Do we really need game modes?

[Vanamonde]

We've got sandbox, science, and career, but also (soon) toggleable antenna restrictions, adjustable heat severity, etc. Instead of having those options split between types of choices, why not just have one game mode with each of those things as player choices? Gather science on/off, pay for parts on/off, tech unlock parts on/off, heat high/medium/low, and so on. Just spitballing. 

[passinglurker]

10 minutes ago, Vanamonde said:

We've got sandbox, science, and career, but also (soon) toggleable antenna restrictions, adjustable heat severity, etc. Instead of having those options split between types of choices, why not just have one game mode with each of those things as player choices? Gather science on/off, pay for parts on/off, tech unlock parts on/off, heat high/medium/low, and so on. Just spitballing. 

It would make sense to roll the modes into a common system. Such an overhaul could open up the opportunity to make the system moddable which is always nice, but still I think "modes" would still prominently exist as preset defaults for the sake of establishing a baseline recommended game play experience for reviewers, new players who don't know what all the settings do, and even veteran players who want to compare performance and accomplishments under conditions common to one another.

[luizopiloto]

I only play sandbox...
And in my humble opinion, Squad's only error was the creation of the actual career mode instead of multiplayer mode...

[passinglurker]

Just now, luizopiloto said:

I only play sandbox...
And in my humble opinion, Squad's only error was the creation of the actual career mode instead of multiplayer mode...

Not everyone is so easily amused.

Without a fun default it would be very hard to make multiplayer work because there wouldn't be standards for multiple players to share in common. As such Kerbal needs to complete it's balance and polish passes before it can consider multiplayer.

[Ozymandias_the_Goat]

I would like to actually do science in sandbox mode. I think the "modes" should be still there, but once you start out, there would be more features so that the modes would blend as you augment your game more. I think this is the pretty common opinion of all the posters, so i'll curtail my essay here.

I too only play sandbox...

[Just Jim]

I play only career. I wouldn't have a problem with rolling it all together so long as contracts are still available as an option. And I would welcome other options to turn it up even harder.

[adsii1970]

35 minutes ago, Just Jim said:

I play only career. I wouldn't have a problem with rolling it all together so long as contracts are still available as an option. And I would welcome other options to turn it up even harder.

 

And I play sandbox, although I would like the option to do contracts, even if the points were useless...

[Waxing_Kibbous]

That makes sense, I wonder if having those options and eliminating the distinct modes could make the code cleaner, or easier to build on in the future.

[regex]

I endorse this product/service.

[Superfluous J]

I've been thinking this for a while. I'm pretty sure I even said it at least once*. There is a lot of utility in being able to turn on and off funds, experience, science, contracts, and all that separately.

You could even implement "configurations", 3 of which match what we currently have. And people could upload and download them, kind of like mods.

*So dibs! No just kidding I don't actually care.

Edited September 21, 2016 by 5thHorseman

[mattinoz]

4 hours ago, luizopiloto said:

I only play sandbox...
And in my humble opinion, Squad's only error was the creation of the actual career mode instead of multiplayer mode...

Sandbox doesn't have enough risk vs reward to provide a competitive environment for multi-player.

[linuxgurugamer]

5 minutes ago, mattinoz said:

Sandbox doesn't have enough risk vs reward to provide a competitive environment for multi-player.

Why does have to be competitive?  Why not cooperative?

[Alshain]

20 minutes ago, 5thHorseman said:

You could even implement "configurations", 3 of which match what we currently have. And people could upload and download them, kind of like mods.

Or just presets like the current difficulty options are.

[nightingale]

There's not that much left that directly relies on game modes:

• Strategies - get broken if you remove funds or science
• Contracts - get broken if you remove funds or science
• Funds - get broken if you remove contracts (strategies and milestones don't give enough on their own)

So really the only viable combination that isn't available would be "career without Strategies", but it's pretty easy to ignore the Admin Building if that isn't your thing.

Of course, other combinations could be made viable (science with contracts is probably the one I've heard requested before), but any of those would require a non-trivial development effort.

[Alshain]

@nightingale Contracts don't get broken if you remove science.  You can get science in sandbox mode now, it just doesn't do anything.  So if a contract requires you get science, you can still get science... without the points.

[mattinoz]

19 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Why does have to be competitive?  Why not cooperative?

Having value in different styles is useful to co-op as well.

[nightingale]

2 minutes ago, Alshain said:

@nightingale Contracts don't get broken if you remove science.  You can get science in sandbox mode now, it just doesn't do anything.  So if a contract requires you get science, you can still get science... without the points.

Okay - that one was a bit of a stretch.  But they would need significant balance work to function properly in a no science career mode.  "Launch our first vessel", "Escape the atmosphere", etc. are all rather silly when you have all parts unlocked.

[Alshain]

1 minute ago, nightingale said:

Okay - that one was a bit of a stretch.  But they would need significant balance work to function properly in a no science career mode.  "Launch our first vessel", "Escape the atmosphere", etc. are all rather silly when you have all parts unlocked.

You say that as if they aren't rather silly now.  Has anyone ever failed the "Launch our first vessel" contract?

[Superfluous J]

1 hour ago, Alshain said:

You say that as if they aren't rather silly now.  Has anyone ever failed the "Launch our first vessel" contract?

*winces, slowly raising a wavering hand*

Granted, it was because I figured any staging event would count as a "launch" when in fact you have to use propellant to leave the ground. Or at least do one of those 2 things. Simply staging a parachute doesn't cut it. I know

In any case, I don't see why "contracts without funds" can't just ignore the funds. No up-front money, and no payout money. If the contract is only for money, maybe it doesn't get offered, or you can tick a "don't offer contracts with invalid payouts for this mode."

Some things go hand-in-hand, of course. There's no real reason to have a tech tree if you've disabled science. But many people have asked for science in sandbox so that should be a thing. And I think contracts should be available in all modes. I'd probably play sandbox more if I could get contracts in it.

1 hour ago, nightingale said:

"Launch our first vessel", "Escape the atmosphere", etc. are all rather silly when you have all parts unlocked.

Not as silly as it sounds at first. If you start the game with $0, set it so you have to pay the unlock cost to even gain access to parts, and make the contact rewards pretty low...

Though I suppose you could call that "career without science" just as well as I'm considering it "sandbox with money"

Edited September 21, 2016 by 5thHorseman

[vasya pupkin]

yes, i do need. all of them.

[pandaman]

I like the idea of sandbox being the 'everything configurable' mode.  But with others being simply 'presets' of that (eg. Career, Science etc.)  and/or whatever other combinations make some sense as a  game mode. 

[omelaw]

I want to have an option for raise kerbel's experience level, not 5 stars form the astronaut complex

[Arugela]

I think they just need to improve the career mode. Or add more options to it. Say if the tech tree and other things weren't a tree, which is unrealistic, but like older space games and you got the items through various more realistic means. Say, you can talk to engineers and spend real time having the tech developed and put money into it with chances of failure or the option to switch subjects. Random stuff with engineering firms working on items you can get from them permanently instead of simply testing random items. Look at every space or non space game from the mid 90's to the early 80's and pic something interesting. That is where all the better designs were.

[CSE]

6 hours ago, omelaw said:

I want to have an option for raise kerbel's experience level, not 5 stars form the astronaut complex

This is in the 1.2 pre-release - it's been asked for a number of times, and there's now a kerbal experience setting in the game difficulty options.

[passinglurker]

6 hours ago, omelaw said:

I want to have an option for raise kerbel's experience level, not 5 stars form the astronaut complex

As I understand this mobile labs can now perform this function or there is an optional difficulty setting that applies kerbal experience immediately after it is earned.