[1.12.x] Near Future Technologies (September 6)

[KeaKaka]

2 hours ago, billkerbinsky said:

Electrically pumped like the real-world Rutherford?  (no alternator, burns EC as well as LF+OX, periodically ejects batteries...)

It would be a nice twist on the majority of engines we have in KSP, using electric charge instead of creating it.

Edit: also @Nertea, how many chambers is that juicy 3.75m engine?

Edited March 28, 2020 by Mountain Parrot

[EStreetRockets]

I know that it was supposed to run on N2O4/MMH, but for a small upper stage sustainer engine you could use the Agena 2000 that was proposed for an Atlas V Light in early EELV proposals. Design and Test results: https://www.pdf-archive.com/2017/05/31/design-and-test-results-on-agena-2000/design-and-test-results-on-agena-2000.pdf.

 

8 hours ago, Nertea said:

Another option considered is the mythical AJ-800, which is effectively an NK-33 with two turbopumps and a sized up combustion chamber/nozzle. It might fit the footprint nicely. 

Similar to the AJ-800 is the RS-76 which was proposed by Boeing and Rocketdyne for Space Shuttle Flyback Boosters. It was also oxygen-rich, and it is very similar to the other engines you already implemented.

Edited March 28, 2020 by EStreetRockets
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[Nertea]

21 hours ago, billkerbinsky said:

Electrically pumped like the real-world Rutherford?  (no alternator, burns EC as well as LF+OX, periodically ejects batteries...)

Probably not, honestly. It's going to be odd for someone to look at the engine set and have a single engine that is way out of place in terms of how it works. 

18 hours ago, Mountain Parrot said:

It would be a nice twist on the majority of engines we have in KSP, using electric charge instead of creating it.

Edit: also @Nertea, how many chambers is that juicy 3.75m engine?

it's a 6x AR-1 cluster. 

16 hours ago, EStreetRockets said:

I know that it was supposed to run on N2O4/MMH, but for a small upper stage sustainer engine you could use the Agena 2000 that was proposed for an Atlas V Light in early EELV proposals. Design and Test results: https://www.pdf-archive.com/2017/05/31/design-and-test-results-on-agena-2000/design-and-test-results-on-agena-2000.pdf.

 

Similar to the AJ-800 is the RS-76 which was proposed by Boeing and Rocketdyne for Space Shuttle Flyback Boosters. It was also oxygen-rich, and it is very similar to the other engines you already implemented.

NTO/MMH is ok for me. I'll consider that one, I have a vague suspicion that @CobaltWolf has already done it though. The RS-76 has a total of 1 good image, which is going to eliminate it (plus it's ugly :P). The AJ-800, at least I can do most of it from an NK-33. Things that are options now:

• 2x RD-191 <- probably the most work
• AJ-800 <- probably the least work
• TR-107

[bigyihsuan]

It's a big shame that the mods are considered feature-complete. I was using the triangle truss from Construction to make a solar module for a space station, and I was looking for a triangle docking port like with the octagon and larger sizes. I had to make do with the triangle-to-1.25m adapter and a 1.25m docking port instead. A difference of 1 part, but it'd be nice to have.

[KeaKaka]

2 hours ago, Nertea said:

it's a 6x AR-1 cluster

Nice! 

[PTNLemay]

I've finally reached VASIMR engines and I realize I'm going to need industrial quantities of Xenon or Argon.  But I'm having some difficulty synthesizing them.  I have MKS Kolonization and USI Life Support installed, which come with a bunch of resources (and means of producing them).  It looks like the M-2 Cryogenic thing is the primary means of making the gases I want.  But for some reason when I run it on a test bed, I get a much slower 0.000285/sec instead of the advertised 0.5/sec.  Any idea what could be causing the sluggishness?  I'm guessing there's something I forgot to do.  I have 5-star engineers on board and everything.

Also, is there a way of producing Xenon from something in the ground?  I would love to be able to refuel my VASIMR ships from the moon, but (obviously) it has no atmosphere.

