kerbal ftl [Min KSP 1.12.2] Blueshift: Kerbal FTL

[obnox twin]

I might need this mod for my laptop as I may or may not have yeeted some kerbals out of the kerbin system and are in a sun orbit frozen in a freezer and I have kerbalism installed so how do I rendvouz to a target with Blueshift and any planet mods the doesn't lag my game aka me on a laptop so something that doesn't go hard on ram.

[Ooglak Kerman]

1 hour ago, obnox twin said:

I might need this mod for my laptop as I may or may not have yeeted some kerbals out of the kerbin system and are in a sun orbit frozen in a freezer and I have kerbalism installed so how do I rendvouz to a target with Blueshift and any planet mods the doesn't lag my game aka me on a laptop so something that doesn't go hard on ram.

Blueshift warp drives have a function to auto-circularize an orbit.  If you have a vessel as your target and get within the required distance and then auto-circularize it will rendezvous you.  Right handy.

However.... if your warp ship is OP, you might not be able to dial back the thrust limiter enough to let you stop within the necessary rendezvous distance.  Balance for the mission is key and I've found it's best to underpower ships.

In Interplanetary space the default minimum distance is 100KM.  In interstellar, the distance is 1000KM.  You will also need to account for your relative velocity from when you entered warp.  Remember, you are translating - not accelerating.  If you start into warp moving away from the target, you get to the target and drop out of warp moving away at the same starting rate.  This can be all manner of "fun" if you come out of warp at a planet near the warp cutoff altitude.

[Ooglak Kerman]

Interesting tidbit.  If you enter a jumpgate on a ship with a klaw that is armed, it will grab the jumpgate and not pass you through.  Releasing the klaw results in a jump.

[Angelo Kerman]

Blueshift 1.7.4 is now available:

- Fixed interaction issue between Blueshift and Kerbal Flying Saucers.

[Ooglak Kerman]

5 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

Blueshift 1.7.4 is now available:

- Fixed interaction issue between Blueshift and Kerbal Flying Saucers.

Can you remind me what was the interaction issue?

[Angelo Kerman]

15 minutes ago, Ooglak Kerman said:

Can you remind me what was the interaction issue?

Generators in Blueshift/KFS will drain gravity waves when not running, and if one mod's generators aren't running but another mod's are, you can run into drainage problems. This patch fixes it.

[Ooglak Kerman]

1 minute ago, Angel-125 said:

Generators in Blueshift/KFS will drain gravity waves when not running, and if one mod's generators aren't running but another mod's are, you can run into drainage problems. This patch fixes it.

Right.   I recall now.  Thanks. 

I have a good handle now on the use of the warp engine.  Now it's time to sort out the use of the gravatic engines for deorbiting.  I've leaned so heavily on mechjeb for chem-rocket stuff, there is a lot of re-learning to be done.

[Angelo Kerman]

43 minutes ago, Ooglak Kerman said:

Right.   I recall now.  Thanks. 

I have a good handle now on the use of the warp engine.  Now it's time to sort out the use of the gravatic engines for deorbiting.  I've leaned so heavily on mechjeb for chem-rocket stuff, there is a lot of re-learning to be done.

Have you tried MJ with the KFS gravitic engine? MechJeb was one of the considerations for the original design...

[Ooglak Kerman]

I've not tried it.  I'll give a try and report back to you.

I had thought it wouldnt't work since there isn't dV to work with.  Be an interesting test.

[SkyFall2489]

On 4/14/2022 at 4:03 PM, Angel-125 said:

Have you tried MJ with the KFS gravitic engine? MechJeb was one of the considerations for the original design...

The manuver system expects you to have increasing TWR due to draining fuel, but that doesn't happen with the gravitic engine, so I dunno what will happen.

[Ooglak Kerman]

I've completed a few tests done with Mechjeb and the GND-01 Gravatic engine.  Thrust limiter set to 35% in all tests since it's a super basic craft that is very light.

Ascent Guidance:  Partial pass.  Ascends to the correct AP, waits until it is right on the node to throttle up for circularization with predictably bad results.

Landing Guidance: Landing fail.  It will set the designated landing point - though you need to dial back the thrust limiter a lot.   It does not throttle back up to land.  Splat.  I need to do more testing though.

Maneuver planner: Change AP from 72 to 200 KM.  Pass.  It waits until right at the maneuver node though so it's not accurate.

