Klapaucius

Tell me about Homeworld

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KSP is the only video game I have ever played seriously (though I do play board games a lot), and I have only been at it a year.

The last thing I need in my life is another distraction....but....I see several posters on these forums are Homeworld fans.  I knew about Homeworld when it came out because I am a big Yes fan, and their music was included in it. But other than that, I thought nothing of it. A lot of bands were doing stuff like that at the time. 

But I've since come to learn it is considered a classic and a few years ago some of the series was remastered.  I've watched a few Youtube videos (including Scott Manly with Kharak) but I still don't have a really good sense of what is going on.  But I am very intrigued.  

So, for KSP players, what is the appeal?  It looks like a completely different animal.

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Homeworld is the only good 3D space RTS game that I've ever come across...  It's a classic, and the remastered edition is available on Steam now along with the standalone ground-based RTS (Deserts of Karak) which I also liked. 

Not a sandbox game at all though, so very different gameplay from KSP.  

You have to like selecting groups of units and ordering them to attack stuff, mine resources, build new units, etc.  Not much in terms of actually building anything though.  If looking for an RTS that does have some pretty decent building element to it, maybe look at "Stronghold: Legends" possibly?  ...if you like building and defending castles.  Another good sandbox option, without the war/conflict component, might be something like "Cities: Skylines"

I tend to keep about 100-ish games on my Steam wishlist and then pick em off as they rotate on sale.  So I don't necessarily recommend running out and buying these 2 at the moment.  I'd probably wait em out til maybe a sale.  Although Stronghold is not too bad right now, you could probably get it for under $10 if you wait awhile though.

 

 

 

Edited by XLjedi

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How steep is the learning curve as far as just getting your head around how to play it?  I've spent more hours than I care to admit on KSP and I still am a neophyte. How is it compared to KSP in that regard?

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25 minutes ago, Klapaucius said:

How steep is the learning curve as far as just getting your head around how to play it?

Low. If you've ever played an RTS all it really adds gameplay wise is the 3rd dimension, and that is pretty light from my experience.

Note the game didn't grab me at all but not due to its quality. I'm just not an RTS fan. I only tried it because it looked like an in-space version of Command And Conquer, which I did enjoy back in the 90s. It basically was that but I had personally moved on to turn based games.

 

Edited by 5thHorseman

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@5thHorseman Thanks for the message. I've never played an RTS, so that might be a barrier. Actually, I had not played games at all (not counting console games when I was a kid) until KSP.  But a lot of folks talk about the story behind it, and that has me very interested.

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IIRC, in Homeworld, the missions in the storyline progress in such a way as to limit your ships/choices and basically teach you how to play introducing new craft and abilities as the missions progress.

The 3D movement is not exactly my favorite gameplay element on a 2D screen, but they did about the best job you could possibly do.  Question is...  Are you looking for another game like KSP? ...or for something maybe different, but might appeal to a mature KSP player?  I've got a 100+ game library on Steam you're welcome to look at to get an idea of the kind of games I like.

As far as sandbox games like KSP, I have 6 others that I bought but haven't really done anything with yet:  Space Engineers, Starmade, Empyrion, Interstellar Rift, Simple Planes, From the Depths

One day when I get bored, or while waiting for a version/bug to resolve itself, I'll give one a try.  I tend to prefer sandbox games where the creations/designs can be shared with others.

Edited by XLjedi

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@XLjedi  Thanks for the detailed response.  I think I am keen to try something different. I cannot imagine a sandbox I'd enjoy more than this one we are in right now :)  I watched Scott Manley do a bit of a playthrough of the beginning of Kharak and I have glanced at a few other Youtube videos. I think the story, graphics, the fact so many rave about it (and even though it is not huge, the Yes connection) factor in.  And aside from Yes, putting Barber's Adagio for Strings into a video game is just awesome.  Finally, I saw @SkunkTwerks Kharak builds on KerbalX and downloaded a few, and that got me to thinking about it.

 

BTW: I have Simple Planes and Simple Rockets. As you may or may not know, I got into KSP inadvertently because I was asked to lead a pilot program for some highschool students giving them and intuitive sense of orbital mechanics. The only problem is KSP has a very steep learning curve, and the students I was working with did not have the best educational background as well. So, I've been looking for something easier to get them started. Simple Planes (and I'm eagerly awaiting Simple Rockets 2) fit the bill wonderfully. I'm not sure a full on KSP player will get a whole lot of satisfaction out of them (though I have not spent a lot of time with it yet), but they are really well done for what they are trying to accomplish.

 

And if you have not seen the trailer, it is brilliant.

 

 

Edited by Klapaucius

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Interesting that Simple Rockets is a 2D game...  I would've expected it to be more like their Simple Planes game.

