RyanRising Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 On 6/29/2021 at 2:24 PM, The Doodling Astronaut said: Most people who play KSP are not mac users. So why put in time for Mac when there are a lot more PC players (I guess you can say the same for Console...) I first got KSP when my main computer was a Mac, and probably wouldn't be playing it now if not for getting it then, even though i now have a PC. I also would very much appreciate support for running the game on Linux. Additionally, and more on-topic to this thread, I have been told that console KSP is... not a smooth experience. While PS5 and XXX may not themselves be much of an issue, they do show a renewed dedication to making the game work on consoles, including the historically problematic PS4 and XBone. I do worry that the tremendous amount of work that'll need to be done to make the UI passable for this release will eat into resources for making other things work better. For example, KSP1's editor UI is pretty good. There are some areas of improvement, but really, clicking and dragging parts onto other parts is a concept that is very well-suited to a mouse and keyboard. This is not true for a controller, and the solution of having a virtual mouse on screen moved by an analog stick is not something I see anyone satisfied by. Resources could either be devoted to finding a new concept or better implementation for that on a controller, or could be dedicated to making things even more refined and precise with a keyboard and mouse. One of those problems is much bigger than the other, so of course the controller control issue would be dealt with, while any improvements that could be made to the M+KB experience seem like extremely minor issues in comparison, and probably won't. But if the controller experience wasn't an issue, we might see those little improvements made. Maybe being able to set a precise angle, or position offset, using advanced tweakable options, or making good use of multiple monitors? While there are benefits to making the game responsive to more input methods, adapting KSP2 for consoles may result in a user interface that's not ideal for either input method. But hey, maybe console KSP sales outsell desktop ones - there are a lot more console gamers last time I checked, so by this thread of argument maybe I'm saying there should be no PC release instead of no console release. I just worry that this newfound vigour for the consoles and apparent neglect for the other desktop platforms other than Windows will result in a suboptimal game for those who do want to play it on its predecessor's home turf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave1904 Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 4 hours ago, RyanRising said: I first got KSP when my main computer was a Mac, and probably wouldn't be playing it now if not for getting it then, even though i now have a PC. I also would very much appreciate support for running the game on Linux. Additionally, and more on-topic to this thread, I have been told that console KSP is... not a smooth experience. While PS5 and XXX may not themselves be much of an issue, they do show a renewed dedication to making the game work on consoles, including the historically problematic PS4 and XBone. I do worry that the tremendous amount of work that'll need to be done to make the UI passable for this release will eat into resources for making other things work better. For example, KSP1's editor UI is pretty good. There are some areas of improvement, but really, clicking and dragging parts onto other parts is a concept that is very well-suited to a mouse and keyboard. This is not true for a controller, and the solution of having a virtual mouse on screen moved by an analog stick is not something I see anyone satisfied by. Resources could either be devoted to finding a new concept or better implementation for that on a controller, or could be dedicated to making things even more refined and precise with a keyboard and mouse. One of those problems is much bigger than the other, so of course the controller control issue would be dealt with, while any improvements that could be made to the M+KB experience seem like extremely minor issues in comparison, and probably won't. But if the controller experience wasn't an issue, we might see those little improvements made. Maybe being able to set a precise angle, or position offset, using advanced tweakable options, or making good use of multiple monitors? While there are benefits to making the game responsive to more input methods, adapting KSP2 for consoles may result in a user interface that's not ideal for either input method. But hey, maybe console KSP sales outsell desktop ones - there are a lot more console gamers last time I checked, so by this thread of argument maybe I'm saying there should be no PC release instead of no console release. I just worry that this newfound vigour for the consoles and apparent neglect for the other desktop platforms other than Windows will result in a suboptimal game for those who do want to play it on its predecessor's home turf. We have seen the UI of KSP2 and fundamentally its the same as KSP1. It would be very stupid to change the controls on PC because it works and is half the reason the game is famous. The console version will sell enough to pay for itself so it is actually very important for them to spend time on a console specific UI and control scheme. They should do it like ubisoft did with GRAW 1 and 2. Totally different games on both systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomot512 Posted July 2, 2021 Share Posted July 2, 2021 16 hours ago, Dientus said: Since it is announced as PC and not Windows specific, it is most likely coming. This is also what I'm hoping for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerodynamic Kerbal Posted July 9, 2021 Share Posted July 9, 2021 One small question: How much will it cost? And if you have the original, will KSP2 be free? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKrakenHerder Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 As many other people have said before me, support for Xbox 1 and PS4 is not a good idea. I’d say there’s far more people playing KSP on Mac and Linux than Xbox 1 and PS4, and they should not be passed over for KSP 2. It’s not fair to hold back most of KSP 2’s potential playerbase because of a tiny minority playing on aging consoles. Also, as most users have said, the game absolutely should not be “dumbed down” when it comes to graphics, features, and the UI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LHACK4142 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 ...KSP 2 is here? Oh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bej Kerman Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 On 7/25/2021 at 8:31 AM, TheKrakenHerder said: As many other people have said before me, support for Xbox 1 and PS4 is not a good idea. I’d say there’s far more people playing KSP on Mac and Linux than Xbox 1 and PS4, and they should not be passed over for KSP 2. It’s not fair to hold back most of KSP 2’s potential playerbase because of a tiny minority playing on aging consoles. Also, as most users have said, the game absolutely should not be “dumbed down” when it comes to graphics, features, and the UI. It's like believing KSP 2 should be cancelled because it won't be coming to your old 90s commodore. The minority that wants KSP 2 to come to outdated consoles should absolutely not be listened to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curveball Anders Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 1 hour ago, Bej Kerman said: The minority that wants KSP 2 to come to outdated consoles should absolutely not be listened to. Well I assume that Take Two has actual figures on what version of consoles are used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K33N Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 (edited) This is possibly the worst news we could have gotten other than the game being cancelled outright. There is no way that the game will live up to its potential when it is hamstrung at the design level by the primitive hardware of old consoles. There should be a focus on porting to Mac and Linux if anything. My expectations just went waaaaay down for this game. Long live KSP1! Edited July 27, 2021 by K33N Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minmus Taster Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 5 hours ago, K33N said: This is possibly the worst news we could have gotten other than the game being cancelled outright. There is no way that the game will live up to its potential when it is hamstrung at the design level by the primitive hardware of old consoles. There should be a focus on porting to Mac and Linux if anything. My expectations just went waaaaay down for this game. Long live KSP1! I don't think you understand, KSP 2 is releasing on PC as you hoped for along with console editions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LHACK4142 Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 On 6/24/2021 at 6:02 AM, KerbMav said: So on the 1st of Januar, cool!!! WHERE?! WHERE?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minmus Taster Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 On 6/24/2021 at 9:02 AM, KerbMav said: So on the 1st of Januar, cool!!! WHERE DID YOU GET THIS INFO!?!?!?!?!?!??! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killbotvii Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 This is massively disappointing. All hopes I had for this game have effectively been cut in half. Putting this game on the PS4 and Xbox One means that the game will have to be designed for the weakest hardware. I have very little faith in the project meeting its potential now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minmus Taster Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 6 minutes ago, killbotvii said: This is massively disappointing. All hopes I had for this game have effectively been cut in half. Putting this game on the PS4 and Xbox One means that the game will have to be designed for the weakest hardware. I have very little faith in the project meeting its potential now. I just explained this. It's also coming to PC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killbotvii Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 31 minutes ago, Minmus Taster said: I just explained this. It's also coming to PC. You really don't understand what anybody here reacting negatively is talking about then. We ALL know it's coming to PC. As my message said, if the game is coming to those consoles, then it must be designed to work with the weakest of the platforms it is coming to. Meaning, it won't be designed to take advantage of the latest hardware, but instead be made so that it works on hardware from ages ago. I don't really know how to make this any clearer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minmus Taster Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 55 minutes ago, killbotvii said: You really don't understand what anybody here reacting negatively is talking about then. We ALL know it's coming to PC. As my message said, if the game is coming to those consoles, then it must be designed to work with the weakest of the platforms it is coming to. Meaning, it won't be designed to take advantage of the latest hardware, but instead be made so that it works on hardware from ages ago. I don't really know how to make this any clearer. 9 hours ago, K33N said: This is possibly the worst news we could have gotten other than the game being cancelled outright. There is no way that the game will live up to its potential when it is hamstrung at the design level by the primitive hardware of old consoles. There should be a focus on porting to Mac and Linux if anything. My expectations just went waaaaay down for this game. Long live KSP1! Oh I see. But we need to remember the first one, it hasn't really changed to make it good for consoles, it just has a different bundle all together, and I doubt the console version will be released with PC and will be worked on separately mostly after main release like ksp. Though I do agree with you that they should put their efforts on the PC version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dientus Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 I searched the forums but couldn't find the exact threads to support this which is unfortunate because there was a great in depth discussion about how the console editions are created by people who are actually in the field. But I will throw out my take away from that which I remember. KSP was ported TO console, which was done by a third party. That is why the updates to console was always behind the PC updates. It was also originally written on and for the PC, which is why the PC version was always (by various standards, maybe not everyones) better than the console versions. Now I never played the console version of KSP, but by what I have seen and been told, to make the console versions even work, things had to be changed resulting in what some people believed to result in a lesser product. I do know console had issues PC did not. Because of everything that has been seen and announced, KSP2 is following the same pattern as far as being created on PC first then ported goes. Even to date, every sneak peek we have gotten on KSP2 was done on PC. This means that whatever happens to the console versions will not reflect or affect the PC version in the slightest. I do see why console owners may be worried about things such as, how will a PS4 version hold up? Will it be as good or have as much as PS5? I don't see a reason to assume the PC version will suffer however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuranAce Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) On 7/26/2021 at 8:59 AM, Bej Kerman said: It's like believing KSP 2 should be cancelled because it won't be coming to your old 90s commodore. The minority that wants KSP 2 to come to outdated consoles should absolutely not be listened to. KSP shouldn't even be on console period. The controls are horrible, the FPS is horrible and its buggy as hell. The only good thing about console I can think of is the Mun base. Edited July 28, 2021 by BuranAce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminal Velocity Posted July 30, 2021 Share Posted July 30, 2021 Why not make it so that ksp2 detects your hardware and sees if it’s capable of the full game or a scaled down game so that everybody can enjoy the game even those with extremely powerful computers and can enjoy the full game instead of targeting the 1M> ksp players on console. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DfA-DoM Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 On 7/30/2021 at 8:02 PM, Terminal Velocity said: Why not make it so that ksp2 detects your hardware and sees if it’s capable of the full game or a scaled down game so that everybody can enjoy the game even those with extremely powerful computers and can enjoy the full game instead of targeting the 1M> ksp players on console. Because that would alas mean several (at least 2) different sets of code for the same feature, implying more time to write it and leading unavoidably to an even bigger set of bugs and issues... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJWyre Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 If the PC version is literally the same version as the PS4/XB1 version, then yes, this is not good. The chances of the console game literally being the same lump of code as the PC version? Very unlikely. Anyway, good to see that platform snobbery, elitism and contempt is still going strong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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