Maneuver planner:  Circularize at next AP to 200 KM.  Partial pass.  It waits until it is right at the maneuver node to perform the maneuver so the circularization is sloppy and it wants to correct.

Maneuver planner: Hohmann transfer to Mun.  Successful encounter.  100% thrust limiter

Maneuver planner: Hohmann transfer to Minmus.  No plane match.  Fail.  Stopped well short of encounter.  100% thrust limiter.

Mechjeb is calculating the dV that is required for the maneuver, but the craft is not showing any available dV so MJ appears unable to calculate when to start the burn and waits till zero.  Since MJ doesn't appear to know what dV it has, it is all on or all off with the throttle - that I can see so not much finesse.

So far, it appears that the gravatic is great if you are adept at hand flying craft for all the things.  It really shines for me when used in conjunction with a warp engine.  Use the gravatic to get to warp altitude and then auto-circularize.  Flying the gravatic will be very much an intuitive thing rather than by the numbers.  Rendezvous will likely be challenging since the gravatic will need to be dialed way way back.

@Angel-125 does the mass of the craft really matter for the gravatic engine? 

 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Ooglak Kerman

[Angelo Kerman]

57 minutes ago, Ooglak Kerman said:

I've completed a few tests done with Mechjeb and the GND-01 Gravatic engine.  Thrust limiter set to 35% in all tests since it's a super basic craft that is very light.

Ascent Guidance:  Partial pass.  Ascends to the correct AP, waits until it is right on the node to throttle up for circularization with predictably bad results.

Landing Guidance: Landing fail.  It will set the designated landing point - though you need to dial back the thrust limiter a lot.   It does not throttle back up to land.  Splat.  I need to do more testing though.

Maneuver planner: Change AP from 72 to 200 KM.  Pass.  It waits until right at the maneuver node though so it's not accurate.

Maneuver planner:  Circularize at next AP to 200 KM.  Partial pass.  It waits until it is right at the maneuver node to perform the maneuver so the circularization is sloppy and it wants to correct.

Maneuver planner: Hohmann transfer to Mun.  Successful encounter.  100% thrust limiter

Maneuver planner: Hohmann transfer to Minmus.  No plane match.  Fail.  Stopped well short of encounter.  100% thrust limiter.

Mechjeb is calculating the dV that is required for the maneuver, but the craft is not showing any available dV so MJ appears unable to calculate when to start the burn and waits till zero.  Since MJ doesn't appear to know what dV it has, it is all on or all off with the throttle - that I can see so not much finesse.

So far, it appears that the gravatic is great if you are adept at hand flying craft for all the things.  It really shines for me when used in conjunction with a warp engine.  Use the gravatic to get to warp altitude and then auto-circularize.  Flying the gravatic will be very much an intuitive thing rather than by the numbers.  Rendezvous will likely be challenging since the gravatic will need to be dialed way way back.

@Angel-125 does the mass of the craft really matter for the gravatic engine? 

 

Yup, the mass of the craft does matter.

[Ooglak Kerman]

@Angel-125 I plan to test this, but thought I'd go ahead and ask.

If I set a very small moon that has a very small SOI as my target and that SOI is less than the necessary auto-rendezvous distance, what happens when I auto-circularize?
Hale in the Sarnus system is an example.  It has a 6 KM warp cutoff and an SOI of maybe 10 KM or so.  If I got to around 7KM and auto-circularized would it treat it as a rendezvous?  That could be tragic.

[Ooglak Kerman]

Well.. that was interesting.  Hale is too close to Sarnus and inside that warp cutoff limit.  That's a non-starter.  I tried for Ovok.  It has a warp cutoff of 26KM and it's SOI is actually inside that at 23KM.  I made it to SOI, but flamed out.  Fortunately my vector took me away from it and Sarnus so I was able to get a restart.

I then set Ovok as the target and got inside of rendezvous distance to see what would happen, but it just circularized me in Sarnus orbit.  Cool, it knows the difference between a celestial body and a vehicle.

Eeloo was EZPZ and the view is E-ticket

Edited April 23, 2022 by Ooglak Kerman

[Ooglak Kerman]

Ovok turns out to be an interesting proposition.  I built a pretty basic warp ship that had a gravatic engine and that's it.

