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[1.12.X] Tantares - Stockalike Soyuz and MIR [16.1][28.05.2024][Mars Expedition WIP]


Beale

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8 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

How can the Tantares parts be OP when they're balanced against the stock parts?

they're not balanced for typical usage in the stock system: a Soyuz is way too powerful. The problem with a system rescale, though, is that now everything has to be balanced against that. Not to mention now the system is incompatible with extra planet mods

Edited by Z3R0_0NL1N3
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Just now, Z3R0_0NL1N3 said:

they're not balanced for typical usage in the stock system: a Soyuz is way too powerful. The problem with a system rescale, though, is that now everything has to be balanced against that.

but... everything IS balanced against that, because the stock parts are balanced for a rescaled system.

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On 02/10/2017 at 6:39 PM, Z3R0_0NL1N3 said:

they're not balanced for typical usage in the stock system: a Soyuz is way too powerful. The problem with a system rescale, though, is that now everything has to be balanced against that. Not to mention now the system is incompatible with extra planet mods

Every time this appears, I point to this orbital rockets:

60px-Oscar-B_FT.png
60px-Oscar-B_FT.png
60px-Oscar-B_FT.png
60px-Oscar-B_FT.png
60px-Rockomax_48-7S.png

Stock parts, they are overpowered - and Tantares is balanced to match them.

 

Fairing!

5JaUiFY.png
ZHJ4vAY.png

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get that, but if I rescale my system, then a bunch of other modpacks need to be changed as well. I might take this into my own hands and make a MM config, what's a good start? Should I reduce fuel count to 64%?

I don't think there are many modpacks balanced for IRL scale to 1/10th kerbal scale are there? If you rescale the system 2.5x - 3x most things should work perfectly.

But, if you are looking to scale, I think there is a little more to it than that (painful mathematics unless I remember it wrong),  mod support thread would be a good place to start.

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get that, but if I rescale my system, then a bunch of other modpacks need to be changed as well. I might take this into my own hands and make a MM config, what's a good start? Should I reduce fuel count to 64%?

SMURFF is the go-to mod for easily rebalancing almost all your parts to fit different scale systems. Also it is a masterpiece of Module Manager config, if you are trying to learn what you can do with MM, its a good place to look for inspiration. Squad nerfs its parts compared to real life rockets mostly by increasing the thrust to weight ratio. Therefore pods, tanks and engines are all heavier than the real counterpart, engine thrust is also greatly reduced. You can learn more about this on the SMURFF thread.

It might help to think of the stock planets as KSP tutorial mode. It is easy to get to orbit and figure out the basics of orbital mechanics without having to get to stuck figuring all the details that make rocket science hard. Stock parts, and almost all mods are balanced to this, 

Once you've got this down, a 2.5x sized Kerbin is the place to go, now you need to design multi stage rockets and the proportions look more realistic. You can look at a picture of a Soyuz launcher, stack up tanks and engines so it looks about right and it should get a reasonable payload to a low orbit. 

Edited by Nightside
more things
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Recolor'ed R-7 parts FTW!

(Food for thought - having a few texture options for the R-7/Soyuz rocket allows modders, such as myself, to have different variants of the rocket in the tech tree .. kindof reflects the fact that a modern day Soyuz booster is just a tad more efficient/etc than the older 60s-era R-7 varients.)

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12 minutes ago, tjsnh said:

Recolor'ed R-7 parts FTW!

(Food for thought - having a few texture options for the R-7/Soyuz rocket allows modders, such as myself, to have different variants of the rocket in the tech tree .. kindof reflects the fact that a modern day Soyuz booster is just a tad more efficient/etc than the older 60s-era R-7 varients.)

I will be really happy to distribute the textures as I play around with them.

Officially, when making history drops, I will be aiming to include an 'alt' variant to basically all my parts (Usually focusing on a more IRL colour scheme).

This allows you to do things like have the nice stripes on Salyut 7, but also a more restricted colour scheme for mashup-type craft.

Nice idea! I like that a lot :) 

Edited by Beale
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3 hours ago, Beale said:

when making history drops,

This is going to be a real wild-card for a lot of mods, and mod developers. Its hard to tell for sure what parts Squad is going to include, but from some of their posts it sounds like a fairly comprehensive lineup of both US and Soviet hardware which will create significant overlap with mods like Tantares, BDB, etc etc.

I still feel though, that having a variety of models to choose from is going to be a godsend for mods like mine - not to mention the portion of the player base who won't have the expansion pack.

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1 hour ago, debaker02 said:

@Beale

The recent work you have been doing in the new colors is a very nice addition.  

Many thanks!

1 hour ago, tjsnh said:

This is going to be a real wild-card for a lot of mods, and mod developers. Its hard to tell for sure what parts Squad is going to include, but from some of their posts it sounds like a fairly comprehensive lineup of both US and Soviet hardware which will create significant overlap with mods like Tantares, BDB, etc etc.

I still feel though, that having a variety of models to choose from is going to be a godsend for mods like mine - not to mention the portion of the player base who won't have the expansion pack.

I think there's room for both easily, the MH parts are really basic IMO. They are good for a nice introduction.

C9s-VDeXsAAvjDy.jpg

But, I think the mod like this can sit comfortably between a realism mod and the basic parts.

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49 minutes ago, Beale said:

Many thanks!

I think there's room for both easily, the MH parts are really basic IMO. They are good for a nice introduction.

C9s-VDeXsAAvjDy.jpg

But, I think the mod like this can sit comfortably between a realism mod and the basic parts.

Is that pic some parts from MH? It doesn't look familiar, but I may have missed it.

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4 hours ago, tjsnh said:

Is that pic some parts from MH? It doesn't look familiar, but I may have missed it.

Yep, and here are some of the Russian parts.

sVEnIfw.png

 

New FX.

R0iBzq3.png A lot of hot gas goes a long way.

GlN6e6H.png

C7EKln4.png What is it?

LKsz7Ww.png L O N G B O Y E

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AND MORE PROGRESS? YES!

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EBfdNNR.png

qR2PfDY.png

b2j8sHO.png

Of course, the colour schemes are not set, please give me your feedback!
Beyond this, of course this style is something a little new, any artistic feedback is appreciated (Agreement is not guaranteed though :wink: )

Edited by Beale
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