearing the Mun Canyon Base, called "Canyon's End"

Canyon drive

Who needs Dres?

Sundown

Kerbinrise!

Are we there yet?

100 km to go

Chaotic terrain in the basin

The Armstrong Memorial is visible again!

The Finish Line!

Preparing for departure

Liftoff!

Burning for home

Re-entry

Landing!

 

Ring of flags around the Mun:

[18Watt]

1 hour ago, Jack Joseph Kerman said:

My Mun circumnavigation is complete!

Awesome!  Leaderboard updated!  That was a really neat design for the delivery vehicle.

1 hour ago, Jack Joseph Kerman said:

Nebraska

Yep, looks just like Nebraska.

Fantastic post @Jack Joseph Kerman!  

[Nazalassa]

I'm on Mun also, after lots of designs I launched the mission a few days ago!

Well, part of it... I don't have the Interplanetary Stage ready right now.

[king of nowhere]

I finished the circumnavigation of OPM Slate.

And there isn't even a badge for that

 

[18Watt]

50 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

I finished the circumnavigation of OPM Slate.

Fantastic!  I really enjoyed reading about your trip!  Actually, I still need more time to really look at the whole expedition.

Until now, all versions of the Elcano Challenge have only maintained leaderboards for stock worlds.  I understand why, it could become very cumbersome to keep track of a nearly unlimited number of planets and moons.  However, I am going to add a category for modded CBs.  Please allow me some time to figure out how best to accomplish that.  I'm not sure how long it will take, but I'll get your entry in eventually!

I can see from your screenshots the terrain on Slate is extremely difficult.  I'm curious about the size and mass of Slate, and wether it has an atmosphere?  It appeared to me to not have an atmosphere.  Just eyeballing your G-meter in screenshots, it looks like the gravity is higher than Mun, Ike, or Moho's.  But not quite as high as Kerbin or Tylo's?  At one point you mentioned your ascent vehicle had about 2,400 m/s, and you were concerned that would not be quite enough dv to reach orbit?  In that case, it sounds like the gravity is very close to Kerbin's or Tylo's.

Again, please be patient while I try to figure out how to start adding additional CBs to the leaderboard.

[Admiral Fluffy]

3 hours ago, 18Watt said:

I can see from your screenshots the terrain on Slate is extremely difficult.  I'm curious about the size and mass of Slate, and whether it has an atmosphere?  It appeared to me to not have an atmosphere.  Just eyeballing your G-meter in screenshots, it looks like the gravity is higher than Mun, Ike, or Moho's.  But not quite as high as Kerbin or Tylo's?  At one point you mentioned your ascent vehicle had about 2,400 m/s, and you were concerned that would not be quite enough dv to reach orbit?  In that case, it sounds like the gravity is very close to Kerbin's or Tylo's.

It has no atmosphere, and the radius is 540 kilometers

[king of nowhere]

12 hours ago, 18Watt said:

I can see from your screenshots the terrain on Slate is extremely difficult.  I'm curious about the size and mass of Slate, and wether it has an atmosphere?  It appeared to me to not have an atmosphere.  Just eyeballing your G-meter in screenshots, it looks like the gravity is higher than Mun, Ike, or Moho's.  But not quite as high as Kerbin or Tylo's?  At one point you mentioned your ascent vehicle had about 2,400 m/s, and you were concerned that would not be quite enough dv to reach orbit?  In that case, it sounds like the gravity is very close to Kerbin's or Tylo's.

Again, please be patient while I try to figure out how to start adding additional CBs to the leaderboard.

it's very similar to tylo. slightly lower gravity, you need some 100 m/s less to orbit, but basically it's like tylo for everything that does not concern driving a rover on it.

[Nazalassa]

But due to shifting from Mac OSX to Linux Ubuntu, I can't play KSP right now on Steam (the screen goes black upon launching but isn't frozen, could someone help me please?), however I think a portable installation would work. While I write these lines it's still frozen.