parts [1.12.x] Karbonite/Karbonite Plus (K+)

[TheRagingIrishman]

Can I install 7.2 with the latest version of Karbonite? Or should I wait for the merging to be completed?

Thanks

 

@FrancoisH You can install 7.2 and it will work fine. Just be aware that within a week or so, there will be an update that could change stuff. Basically, it's up to you. If you really need access to Karborundum RIGHT NOW then definitely install it. If you can stand to wait for it for a little bit longer, I wouldn't bother.

Edited November 14, 2016 by TheRagingIrishman

[FrancoisH]

1 minute ago, TheRagingIrishman said:

@FrancoisH You can install 7.2 and it will work fine. Just be aware that within a week or so, there will be an update that could change stuff. Basically, it's up to you. If you really need access to Karborundum RIGHT NOW then definitely install it. If you can stand to wait for it for a little bit longer, I wouldn't bother.

Thanks

I sure can wait... The time I reach the use of it in my new install is yet to come

[TheKurgan]

Just for my own personal enjoyment and learning, I have been messing around with Karborundum and Scansat, and the one thing I can't get right is the Variance and Dispersal.

I've searched for an hour and nobody has a confident description of what these mean.

Could someone please explain:

Variance = 50
Dispersal = 3

Thanks.

Even though I am just messing around, I'm still trying to keep Karborundum difficult to obtain, (at my skill level in game, it seems near impossible in its current config). I am restricting Karborundum to a specific biome on Eeloo, but I want to make it spread out, and in concentrations ranging from 0% to 5% throughout the biome.

I have the scanning setup (that was the easy part) and it works, 

I have it restricted to the "Lowlands" biome, (that was also very simple) that works too... now if I could figure out the Variance and Dispersal, it would be perfect.

[Zhetaan]

@TheKurgan:

Variance adds noise to the resource distribution.  It makes the concentration more 'spiky' on the map; that is to say, it introduces a pseudorandom element that causes the concentration of a resource to vary around the mean abundance value.  This element allows the concentration at a specific point to 'swing' between extreme values, and the variance adjusts how far apart those extremes are.  The idea comes from statistics; for example, a set of concentrations {5, 5, 5, 5, 5, 5} has a mean of 5 but zero variance.  A set {0, 0, 0, 0, 5, 25} also has a mean of 5, but with one hundred variance.  I do not know whether variance in resources is the same as variance in statistics.

Dispersal, if I recall correctly, was added after Regolith was added to the stock code, so there's no source to consult.  Of course, this also means that what I just said about Variance could well be out of date.  However, I believe it further modifies the variance.

@DMagic said once in the SCANSat thread that he thought Dispersal affected resource concentrations within a biome and Variance affected concentrations across biomes (meaning that Variance randomised the average concentrations of global and planetary resources, and Dispersal randomised the point-specific concentrations within biomes.  He also said that there was an old bug in the Karbonite resource config that the Dispersal was set to zero and that this caused there to be no variance within each biome (in other words, the biome's average concentration was the only concentration anywhere).  This lends a lot of weight to the idea, but lacking either actual code to consult or word from The Man Himself, the best way to find out what it does is to try modifying the config between extreme values to see what happens.

[TheKurgan]

Mind = blown... 

So if I wanted a resource to be varied extremely from it's minimum of .01% to a max of 5% withing a specific biome, I should use a variance of 100% and a dispersal of... WTFK  (Who the fBEEPk Knows) 

lol, thanks for the info, appreciated.

[watson895]

K+ is deleted from the archive on github. Planning on reworking or deleting it?

[maja]

5 minutes ago, watson895 said:

K+ is deleted from the archive on github. Planning on reworking or deleting it?

K+ is merged with Karbonite.

[watson895]

34 minutes ago, maja said:

K+ is merged with Karbonite.

Ah. So I see. Mostly just trying to figure out what happened to karborundum. Was gonna try out a solar collector after I saw it was fixed a while back, but now it's apparently gone.

[TheRagingIrishman]

3 hours ago, watson895 said:

Ah. So I see. Mostly just trying to figure out what happened to karborundum. Was gonna try out a solar collector after I saw it was fixed a while back, but now it's apparently gone.

If you download the latest version of Karbonite, it'll include the solar collector parts. 

[watson895]

1 hour ago, TheRagingIrishman said:

If you download the latest version of Karbonite, it'll include the solar collector parts. 

That worked. The version of Karbonite on CKAN didn't have Karbonite Plus in it.

[LatiMacciato]

On 2.3.2016 at 11:35 PM, Kielm said:

Update: It looks like the stock surface scanner and drills work on asteroids so I answered my own question

unsure why but I do not seem to get any values from the surface scanning module (also in KSP 1.2.2, ty for the update anyways!!!)

Spoiler

how do scan asteroid resources?