[juanml82]

58 minutes ago, PTNLemay said:

I've finally reached VASIMR engines and I realize I'm going to need industrial quantities of Xenon or Argon.  But I'm having some difficulty synthesizing them.  I have MKS Kolonization and USI Life Support installed, which come with a bunch of resources (and means of producing them).  It looks like the M-2 Cryogenic thing is the primary means of making the gases I want.  But for some reason when I run it on a test bed, I get a much slower 0.000285/sec instead of the advertised 0.5/sec.  Any idea what could be causing the sluggishness?  I'm guessing there's something I forgot to do.  I have 5-star engineers on board and everything.

Also, is there a way of producing Xenon from something in the ground?  I would love to be able to refuel my VASIMR ships from the moon, but (obviously) it has no atmosphere.

AFAIK, the way atmospheric harvesting is designed, the harvest rate depends on atmospheric concentration (low on Kerbin as those are trace gases in air) and the ship's speed

[Likasombodee]

Anyone on 1.8.1 unable to find the "efficient" multi mode engine from NF Aeronautics? It's the one that looks like an aerospike. I can only see one that is atomic powered.

[Altaille]

13 hours ago, Likasombodee said:

Anyone on 1.8.1 unable to find the "efficient" multi mode engine from NF Aeronautics? It's the one that looks like an aerospike. I can only see one that is atomic powered.

I have most of the NF suit and I don't think I have any multimode aerospike engine. Howerver, I just saw that another Nertea mod has one (named Broadsword) : MkIV spaceplane fuselage.

[Nertea]

On 3/29/2020 at 7:21 PM, PTNLemay said:

I've finally reached VASIMR engines and I realize I'm going to need industrial quantities of Xenon or Argon.  But I'm having some difficulty synthesizing them.  I have MKS Kolonization and USI Life Support installed, which come with a bunch of resources (and means of producing them).  It looks like the M-2 Cryogenic thing is the primary means of making the gases I want.  But for some reason when I run it on a test bed, I get a much slower 0.000285/sec instead of the advertised 0.5/sec.  Any idea what could be causing the sluggishness?  I'm guessing there's something I forgot to do.  I have 5-star engineers on board and everything.

Also, is there a way of producing Xenon from something in the ground?  I would love to be able to refuel my VASIMR ships from the moon, but (obviously) it has no atmosphere.

The note shown in the VAB is the ideal harvesting rate - it is scaled by concentration, which you can detect with the AIReS spectrometer. 

The abundance is generally low, which is a bit of a mismash of balance and realism. Since Xenon is so expensive in KSP, it would be shockingly easy to make infinite cash by putting extractors on the launch pad and recovering - therefore rates need to be low on Kerbin. There is higher abundance off the top of my head on Duna and Laythe. This is typical as RL xenon is quite rare!

You can also get a bit of Xenon from reprocessing nuclear waste. 

Overall, a more abundant gas for EP is argon, you'll have much faster extraction there. For maximum ISRU you need to trade performance and us Lithium-based engines. 

17 hours ago, Likasombodee said:

Anyone on 1.8.1 unable to find the "efficient" multi mode engine from NF Aeronautics? It's the one that looks like an aerospike. I can only see one that is atomic powered.

The efficient one is the one that looks like the RAPIER but bigger.

[MoeKitsune]

Do the engines in this pack have RealPlume configs?

[Likasombodee]

8 hours ago, Nertea said:

The efficient one is the one that looks like the RAPIER but bigger.

 

Oops, i meant the one multimode aerospike. Is that one still in the mod?

 

 

[KeaKaka]

5 hours ago, Barely A Canuck said:

Do the engines in this pack have RealPlume configs?

