[1.12.X] Tantares - Stockalike Soyuz and MIR [16.1][28.05.2024][Mars Expedition WIP]

[CobaltWolf]

6 minutes ago, Beale said:

Normal Maps
Well, we have a lot more memory to work with now, that's a bonus. I am only with 8GB of RAM personally, but I'd say that is the lower-end of memory these days (What's the go-to amount in 2016? 12GB? 16GB?).

And the docking port

I do see what you're saying. The current drag it has if I remember is around the same as the 0.625m parachute - fine for a hard landing. That is stock 0.625m parachute mass + stock 0.625m port mass = 0.12, pretty close to what there is already.

 

I have 8gb but I know *a lot* of people that play KSP on laptops with as low as 4gb. 

I think radial parachutes around the top of the capsule would be best.

[billbobjebkirk]

What is this? Tantares Fuji Mk. 5?

Edited April 19, 2016 by billbobjebkirk

[curtquarquesso]

1 hour ago, Beale said:

Normal Maps
Well, we have a lot more memory to work with now, that's a bonus. I am only with 8GB of RAM personally, but I'd say that is the lower-end of memory these days (What's the go-to amount in 2016? 12GB? 16GB?).

And the docking port
I do see what you're saying. The current drag it has if I remember is around the same as the 0.625m parachute - fine for a hard landing. That is stock 0.625m parachute mass + stock 0.625m port mass = 0.12, pretty close to what there is already.
The problem to change that, you cannot, I think, really combine a parachute into a capsule, from past experience with aerodynamics system (though a hell of a lot has changed since then).
There are things where the desire to keep everything divided into modules (Like one folder for Fuji, one folder for Soyuz, one folder for TKS, etc) is creating too many "duplicate" parts.

Normal Maps:
8GB is pretty much as low as you'll nowadays. Normals maps shouldn't be an issue now. 

Docking Port:
I can't think of any issues that would arise. Does the drag modifier just add to the existing drag? Have you tried it before? 
I see your logic in making specific parts for specific folders. If you delete all the Soyuz parts, you don't want to loose the docking port you'd use for Fuji. Good sense in that.

Bonus Promo Shot of Fuji-type Station:

Building this station almost made me wish for versions of the OM with 1.875m for station building. They're really nice looking.
I also ran into one downside of the straps on the Fuji propellant tanks; You can't rotate it 45º without making your craft unsymmetrical due to the straps. It's a minimal gripe, but I suppose radially attached tanks would be a suitable workaround. 

[legoclone09]

A 1.875m Fuji OM would be nice so we can build larger OMs are have station habs with them, without them tapering off.

[OTmikhail]

On 4/16/2016 at 1:56 PM, Beale said:

Yeah, I will implement the ATV solar panels when I get around to refreshing all of that stuff, some day. Current lack of solar panels for ATV is a little poor.

The release roadmap is a little out of synch, as the Fuji is almost done (I had planned to do the Fobos Grunt first, but eh).

I say, stick to the plan as much as possible (having a plan is half the battle), but jump around and do what interests and inspires you most. Looking forward to Ariane and ATV revamp, looking forward to finished Proton revamp (what else is needed? is it done?). I'd also like to suggest lesser known Russian rockets like Tsiklon and Kosmos, and maybe someday the old Ariane rockets (1-4). Keep up the great work. Very happy to have Fuji back and use those parts in game again, thank you for that.

7 hours ago, Beale said:

Thanks for the info on fuel types, I will have to take a look in more closely at those comparison figures (Well, all Tantares RCS tanks are broken right now I guess).
So, I guess Monopropellant can be used, unless many are opposed to it.

Nervously hoping this doesn't break my game.

[Beale]

18 hours ago, OTmikhail said:

I say, stick to the plan as much as possible (having a plan is half the battle), but jump around and do what interests and inspires you most. Looking forward to Ariane and ATV revamp, looking forward to finished Proton revamp (what else is needed? is it done?). I'd also like to suggest lesser known Russian rockets like Tsiklon and Kosmos, and maybe someday the old Ariane rockets (1-4). Keep up the great work. Very happy to have Fuji back and use those parts in game again, thank you for that.

Nervously hoping this doesn't break my game.

Nothing will break , it will just be unbalanced.

I think for the future, I don't really see adding anything major new, unless I find something very interesting. 
I have found improving existing things to be much more enjoyable (and maintainable).

If anything, I would like to remove a few things that do not receive attention (Specifically Venera and Luna probe parts).