Ovok has an  orbit that is ~6,748KM around Sarnus - which has a warp cut-off at about 5,300KM.  You can't get into the SOI of Ovok and auto-circularize with the warp engine.  The trick was to get into a 6,000KM orbit of Sarnus and wait to catch up with Ovok.  Then set a maneuver node to get an encounter with Ovok and do so with the gravatic engine.  Then set the maneuver node to circularize and there you are.  It's more of a rendezvous than a hohmann transfer.  Made a ~23KM orbit of Ovok.

The view is one I could live with.  Next will be landing.  I expect it will be using the gravatic to deorbit and then use the gravatic in RCS mode for the landing.  I'm doing this in sandbox mode, so not sure it really counts, but it's good experience and a great view.

Spoiler

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Ooglak Kerman

[Ooglak Kerman]

Landing on Ovok is anti-climatic.  It all happens slowly.  Orbit is like 14 m/s.  Gravatic RCS dialed back to around 30 was good.  Patience is key.  Once you land, you then need to push down with the RCS ("N" key) until it all sorts itself out.  The scenery on Ovok makes Dres seem like the Las Vegas strip.  But the view that Jeb had.

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Ooglak Kerman

[Rakete]

@Angel-125

I think I found a bug / simulation issue:

I used this ugly testcraft: https://www.filemail.com/d/zvceznxosbhdxux for testing reasons. (includes an LqDe-Tank from Far Future Mod by Nertea, as I had no other LqDe at hand). In case you can't load it: Mk1 command pod, 4 or so batteries in size of the little stock command pod, gaviolum tank, S2 Core, an additional S2 Displacement generator for testing reasons, 8x S1 coils, LqDe tank.

As soon, as the vessel leaves Kerbins SOI using Warp the sound of the game makes cracking bumpy noises. As soon as I activate the additional S2 displacement generator (for testing reasons, to track down the issue) the noises are gone. I guess it's KSPs flameout sound triggered overlapping and aborted during the ride. As you can see in the test vessel, there is enough gravitic waves for the vessel in comparison to the installed warp coils (demand is 40 due to 8 S1 coils , generation is from the s2-warpcore is 150). I guess it has to do with the different simulation timesteps as soon as you leave Kerbins SOI to an interplanetary SOI. No rescale or something like this envolved - KSP's stock solar system. Cheat for test enabled: infinite Electricity.

Hope it helps with debugging.

 

Edit1: I did some further investigations. Seems these cracking sounds appear if you have multiple smaller coils on your craft (-> StarTrek typical nacelles). Maybe some kind of kind of bigger buffering of the gravitic waves or something is needed ? If I deactivate all but two, the cracking sounds (flameout sounds) are gone. Other option for bugfix: Disable the flameout sound for all warp engines/cores/etc (doesn't make sense anyway) - this might be the easiest way of fix. ---> It is not the root issue, as i found out in Edit 2: so this is just a symptome, so deactivation of the flameout sounds does not fix... see below

 

Edit2: Also: I am not sure why this happens: With the abovementioned craft in solar orbit:  activate only one coil: Max warpfactor 0.29 .... activate a second of the coils: it drops to 0.09 (flickering) activate a third: the max warpfactor rises to somewhere between 0.74 and 0.43 (flickering in the rhythm of the bumpy sounds (KSP's flameout sound crippled, I guess, due to multiple triggering)). Activate a fourth one -> Warpfactor drops to 0.29 flickering (in the rhythm of the cracking sounds from the above mentioned issue (Now I am pretty sure it has to do with each other)... Somehow I feel, that the vessel's nacelles are not constantly supplied with energy/waves, causing these strange oscillations in the calculations. Maybe the calculation plugin needs could need an robustness fix?  Issues are gone if you activate the additional S2-displacement-Generator. Then the warp factors increase to 2c and above (as written above the S2 core should deliver more than enough waves for 8 active S1 coils. But the S2 Core should be enough for the a S1 coils and works like that as long as you stay in Kerbins SOI. The oscillation issue starts even with less then 8 and more than 2 active coils in a solar orbit).... So I am sure now, it's all about the same simulation issue when you have multiple coils active (for a real star trek feeling). maybe some big buffer/storage for the waves are needed? Or it might be the issue in the warpcore, that might have a problem with coping more than one coil delivering warp capacity? Maybe a warpcapacity buffer/storage in the code might solve it... Just speculation, as you know your code best. Just wonderingof different root issues. I am pretty sure, there are simulation/calculation oscillations. Maybe buffers can kill them.

 

Please feel not offended, just trying to provide help to further optimize this great mod!