Yes

[Electrocutor]

Near Future Aeronautics:

[ERR 08:20:40.560] DDS: DXT3(32x32, MipMap=False) - DXT3 format is NOT supported. Use DXT5
[WRN 08:20:40.560] Texture load error in 'C:\Games\KSP 1.9.1\GameData\WildBlueIndustries\001KerbalActuators\Icons\Gear.dds'
[ERR 08:20:40.649] DDS: DXT3(512x512, MipMap=False) - DXT3 format is NOT supported. Use DXT5
[WRN 08:20:40.649] Texture load error in 'C:\Games\KSP 1.9.1\GameData\WildBlueIndustries\001KerbalActuators\Parts\Utility\SampleArm\BaseUnit.dds'
[ERR 08:20:40.659] DDS: DXT3(512x512, MipMap=False) - DXT3 format is NOT supported. Use DXT5
[WRN 08:20:40.659] Texture load error in 'C:\Games\KSP 1.9.1\GameData\WildBlueIndustries\001KerbalActuators\Parts\Utility\SampleArm\Mk1StationArm.dds'
[ERR 08:20:40.670] DDS: DXT3(512x512, MipMap=False) - DXT3 format is NOT supported. Use DXT5
[WRN 08:20:40.670] Texture load error in 'C:\Games\KSP 1.9.1\GameData\WildBlueIndustries\001KerbalActuators\Parts\Utility\SampleArm\Mk1StationArmEmiss.dds'
[ERR 08:20:40.751] DDS: DXT3(512x512, MipMap=False) - DXT3 format is NOT supported. Use DXT5
[WRN 08:20:40.751] Texture load error in 'C:\Games\KSP 1.9.1\GameData\WildBlueIndustries\001KerbalActuators\Parts\Utility\SampleCrane\KonstructionKrane.dds'

[LOG 08:21:17.017] PartLoader: Compiling Part 'NearFutureAeronautics/Parts/Nacelle/nfa-intake-largeshock/nfa-intake-largeshock'
[ERR 08:21:17.020] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'AnimatedIntake'

The MiniAVC also throws errors on the WildBlueIndustries stuff. Angel-125 does have a newer 1.8.1 version of actuators on github.

The missing AnimatedIntake module seems like it might require an additional dependency of B9AnimationModules. Adding B9AnimationModules does not correct it, though.

 

NearFutureSolar:

[ERR 08:21:30.948] Material doesn't have a texture property '_SpecMap'
*there are a ton of these

 

@Nertea 

Is there a way to setup the RPM-only internals to fall under MM so they can use NEEDS and only try to load if you have RPM installed? They cause a flood of logs for the missing prop models and such. (MarkIVSystem/Spaces/mk4cockpit/mk4cockpit-internal-rpm/mk4cockpitIVA-rpm, MarkIVSystem/Spaces/mk4cockpit-2/mk4cockpit-2internal-rpm/mk4cockpit-2IVA-rpm)

 

After installing all of your mods (Restock, NearFuture, MkIV, HeatControl, etc), there seems to be 3 B9 resource registrations that duplicate a name somewhere (I would assume this is non-destructive though):

[LOG 09:25:02.095] Generating field configuration for type B9PartSwitch.TankResource
[ERR 09:25:02.099] B9TankSettings: The tank type OX already exists
[ERR 09:25:02.099] B9TankSettings: The tank type LF already exists
[ERR 09:25:02.100] B9TankSettings: The tank type LFOX already exists

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by Electrocutor

[EStreetRockets]

@Nertea Just out of curiosity, are you considering any new additions to the NF suite of mods?

Also.

On 3/28/2020 at 11:02 PM, Nertea said:

NTO/MMH is ok for me. I'll consider that one, I have a vague suspicion that @CobaltWolf has already done it though.

I don't think @CobaltWolf has made an Agena 2000, and since it is an EELV I doubt he would. 

[Nertea]

2 hours ago, Electrocutor said:

The MiniAVC also throws errors on the WildBlueIndustries stuff. Angel-125 does have a newer 1.8.1 version of actuators on github.

The missing AnimatedIntake module seems like it might require an additional dependency of B9AnimationModules. Adding B9AnimationModules does not correct it, though.

As the OP states, this mod hasn't been updated in over a year. The dependency versions are strongly out of date - it is indicated that if you want to use it, you need to update the dependencies.

2 hours ago, Electrocutor said:

Is there a way to setup the RPM-only internals to fall under MM so they can use NEEDS and only try to load if you have RPM installed? They cause a flood of logs for the missing prop models and such. (MarkIVSystem/Spaces/mk4cockpit/mk4cockpit-internal-rpm/mk4cockpitIVA-rpm, MarkIVSystem/Spaces/mk4cockpit-2/mk4cockpit-2internal-rpm/mk4cockpit-2IVA-rpm)

 

Probably, but I'm likely removing these from the main mod anyways.