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19 hours ago, Klapaucius said:

Thanks for the message. I've never played an RTS, so that might be a barrier.

Don't let it be a barrier.  Like anything, new stuff will just take a little time to learn.  

Give it a spin, worst that happens is your out a few bucks.   If you don't, you could regret missing out on something for years. 

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As it happens Im replaying through the remastered versions as i speak.

EXCELLENT games.

No the learning curve is not  too bad, compared to KSP its a cinch. Its nothing like KSP at all, except its space-related.

To be honest its not the most complicated game, but that doesnt make it boring. 

 

Actually quite a good game to introduce you to RTSs.

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Glad you enjoyed those crafts @Klapaucius! That reminds me, I built the HW:DoK Tactical Strike Fighter and never got around to posting it... I'll get on that!

Seems I'm a little late to the conversation, but I LOVED Homeworld and highly recommend it. It's pretty dissimilar to KSP, but they do complement each other nicely.

The original Homeworld, in my opinion, struck the perfect balance of simplicity, tactical novelty, and a phenomenally compelling narrative. Manipulating fleets in full 3D space felt positively revolutionary in its day, and I'm surprised more games haven't followed suit because it was freaking awesome. It takes a little getting used to, but you'll be pretty good at it by the time you're halfway into the campaign (which was positively fantastic for its story and level design).

Homeworld 2 had a slicker UI and awesome graphics, but IMHO had just a few too many things to micromanage (research, modules, etc...) for my tastes. And while the campaign was pretty good, there was no way it was going to live up to the original in terms of epic destiny.

Homeworld: Deserts of Kharak was a much less unique game. A decent intro to the RTS genre, it wasn't too complicated and the campaign progressed nicely (although again, not as compelling as the original HW). There are better land-based RTS games out there, but HW:DoK had special meaning for those of us who really got into HW.

-SkunkTwerks

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47 minutes ago, SkunkTwerks said:

Homeworld: Deserts of Kharak was a much less unique game. A decent intro to the RTS genre, it wasn't too complicated and the campaign progressed nicely (although again, not as compelling as the original HW). There are better land-based RTS games out there, but HW:DoK had special meaning for those of us who really got into HW.

-SkunkTwerks

Would Kharak then be a better place to start as far as getting my head around RTS before diving into Homeworld?  There is a bundled pack on Steam available (I'm waiting to see if it will go on sale) that has Homeworlds 1 and 2 and Kharak plus the original versions of 1 and 2.

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1 minute ago, Klapaucius said:

Would Kharak then be a better place to start as far as getting my head around RTS before diving into Homeworld?  There is a bundled pack on Steam available (I'm waiting to see if it will go on sale) that has Homeworlds 1 and 2 and Kharak plus the original versions of 1 and 2.

Whenever that bundle goes on sale, I'd say it's well worth your $.

Which one you try first might depend on your playstyle & motivations. DoK will give you an easier introduction to the genre, but HW will give you a more meaningful & compelling one. The original HW campaign was absolutely outstanding, but nobody ever said it was easy and there's only one difficulty setting. I'll admit to shamelessly using a strategy guide my first time through HW, but still loving every minute of it. The DoK campaign has three difficulty settings and more tutorial guidance, but its storytelling just doesn't pack as much firepower.

Anyway, while you wait for a sale... Other RTS super-classics like Age of Empires II or Starcraft, would make *ideal* introductions to RTS gaming, and their remastered/HD versions aren't too pricey. As luck would have it, Starcraft is even on sale right now, and I'm downloading it in a sudden impulsive wave of nostalgia.

-SkunkTwerks

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23 minutes ago, Klapaucius said:

Would Kharak then be a better place to start as far as getting my head around RTS before diving into Homeworld?  There is a bundled pack on Steam available (I'm waiting to see if it will go on sale) that has Homeworlds 1 and 2 and Kharak plus the original versions of 1 and 2.

Story-wise, Kharak is actually a prequel for Homeworld. You can play Homeworld and still follow the story without having to play Kharak, but you can get a lot of background stories from Kharak (Mainly, the reason why they are going to space in the first place and the story about the planet itself)

One thing that I noticed about Homeworld series is that, compared with other RTS games, Homeworld is rather slow paced-games (You don't get "build barracks, spam train infantry, and set the rally point to enemy base"), Homeworld is much slower, necessitating careful thinking and strategic decision (Except Kharak, which is rather normal-paced, and only in 2D plane, not 3D). That said, if you managed to bring that oh-sweet-battlecruisers or having enemy mothership on your grip, the reward feels so satisfying

As an old-time RTS player who grew with games like StarCraft, Red Alert 2 and Tiberian Sun, I am glad that there's still people on this day that still remember and play old RTS game, which is considered (mostly) dead genre by many developers today (I don't know why, maybe it's difficult to implement microtransaction on RTS?). That said, reading this thread urges me to reopen my old Starcraft folder to have some fun and nostalgia

 

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I have the HW Remastered 3-game collection on steam, and i have a few things to say:

 

It's immersive. The game is amazingly gigantic. An open world where you wage space-warfare, gather resources, etc. I like playing against AI every few days. I choose a quick match, make some AIs, and then play one game before going to work or doing other life things.