Edited April 24, 2022 by Rakete

[Ooglak Kerman]

1 hour ago, Rakete said:

@Angel-125

I think I found a bug / simulation issue:

I used this ugly testcraft: https://www.filemail.com/d/zvceznxosbhdxux for testing reasons. (includes an LqDe-Tank from Far Future Mod by Nertea, as I had no other LqDe at hand). In case you can't load it: Mk1 command pod, 4 or so batteries in size of the little stock command pod, gaviolum tank, S2 Core, S2 Aux generator, 8x S1 coils, LqDe tank.

 

@Rakete Can you post a screenshot of your craft?  I don't have FFT installed so I can't install the LqDe tank.  Is the S2 Aux generator another FFT thing?

Edited April 24, 2022 by Ooglak Kerman

[Rakete]

3 hours ago, Ooglak Kerman said:

@Rakete Can you post a screenshot of your craft?  I don't have FFT installed so I can't install the LqDe tank.  Is the S2 Aux generator another FFT thing?

Unfortunately not. as I am not on my Computer today anymore (and might not be in the next days due to work) But it consisted of the following:  (top to down)

1. Mk1 command pod,

2. 4x battery Z-1K

3. S2 displacement generator (belongs to this Mod!) for testing reasons

4. graviolium tank (belongs to this mod)

5. a LqDe-Tank of your choice (required to use the warp core from this Mod. In this Case I used one from Nertea - anyone will do)

6. S2 Warp core (belongs to this mod)

7. 8x S1 Warp coils (from this mod) - attached to the auxillery thing - experiment with several of them on and off out of Kerbins SOI (solar orbit)

 

 

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Rakete

[Ooglak Kerman]

28 minutes ago, Rakete said:

Unfortunately not. as I am not on my Computer today anymore (and might not be in the next days due to work) But it consisted of the following:  (top to down)

1. Mk1 command pod,

2. 4x battery Z-1K

3. S2 Auxillery Warp generator (belongs to this Mod!)  --> no such thing.  Do you mean S2 Gravimetric Displacement Generator?  If so, not needed

4. graviolium tank (belongs to this mod)  --> technically not needed.  48 units of graviolium and 72 fusion pellets in the S2 Warp Core will last a while

5. a LqDe-Tank of your choice (required to use the warp core from this Mod. In this Case I used one from Nertea - anyone will do)  --> not necessary

6. S2 Warp core (belongs to this mod)  --> did you fill it with graviolium?

7. 8x S1 Warp coils (from this mod) - attached to the auxillery thing - experiment with several of them on and off out of Kerbins SOI (solar orbit)

 

 

 

I built this best as I could - but without the LqDe tank.  No issues.  Starts.  Drives.  Stops.

[Ooglak Kerman]

Made it to Hale.  Set orbit just outside the Sarnus warp cutoff and then matched inclinations - used mechjeb to make the maneuver node and then I performed the "burn" with the gravatic engine.  Set up an encounter - that was bloody fiddly and then got into  a 10KM orbit of Hale.  And, of course, failed to get the darn screenshot.  Hale is right lumpy.

From there is was gravatic RCS all the way.  Orbital velocity at 10KM was 7 m/s.  Descent was leisurely in the extreme.  Once you have set up the descent, you will definitely want to turn the engine off to conserve graviolium.  Just stay retrograde all the way and turn the engine back on at maybe 300m.  Light touch is key.  You can balance on 1 landing leg, and it'll very very very slowly go one way or the other.  Ya have to be careful with the SAS.  Almost anything you do will bounce you up - but no hurry at all.

The view!!!  Great gobs.  Hale is inside the ring so you have the view of Sarnus and the ring one direction and the other, you get the ring arching from "under".  Looks like the Niven Ringworld probably would have.  I really would like to set up a base here.  Ground anchors would be a must.  @Angel-125 Awesome!  this mod makes these things accessible - but not easy for sure.

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Ooglak Kerman

[Rakete]

59 minutes ago, Ooglak Kerman said:

I built this best as I could - but without the LqDe tank.  No issues.  Starts.  Drives.  Stops.

Yes, the build works in general - but shows strange not understandable behavior in terms of max speed and flameout-sounds if you play around with different amounts of activated warp coils of the build in solar orbit (not Kerbins SOI).