On 4/19/2016 at 5:40 PM, curtquarquesso said:

Normal Maps:
8GB is pretty much as low as you'll nowadays. Normals maps shouldn't be an issue now. 

Docking Port:
I can't think of any issues that would arise. Does the drag modifier just add to the existing drag? Have you tried it before? 
I see your logic in making specific parts for specific folders. If you delete all the Soyuz parts, you don't want to loose the docking port you'd use for Fuji. Good sense in that.

I also ran into one downside of the straps on the Fuji propellant tanks; You can't rotate it 45º without making your craft unsymmetrical due to the straps. It's a minimal gripe, but I suppose radially attached tanks would be a suitable workaround. 

On 4/19/2016 at 5:43 PM, legoclone09 said:

A 1.875m Fuji OM would be nice so we can build larger OMs are have station habs with them, without them tapering off.

That station is fantastic! Really do agree of the 1.875m version of those OM.

Parachute Gibble

It's hard to tell with the drag-modifier what is affecting what, but I think so. I'm not even sure if the drag values within the parachute module do anything anymore (try taking them out and watch the capsule slam to the ground at 120m/s).

Normal Maps

I'm going to use Trails as a guinea pig for this, as it is a much smaller project. But, doesn't look bad  

Straps

Yes, hopefully additional radial tanks should solve this problem.

 

 

1.1
Fear not, I will get an update out soon, but I am a little busy. If you have any bug that really needs to be fixed during this update, now is the time to speak!

[tjsnh]

2 minutes ago, Beale said:

If anything, I would like to remove a few things that do not receive attention (Specifically Venera and Luna probe parts).

If you ever deprecate the Venera parts, let me know, I'd love to adopt-and-maintain them in such a case.

[CobaltWolf]

5 minutes ago, Beale said:

If anything, I would like to remove a few things that do not receive attention (Specifically Venera and Luna probe parts).

I'm going to use Trails as a guinea pig for this, as it is a much smaller project. But, doesn't look bad  

 

 

I know @akron was interested in looking at the Venera and Luna probes for his landers pack. If I understand that post right and you're not interested in maintaining them, perhaps look into transferring them to him?

I was actually going to add normal maps to the Hermes and Leo. They really need them. Thanks for taking that off my todo list.  

EDIT: Looking again, the little ribs that make up the panels should be represented in the normal maps as well. 

Edited April 20, 2016 by CobaltWolf

[Beale]

11 minutes ago, tjsnh said:

If you ever deprecate the Venera parts, let me know, I'd love to adopt-and-maintain them in such a case.

10 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

I know @akron was interested in looking at the Venera and Luna probes for his landers pack. If I understand that post right and you're not interested in maintaining them, perhaps look into transferring them to him?

Good to know they would not be simply deleted  

Quote

I was actually going to add normal maps to the Hermes and Leo. They really need them. Thanks for taking that off my todo list.  

EDIT: Looking again, the little ribs that make up the panels should be represented in the normal maps as well. 

It looks better for sure with the ribs, but has artifacts. I don't know if they would appear in-game, or it's just Unity's special friendship with me.

Looking Good

Zoom out, oh no!

 

In contrast, the basic panel normal map looks pretty good from a distance.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Beale

[CobaltWolf]

@Beale I really don't know. I would see what it looks like in game before rushing to panic about it.

[legoclone09]

Normal maps look amazing! We need them! [/demanding] 

Edited April 20, 2016 by legoclone09

[Guest]

45 minutes ago, Beale said:

 1.1
Fear not, I will get an update out soon, but I am a little busy. If you have any bug that really needs to be fixed during this update, now is the time to speak!

2

Ooh, all sorts of new goodies to put together in fun and utterly daft ways! 
I haven't played KSP since December, so this will be a real treat.

[CobaltWolf]

@Beale the gaps in the Botticelli normal maps (between panels) are significantly bigger than the pod ones.

Can you confirm that the issue with the small ribs also occurs in game?

[hendrack]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qln495ayvmjo55o/_Extra_USILifeSupport.cfg?dl=0

I updated the USI MM patch. I reduced the mulch to almost nothing. USI parts have their own mulch containers, so either you just restock your orbital stations and throw mulch out of the window, or use USI-LS parts anyway. Also, there is no need to add replacement parts, since USI has a MM patch that adds that resource to command pods (which most Tantares parts in this MM patch are anyway). I have not encountered any problems in MKS-Lite or OKS/UKS.

[davidy12]

On April 19, 2016 at 11:40 AM, curtquarquesso said:

Bonus Promo Shot of Fuji-type Station:

Okay @curtquarquesso, how low are you???