It's complicated... Yeah. Really really complicated. The tutorial is like drinking bleach, so for the past 3 years of owning the game(s) I haven't even touched the tutorial. I just taught myself how to play using Youtube and logic.

It's old. a 19 year old game, but still it holds up to the test of time, just like Wolfenstein or Half-Life. If you get any version of the game, wait until the Steam Spring sale and buy the remastered collection for cheap. It's worth it.

It's incredible. All the little details on the ships, the campaign, it all comes together to make a pretty amazing game. It just feels really nice to play, and navigating the 3D world makes you feel like you're playing an old arcade game. But, it is a slow game, as ARS mentioned above ^) so don't expect to go through the whole story-line pretty quickly. 

Anyway, if you do get it: Enjoy it! Have fun playing a nice 'ol 19 year old simulator that was top of it's class in the 90s. 

Edited by Lo Var Lachland

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10 hours ago, Klapaucius said:

Would Kharak then be a better place to start as far as getting my head around RTS before diving into Homeworld?  There is a bundled pack on Steam available (I'm waiting to see if it will go on sale) that has Homeworlds 1 and 2 and Kharak plus the original versions of 1 and 2.

While waiting for Homeworld…  rather than stepping thru Kharak…  Just go get Supreme Commander 2!  It's like $15 bucks.

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43 minutes ago, XLjedi said:

Supreme Commander 2

Ah, the Supreme Commander 2. The game where you throw absurd amount of gigantic units (That looks tiny compared to the scale of the map) before unleashing experimental units that sometimes borderline game-breaker. The nostalgia :)

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5 minutes ago, ARS said:

Ah, the Supreme Commander 2. The game where you throw absurd amount of gigantic units (That looks tiny compared to the scale of the map) before unleashing experimental units that sometimes borderline game-breaker. The nostalgia :)

It's a good game (I still like it), cheap, popular, and a fair representation of what RTS gameplay is all about...

"Command & Conquer 3" and the "Star Wars Empire at War" bundle are cheap and would also be excellent choices! 

I personally might even prefer Empire at War over the other two...  I like how it spans space and ground battles; but I'm also biased toward the franchise.

Edited by XLjedi

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Homeworld 1 and 2 and Kharak all went on sale as a bundle for $22, so I just picked them up.

So, while I know Homeworld is the original, would I be better off starting with Kharak? Storywise, is it better to go chronologically, or do Homeworld and then the Prequel? Or, does it not matter? 

As of today, I am taking a break from KSP for a while, though I still have  a few videos to post and a few craft to finish uploading. From that point,  K.R.A.S.S.H. Industries will be on indefinite hiatus.

Edited by Klapaucius

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47 minutes ago, XLjedi said:

Play Homeworld before Kharak

Thanks. Just out of curiosity, which of the above reasons pertains, or is it something else?  Also, the bundle also includes the original Homeworld 1 and 2. Is there a big difference (other than graphics) between the original and remastered?  Any reason to start with that one?  I'm intending to check them all out at some point...

Edited by Klapaucius

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26 minutes ago, Klapaucius said:

Thanks. Just out of curiosity, which of the above reasons pertains, or is it something else?  Also, the bundle also includes the original Homeworld 1 and 2. Is there a big difference (other than graphics) between the original and remastered?  Any reason to start with that one?  I'm intending to check them all out at some point...

I think there's some benefit to knowing the original Homeworld story first, and then letting Kharak fill in questions about the history later is more fun.  Might be some spoilers in Kharak if you play it first.  Frankly though, I haven't played much beyond the first or second mission in Kharak so don't really know too much about it.  Just a gut feeling that I think Homeworld first is better.

Edited by XLjedi

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52 minutes ago, XLjedi said:

I think there's some benefit to knowing the original Homeworld story first, and then letting Kharak fill in questions about the history later is more fun.  Might be some spoilers in Kharak if you play it first.  Frankly though, I haven't played much beyond the first or second mission in Kharak so don't really know too much about it.  Just a gut feeling that I think Homeworld first is better.

Thanks!  Is there any difference between the original and remastered release content or gameplay-wise?  The bundle comes with both.

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