I guess the LqDeuterium is only needed, if you have FFT installed. (In my install the warp drive does not run without it). Otherwise it seems not to be needed. But my issue was the strange behavior, not the general function at all. That (!) was my point. There seems to be a vulnerability against calculation oscilations in the calculation plugin itself / KSP itself. This is an issue, that happens quite often to iterative algorithms. (E.g. one Nerteas mods had those iterative oscillations in Systemheat/NFE as well. But the issue was tracked down and fixed.)

I'd be glad, if @Angel-125 could have a look at it in more detail.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Rakete

[Angelo Kerman]

29 minutes ago, Rakete said:

Yes, the build works in general - but shows strange not understandable behavior in terms of max speed and flameout-sounds if you play around with different amounts of activated warp coils of the build in solar orbit (not Kerbins SOI).

I guess the LqDeuterium is only needed, if you have FFT installed. (In my install the warp drive does not run without it). Otherwise it seems not to be needed. But my issue was the strange behavior, not the general function at all. That (!) was my point. There seems to be a vulnerability against calculation oscilations in the calculation plugin itself / KSP itself. This is an issue, that happens quite often to iterative algorithms. (E.g. one Nerteas mods had those iterative oscillations in Systemheat/NFE as well. But the issue was tracked down and fixed.)

I'd be glad, if @Angel-125 could have a look at it in more detail.

I'd definitely need steps to reproduce this, including build of the craft, mods, etc.

[Rakete]

59 minutes ago, Angel-125 said:

I'd definitely need steps to reproduce this, including build of the craft, mods, etc.

Craft: See here for download: https://www.filemail.com/d/zvceznxosbhdxux

As simple as possible: only stock, blueshift and a required Liquid Deuterium (from Far Future Tech by Nertea) tank as it is required to run the warpdrive.

 

Needed Mods: Nerteas Far future mod (my other mods are only visual: Waterfall, eve, spectra). further nertea mods (Near future Suite, Spacedust, Systemheat, dynamic battery storage, cryo tanks, cryo engines, kerbal atomics, deployable engines, SSPXr etc.) are also installed in my install, but should not have any effect on your plugin, I guess. I use the full cabinet of Nerteas Mods (except Restock/Restock+)

Steps to reproduce: Take the vessel out of Kerbins SOI into a solar orbit of Kerbins Stock Solar system. Set e.g jool as target, set SAS on target mode (pointing to jool)

The vessel has 8 s1 coils, which should not eat all of the s2 core's waves (demand 40, generstion 150)

1. Activate only one coil, watch the maximum warp factor, set throttle to 100% )do not change it in the following steps. Turn up your audio output.

2. Activate a second coil, watch the maximum warpfactor. 

Step 3 to 9. Activate further coils and watch the maximum possible warp factor with each activation (it does not increase with every activated coil. It goes up/down/oscillates/flickers). At some point in the coils switching on process, the sounds starts to makes bumpy sounds (ksps flameout sound, but crippled to only being cracking sounds).,the warp factor calculations show flickering/fast oscillating results. If it does not, throttle down to 0% and re-accelerate.

10. Activate the additional displacement generator: The sound disturbances and the max. Warp factor oscillations are gone, the ugly test rig ship now goes much (!) faster (which it shouldn't, as the s2 warp core should generate 150 waves/s and the 8 coils should only need 8x 5 waves (so... 40) .. so it should be more than enough waves without the additional generator active. Interestingly this does not happen in Kerbins SOI. I guess there is some stepsize issue in the simulation causing oscillation in the internal calculations of the warp system supply values (waves or warp capabilities). This causes sound symptomes (KSPs flameout sound crippled to bumpy cracks), weird behaviour in terms of change in max warpspeed if you de/activate further coils, and a ride with weird warpvelocity changes (depending on the grade of oscillations). Adding a (not needed) s2 displacement generator solves the issue, but it should not be needed according to the part values in terms of produced and consumed gravitic waves.

The issue occurs when you have a ship with a multitude of small coils in a Kerbol Orbit. It did nit occur e.g. with a single bigger S2 coil

Edited April 24, 2022 by Rakete

[Ooglak Kerman]

Well.. I do stand corrected about the fuel for the S2 Warp Core.  Apologies.

@PART[wbiS2GravimetricGenerator,wbiS2WarpCore]:NEEDS[FarFutureTechnologies]
{
	@MODULE[WBIModuleGeneratorFX]
	{
		@INPUT_RESOURCE:HAS[#ResourceName[FusionPellets]]
		{
			@ResourceName = LqdDeuterium
			@Ratio = 0.000545
		}
	}

	!RESOURCE[FusionPellets]{}
}