[T'Flok]

I guess, I'm back. Depends on if mods work and if KSP manages to re-hook me into the game somewhat.

Anyway, does Tantares have at least one capsule/cockpit with at least 4 RPM screens by now? And if no then is there an UI mod that enables the user to have RPM windows on the screen? Because I need it If I'm going to fly something from the inside.

EDIT: Also, are there any cockpits both old or new with IVAs added? Does 'Spectre' have one? Does mercury thing have one? Are there more IVAs in station parts now? And does that 'Kvant' thing and vostok have an IVA?

Edited April 20, 2016 by T'Flok

[curtquarquesso]

12 hours ago, Beale said:

I think for the future, I don't really see adding anything major new, unless I find something very interesting. 
I have found improving existing things to be much more enjoyable (and maintainable).
If anything, I would like to remove a few things that do not receive attention (Specifically Venera and Luna probe parts).

Parachute Gibble
It's hard to tell with the drag-modifier what is affecting what, but I think so. I'm not even sure if the drag values within the parachute module do anything anymore (try taking them out and watch the capsule slam to the ground at 120m/s).

Normal Maps
I'm going to use Trails as a guinea pig for this, as it is a much smaller project. But, doesn't look bad  

Straps
Yes, hopefully additional radial tanks should solve this problem.

Roadmap Stuff:
• Venera and Luna are great little probes. I like 'em. How about putting Venera, Luna, and the Grunt into their own little probes pack? 

Fuji Parachute:
• I'm interested in this now. Perhaps I'll do a little experimentation and see if I can't solve this issue.

Normal Maps:
• Looking good! I'm a fan. 

8 hours ago, davidy12 said:

Okay @curtquarquesso, how low are you???

Low enough to allow Kerbals to convenient reach out the hatch and scrape samples from the minty-fresh peaks of Minmus. If you choose the right orbital inclination on Minmus, it's amazing just how low you can get. 

Edited April 21, 2016 by curtquarquesso

[passinglurker]

Normal Maps: I'm only running 6GB >.>... Look I'm not saying it isn't gorgeous  but 64bit only raised the ceiling not eliminated it (that would take dynamic loading) also a stock-a-like mod should follow some stock standards for example you don't really see normal maps on the parts porkjet has been introducing in stock.

[InsaneDruid]

15 hours ago, Beale said:

It looks better for sure with the ribs, but has artifacts. I don't know if they would appear in-game, or it's just Unity's special friendship with me.

Check if the normal map texture is set to trilinear, anisotropic 16x, maxsize > real size and truecolor in the inspector, like all textures should.

[InsaneDruid]

2 hours ago, passinglurker said:

Normal Maps: I'm only running 6GB >.>... Look I'm not saying it isn't gorgeous  but 64bit only raised the ceiling not eliminated it (that would take dynamic loading) also a stock-a-like mod should follow some stock standards for example you don't really see normal maps on the parts porkjet has been introducing in stock.

My2 cents

• If every game ever would try to not overstress even the oldest hardware, "640 ought to be enough for everyone" would still be true.
• Memory is as cheap as never before
• Just 1GB more can hold over 200 2k .dds normalmaps.
• Users of older hardware can always downscale the textures, use half texture size option in game or otherwise tailor the needs of the game to their likings. Which isn't true to the opposite. And why should users that invested in their hardware to gain a better game experience be hindered by those who doesn't?
• This doesn't mean that a game/mod should not try to be compatible as much as it can, but older hardware should never be the ruling design target. You can see this mantra in many good games that even had options in it that the most actual hardware in the time of release wasn't capable off.

[VenomousRequiem]

@InsaneDruid "Older hardware"... My laptop is pretty new and its only running 6GB of RAM as well.

@passinglurker I can empathize with your struggle. 

[Beale]

14 hours ago, T'Flok said:

I guess, I'm back. Depends on if mods work and if KSP manages to re-hook me into the game somewhat.

Anyway, does Tantares have at least one capsule/cockpit with at least 4 RPM screens by now? And if no then is there an UI mod that enables the user to have RPM windows on the screen? Because I need it If I'm going to fly something from the inside.

EDIT: Also, are there any cockpits both old or new with IVAs added? Does 'Spectre' have one? Does mercury thing have one? Are there more IVAs in station parts now? And does that 'Kvant' thing and vostok have an IVA?

No new IVAs this update.

5 hours ago, passinglurker said:

for example you don't really see normal maps on the parts porkjet has been introducing in stock.

Looks like this is set to change, from the new Mk2 inline cockpit.