1 hour ago, EStreetRockets said:

@Nertea Just out of curiosity, are you considering any new additions to the NF suite of mods?

What, is > 750 parts over ~20 mods not enough? It's already hard enough to keep up with keeping them all current...

[pt1243]

29 minutes ago, Nertea said:

As the OP states, this mod hasn't been updated in over a year. The dependency versions are strongly out of date - it is indicated that if you want to use it, you need to update the dependencies.

Yep, I can confirm that as long as the dependencies are updated to the latest versions, NFA will work just fine on 1.9.1. This should solve the issue.

[Electrocutor]

29 minutes ago, pt1243 said:

Yep, I can confirm that as long as the dependencies are updated to the latest versions, NFA will work just fine on 1.9.1. This should solve the issue.

Where did you find the resolution for the missing AnimatedIntake module?

[pt1243]

27 minutes ago, Electrocutor said:

Where did you find the resolution for the missing AnimatedIntake module?

I didn't find it - as far as I can tell, there is no issue regardless of if it is there or not. The intake appears to open and close just fine, with no cosmetic changes: https://imgur.com/a/GycBVbV

[sturmhauke]

1 hour ago, Nertea said:

What, is > 750 parts over ~20 mods not enough? It's already hard enough to keep up with keeping them all current...

I also want a unicorn and a giant strawberry.

[JadeOfMaar]

4 hours ago, Electrocutor said:

After installing all of your mods (Restock, NearFuture, MkIV, HeatControl, etc), there seems to be 3 B9 resource registrations that duplicate a name somewhere (I would assume this is non-destructive though):

[LOG 09:25:02.095] Generating field configuration for type B9PartSwitch.TankResource
[ERR 09:25:02.099] B9TankSettings: The tank type OX already exists
[ERR 09:25:02.099] B9TankSettings: The tank type LF already exists
[ERR 09:25:02.100] B9TankSettings: The tank type LFOX already exists

 

I'm betting on NF Spacecraft, MkIV and CryoTanks. The LFO and LFOX tank types don't need (anymore) to exist at all if their reason for being is a possible time when B9PS did not carry tank type definitions. (B9PS caries tank types named "LiquidFuel" and "LFO".) The OX tank type is purely for use with CryoEngines, I bet. And yes it's non-destructive.

[bombogenesis]

Absolutely love the mod but have just found that the magnetoplasma whatever thrusters are just too hard to keep up with electricity wise.  Maybe I'm missing something but to make a decent sized lander I'm having to put on 400k-500k worth of solar panels that are just so whacky big that it makes it hard to build.  I think maybe I might be missing something.  Made it to Moho and back for the first time ever though! Thank you.

Edited April 5, 2020 by bombogenesis

[sturmhauke]

25 minutes ago, bombogenesis said:

Absolutely love the mod but have just found that the magnetoplasma whatever thrusters are just too hard to keep up with electricity wise.  Maybe I'm missing something but to make a decent sized lander I'm having to put on 400k-500k worth of solar panels that are just so whacky big that it makes it hard to build.  I think maybe I might be missing something.  Made it to Moho and back for the first time ever though! Thank you.

For the more power-hungry drives you need to use nuclear reactors. It doesn't have to be the Near Future ones, but I mean you already have them so you might as well.

[DStaal]

Also, for power-hungry applications you may want to look at capacitors from NFE.  A couple of those can save you quite a bit of generator/solar capacity - assuming you plan out what you need correctly.

[bombogenesis]

12 hours ago, sturmhauke said:

For the more power-hungry drives you need to use nuclear reactors. It doesn't have to be the Near Future ones, but I mean you already have them so you might as well.

 

10 hours ago, DStaal said:

Also, for power-hungry applications you may want to look at capacitors from NFE.  A couple of those can save you quite a bit of generator/solar capacity - assuming you plan out what you need correctly.

Sweet..I'll look into how to use them.  Thanks for the reply!