Edited December 8, 2016 by LatiMacciato

[Kielm]

On 08/12/2016 at 7:00 AM, LatiMacciato said:

unsure why but I do not seem to get any values from the surface scanning module (also in KSP 1.2.2, ty for the update anyways!!!)

  Reveal hidden contents

how do scan asteroid resources?

Check the previous page - you can't. There is currently no way to scan resources on asteroids. 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Donziboy2]

Looks like roverdude was no longer monitoring this thread after he combined K Plus with karbonite.  I have opened an issue on Karbonite for the Scanner not working.

[HunterForce]

Alright, I feel I've done everything I could with no results so I have to say/ask; There is no karborundum around Kerbol as far as I can tell. I have sent missions all the way into Kerbols atmos (no temp dmg) stopping at 25Mm increments starting at Eve orbit with every sensor or particle scoop there is. I have dug through this thread and come across

Spoiler

I ask because I built a Kerbol collector setup, went to put it into orbit, but couldn't find Karborundum anywhere around the sun.  I ended up using hyperedit with the scanner and stepping away from the sun in 50Mm increments all the way to 15Gm, and I couldn't find anything.  I thought my game was broken, so I loaded up a fresh install with just K+, the CRP, ModuleManager and Hyperedit, and found it immediately at 5.2Gm.  Completely baffled, I tried putting the resource seed from the new game into my old game and voila - I was able to immediately find K+ at 5.2Gm just like I did in the new game.

and

Spoiler

Check the community resource pack definition for karborundum. Look for the Sun entry.

The altitudes in the file use 1/2 kerbol's equatorial radius as a starting point (for reference: 261,600,000m, so half of that number is altitude = 1).

To find the correct orbit: altitude (in file) x 130,500,000.

Give or take a few thousand kilometres.

 

which based on my files in GameData/CommunityResourcePack/ResourceConfigs :Karborundum

Spoiler

PLANETARY_RESOURCE
{
    ResourceName = Karborundum
    ResourceType = 3
    PlanetName = Sun
    
    Distribution
    {
        PresenceChance = 100
        MinAbundance = 10
        MaxAbundance = 10
        MinAltitude = 40
        MaxAltitude = 40
        MinRange = 5
        MaxRange = 5
        Variance = 50
    }
}

Should indicate that I should find some around

Spoiler

5,220,000,000m

as far as I can tell. (Unless I miss understood how to come by the proper altitude.)

 

I again searched stopping around every 10Mm starting and stopping 200Mm higher and lower than that orbit.

 

What am I doing wrong? What scanner/collector should be used? What altitude would it be at? Could my seed be broken or out of date? Where would I even look to check that? I am at my wits end. I have spent way too many hours at trying to figure this out with no results. Thanks for any help.

Edited March 20, 2017 by HunterForce

[Djohaal]

On 20/03/2017 at 2:52 AM, HunterForce said:

Alright, I feel I've done everything I could with no results so I have to say/ask; There is no karborundum around Kerbol as far as I can tell. I have sent missions all the way into Kerbols atmos (no temp dmg) stopping at 25Mm increments starting at Eve orbit with every sensor or particle scoop there is. I have dug through this thread and come across

  Reveal hidden contents

I ask because I built a Kerbol collector setup, went to put it into orbit, but couldn't find Karborundum anywhere around the sun.  I ended up using hyperedit with the scanner and stepping away from the sun in 50Mm increments all the way to 15Gm, and I couldn't find anything.  I thought my game was broken, so I loaded up a fresh install with just K+, the CRP, ModuleManager and Hyperedit, and found it immediately at 5.2Gm.  Completely baffled, I tried putting the resource seed from the new game into my old game and voila - I was able to immediately find K+ at 5.2Gm just like I did in the new game.

and

  Reveal hidden contents

Check the community resource pack definition for karborundum. Look for the Sun entry.

The altitudes in the file use 1/2 kerbol's equatorial radius as a starting point (for reference: 261,600,000m, so half of that number is altitude = 1).

To find the correct orbit: altitude (in file) x 130,500,000.

Give or take a few thousand kilometres.

 

which based on my files in GameData/CommunityResourcePack/ResourceConfigs :Karborundum

  Reveal hidden contents

PLANETARY_RESOURCE
{
    ResourceName = Karborundum
    ResourceType = 3
    PlanetName = Sun
    
    Distribution
    {
        PresenceChance = 100
        MinAbundance = 10
        MaxAbundance = 10
        MinAltitude = 40
        MaxAltitude = 40
        MinRange = 5
        MaxRange = 5
        Variance = 50
    }
}

Should indicate that I should find some around

  Reveal hidden contents

5,220,000,000m

as far as I can tell. (Unless I miss understood how to come by the proper altitude.)

 

I again searched stopping around every 10Mm starting and stopping 200Mm higher and lower than that orbit.