18 hours ago, CobaltWolf said:

@Beale the gaps in the Botticelli normal maps (between panels) are significantly bigger than the pod ones.

Can you confirm that the issue with the small ribs also occurs in game?

3 hours ago, InsaneDruid said:

Check if the normal map texture is set to trilinear, anisotropic 16x, maxsize > real size and truecolor in the inspector, like all textures should.

Still occurs in-game, even with the correct export settings.

 

[akron]

19 hours ago, CobaltWolf said:

I know @akron was interested in looking at the Venera and Luna probes for his landers pack. If I understand that post right and you're not interested in maintaining them, perhaps look into transferring them to him?

I'd welcome this. I want to expand my mod to include goodies from all space agencies. One of these days I am going to force myself to do foreign parts exclusively.

Nice work with the normals! I hope you can fine tune it to remove the glitches.

[Redhornet919]

I am using the Extendable docking ports and they wont detach.  When i press the undock button, it does nothing.  can you re create this??? i'm using 1.1

[Beale]

7 hours ago, akron said:

I'd welcome this. I want to expand my mod to include goodies from all space agencies. One of these days I am going to force myself to do foreign parts exclusively.

This could be fun to see!
You are welcome to the source files (In OBJ and PSD format) if you would like to have a poke through them  

1 hour ago, Redhornet919 said:

I am using the Extendable docking ports and they wont detach.  When i press the undock button, it does nothing.  can you re create this??? i'm using 1.1

Odd odd odd, due to a current bug they shouldn't even be able to attach in the first place! 
Got a pic?  

 

1.1

I have a little bit of a setback, busy busy day. I still expect to see Tantares moved to 1.1 soon though.
TantaresLV is 99% ready, just a few more tags to add. The new control parts are in-game, you can see their balance below.

Also, the textures were given a few extra details (like the Fuji), they are not huge but add a lot I think!  

PART
{

name = Knight_Control_A
module = Part
author = Beale

MODEL
{
   model = TantaresLV/NLV/Knight_Control_A
}
scale = 1
rescaleFactor = 1.0

node_stack_top    = 0.0,  0.0375, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -0.0375, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 1

node_attach = 0.46875, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1

bulkheadProfiles = size0, srf

TechRequired = start
entryCost = 525
cost = 525

category     = Pods
subcategory  = 0
title        = Knight CU-5FK Control Unit
manufacturer = Found lying by the side of the road
description  = This control unit is only slightly sentient.

tags = 0.9375 knight NLV

attachRules = 1,1,1,1,0

mass = 0.075

dragModelType  = default
maximum_drag   = 0.20
minimum_drag   = 0.15
angularDrag    = 2
crashTolerance = 15
maxTemp        = 2000

vesselType = Probe

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleCommand
	minimumCrew = 0
	RESOURCE
	{
		name = ElectricCharge
		rate = 0.01
	}
}

RESOURCE
{
	name = ElectricCharge
	amount = 60
	maxAmount = 60
}

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleSAS
}

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleReactionWheel
	
	PitchTorque = 0.5
	YawTorque = 0.5
	RollTorque = 0.5
	
	RESOURCE
	{
		name = ElectricCharge
		rate = 0.025
	}
}

}

PART
{

name = Arrow_Control_A
module = Part
author = Beale

MODEL
{
   model = TantaresLV/NLV/Arrow_Control_A
}
scale = 1
rescaleFactor = 1.0

node_stack_top    = 0.0,  0.0375, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -0.0375, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 1

node_attach = 0.625, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1

bulkheadProfiles = size0, srf

TechRequired = start
entryCost = 525
cost = 525

category     = Pods
subcategory  = 0
title        = Arrow CU-NAR Control Unit
manufacturer = Found lying by the side of the road
description  = This control unit is actually dangerously sentient. Don't give it access to any safety-critical functions!

tags = 1.25 knight NLV

attachRules = 1,1,1,1,0

mass = 0.1

dragModelType  = default
maximum_drag   = 0.20
minimum_drag   = 0.15
angularDrag    = 2
crashTolerance = 15
maxTemp        = 2000

vesselType = Probe

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleCommand
	minimumCrew = 0
	RESOURCE
	{
		name = ElectricCharge
		rate = 0.01
	}
}

RESOURCE
{
	name = ElectricCharge
	amount = 60
	maxAmount = 60
}

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleSAS
}

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleReactionWheel
	
	PitchTorque = 0.5
	YawTorque = 0.5
	RollTorque = 0.5
	
	RESOURCE
	{
		name = ElectricCharge
		rate = 0.025
	}
}

}

 

Edited April 21, 2016 by Beale