 

What am I doing wrong? What scanner/collector should be used? What altitude would it be at? Could my seed be broken or out of date? Where would I even look to check that? I am at my wits end. I have spent way too many hours at trying to figure this out with no results. Thanks for any help.

I am also experiencing problems with finding K+'s band around kerbol. Already tested and sounded several different combinations of values for the resources without luck. I'm afraid of changing my game's seed and messing my planetary operations.

[JadeOfMaar]

Pull Request #239

 Ladies and gentlemen... and @RoverDude The long-overdue performance overhaul of the air-breathing engines has finally arrived.  

Updated titles make them easily assorted in the parts list. Their crash tolerances are sane now. The actual Karbonite versions finally have practical amounts of power and their LiquidFuel versions are pretty okay for use on [Kerbin] too.

   

 

Renamed the remaining engines according to a pleasant, type-specific convention some of them already had.

• Left column has specific performance envelopes:
  • Turboprop is strong at Mach 1 for low end acceleration and utility vehicles. It holds the highest Isp of all the engines and (the LF version actually) remains in harmony with its CTT node as the first and weakest engine you'll unlock.
  • Turbofan is strong at Mach 2 for shuttles/airlines. They hold a median Isp.
  • Turbojet is strong at Mach 3 ~ 3.5, enabling a new breed of SSTO for/from the likes of Duna.
• Right column: The UHBs are strong at Mach 1 like the 750 turboprop but because the description for one of these says "three times the power, three times the explosion" and the other says "for folks who like to pretend they can outrun a Karbonite engine" they have been OP'd accordingly and can actually endanger the craft they're attached to. Their LF versions are not OP. Blame whoever wrote those descriptions or find an inventive use for them. The power is yours. 

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2017 by JadeOfMaar

[N3N]

1 hour ago, JadeOfMaar said:

Pull Request #239

 

Hey JadeOfMaar,

Very cool! Great work!

I like it!

 

Is there a possibility to use it at the moment with a running game in 1.2.2 or do we have to wait for a official release in Karbonite?

[Djohaal]

3 hours ago, N3N said:

 

Hey JadeOfMaar,

Very cool! Great work!

I like it!

 

Is there a possibility to use it at the moment with a running game in 1.2.2 or do we have to wait for a official release in Karbonite?

I believe that jade's changes are solely cfgs. If that's true then you can just swap your cfgs and enjoy the new engines.

 

On the exosferic resource front, haven't managed to get K+ even after copying the resource and save seeds from a new save that did have the resource.

Edited April 10, 2017 by Djohaal

[N3N]

33 minutes ago, Djohaal said:

I believe that jade's changes are solely cfgs. If that's true then you can just swap your cfgs and enjoy the new engines.

 

On the exosferic resource front, haven't managed to get K+ even after copying the resource and save seeds from a new save that did have the resource.

Even in an old game?

 

And that with K+ near the sun, I will try it with my next ship.

[Djohaal]

1 hour ago, N3N said:

Even in an old game?

 

And that with K+ near the sun, I will try it with my next ship.

Yep, parts can be tweaked on the during games. Some oddity may happen with parts that already exist (but often it just works), but new parts are clean. To be on the safe side be sure to backup your persist safe, obviously.

[JadeOfMaar]

3 hours ago, Djohaal said:

I believe that jade's changes are solely cfgs. If that's true then you can just swap your cfgs and enjoy the new engines.

That's right. I've only changed the config files. BUT. I renamed some of the files themselves to so make sure to delete every KA_Jet_* and LFKA_JET_* from the Parts folder first.

On another note: I haven't had any problem with Karborundum. I've written several locations for it (not in the stock solar system) and found screenshots of success rather than read of any complaint.

[N3N]

Hey RoverDude,

 

Is there an estimation, when you will release the next official update (with the cool changes by JadeOfMaar)?

 

And good work, I like it very much, please keep going.

[JadeOfMaar]

I have just one question. What should the upper limit for the turbojet's performance look like? Currently its expected TWR at Mach 4 is 0.5 and to cut out at Mach 5. Should I extend its power curve to end at Mach 6? Given how the exhaust port looks, with all that grill stuff, I held back.

@Kielm @goldenpsp Suggestions?

Spoiler

 

Edited April 11, 2017 by JadeOfMaar

[herman]

Looks like the stock surface scanner no longer works when connected to an asteroid (I'm looking for karborundum). Has this been changed, or am I doing something wrong?

[JadeOfMaar]

On 4/10/2017 at 2:49 PM, N3N said:

Is there a possibility to use it at the moment with a running game in 1.2.2 or do we have to wait for a official release in Karbonite?

Here's the update preview. Try it out and let me know what you think. 0KB copies of config files with original names are temporarily included so you just have to drag&drop to install.

If you will @Norcalplanner I'd like you to try this as well since you've done a lot with Karbonite. Scroll up a bit for my post with details and pictures.

Edited April 12, 2017 by JadeOfMaar