[PLUGIN][ALPHA-10] City Lights and Clouds on Kerbin/Others

[rbray89]

What altitude are the clouds? Can you make them only about 3000m up, a good average of cloud heights? That might help with the issue razark is talking about.

And, you asked what I think: incredible. Utterly incredible.

Haha, yup. The radius can be altered to move them to any altitude. And thanks!

[rbray89]

Let's see if this works:

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If you look just around the planet, you can see a darker band, with the clouds visible within it. It is most obvious where it crosses the brighter "galactic plane" area.

Hmm... Ok, thanks. I'll look into how to fix it. On the otherhand, shouldn't there be some sort of atmosphere? Would it help if the clouds were lower? I don't like that as much as they would be too close to the ground.

[NathanKell]

Other than some wisps of ice, there really _aren't_ clouds above 6km, and consider that Kerbin's atmosphere is shallower than Earth's. (Figures I saw for mid-level clouds are 2km-6km). But remember that even 6km is 20,000 feet, and I rather doubt that your average joe cloud is that high. Long story short---lower would be good.

What height are they now?

EDIT: Apparently 7.2km and 15km, if "radius" does what I assume it does?

I'm going to try with radii 1.004 and 1.008...

Edited October 20, 2013 by NathanKell

[razark]

On the otherhand, shouldn't there be some sort of atmosphere? Would it help if the clouds were lower? I don't like that as much as they would be too close to the ground.

I can understand some sort of atmosphere, but this is just a bit too hard of a transition, rather than a gradual thinning. Perhaps lower clouds would help, but I'm not sure what an appropriate altitude would be.

Edit:

Thank you, NathanKell, for saving me that much googling time.

[tobyb121]

This looks great, it's making real progress. However for the cloud map at the moment I think you have a grayscale map which you are using for both the colour and the alpha, this gives you that grey colour around all of the clouds. It would be better to use a plain white fill for the colour map then use the cloud map for the opacity only, this means the edges of your clouds will be a 50% transparent white, rather than 50% transparent 50% black

[Lanfranc]

I can understand some sort of atmosphere, but this is just a bit too hard of a transition, rather than a gradual thinning. Perhaps lower clouds would help, but I'm not sure what an appropriate altitude would be.

It's actually quite similar to how Earth's atmosphere looks from orbit. If anything, the transition should have more colour due to reflected light from the day side:

[rbray89]

hmmm... the cloud layer certainly seems better from the orbit view at those values, though it doesn't look as nice on ground. Mostly due to the resolution of the textures I'm afraid... Though that won't matter as much if I get the particle system in unity working to produce some nice volumetric cloud.

[Lack]

I have to say, this really is shaping up splendidly. Thank you for setting up the .cfg, I've had some fun messing around with Eve (and Jool and Laythe for that matter).

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It also gives you an appreciation of how thick the Evian atmosphere is.

[rbray89]

I have to say, this really is shaping up splendidly. Thank you for setting up the .cfg, I've had some fun messing around with Eve (and Jool and Laythe for that matter).

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It also gives you an appreciation of how thick the Evian atmosphere is.

OOOOH! Beautiful! I "figured out" the issue behind the sky diamonds, but I still want to try and make the edges less sharp.

[Whirligig Girl]

That sharp transition in the atmosphere is only visible from night side and low altitude.

[razark]

That sharp transition in the atmosphere is only visible from night side and low altitude.

I disagree. The pictures I posted show the transition on both the day side and from a distance. It is more noticeable at night and low altitude, but that does cover half of the orbit, especially for a LKO station.

[rbray89]

I disagree. The pictures I posted show the transition on both the day side and from a distance. It is more noticeable at night and low altitude, but that does cover half of the orbit, especially for a LKO station.

I think I fixed it. I figured out how to calculate the vertex normals relative to camera position, and I use the dot product to fade the edges out. I will eventually expose the values through the config. I also was able to fix the diamonds in the sky and add a detail texture to the underside to make the clouds look more like clouds.

[pizzaoverhead]

I think I fixed it. I figured out how to calculate the vertex normals relative to camera position, and I use the dot product to fade the edges out. I will eventually expose the values through the config. I also was able to fix the diamonds in the sky and add a detail texture to the underside to make the clouds look more like clouds.

It sounds like those are similar angles to what you would use for colouring air glow. Maybe something to consider for the future:

[rbray89]

It sounds like those are similar angles to what you would use for colouring air glow. Maybe something to consider for the future:

Yeah, it is often a trick used for rim lighting. I could probably pull something like that off later

[rbray89]

Are there any features not mentioned on the initial post that would be desired?

[Exposure]

I'm...not sure what else we could possibly want that's within the current scope of the mod.

I mean "actual clouds that can be flown through" seems kinda like the end goal of a cloud mod for a game that doesn't currently come with clouds, and you're already going try to attempt that, so...yeah.

[rbray89]

I'm...not sure what else we could possibly want that's within the current scope of the mod.

I mean "actual clouds that can be flown through" seems kinda like the end goal of a cloud mod for a game that doesn't currently come with clouds, and you're already going try to attempt that, so...yeah.

Haha, yeah... one idea I was toying around with was to essentially simulate a planetary weather system (wind, precipitation, cloud generation, light+albedo = heat, etc) but then that might be out of scope...

[Superfluous J]

I tried this for the first time in 0.22 today (I phase in my mods to make sure there are no weird interactions, and I just had to have some of the play-altering and informational mods first!) and it looks beautiful!

No, I can't think of anything I'd want that you don't already have planned. I may be blinded, though, being happy this mod even exists.

[razark]

I think I fixed it.

I'm still seeing the hard transition, but I have to actually look for it. So, it's still there, but it's a lot less noticeable.

Running through a launch now.

Hrm. 44 KM up, and the horizon is looking odd.

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From 100 KM, it's much less noticeable. Barely visible.

And from 150 KM, I'm not seeing it at all.

So, for a short period on ascent, the horizon looks odd, but other than that, this version is looking nice.

Edited October 21, 2013 by razark

[Exposure]

Haha, yeah... one idea I was toying around with was to essentially simulate a planetary weather system (wind, precipitation, cloud generation, light+albedo = heat, etc) but then that might be out of scope...

However, I don't think any of us would mind if you wanted to make that your next mod project after this.

Always wanted to see how Jeb would handle launching in the middle of a hurricane...

[theonegalen]

To make the lights from the lighting layer be realistically dissipated by the cloud layer would be awesome. Also, if you look at photos of the earth from space that are from lunar orbit or the lunar surface, the dark side is usually completely dark, without any city lights visible. Perhaps the lights should become invisible from a certain distance as indicated by the inverse square law? The current brightness tends to look great from LKO but way too bright from Kerbosynchronous orbit or around the orbit of the Mun.

Of course, the fact that the distance is 10x less due to the scaling of the Kerbol System to the Solar System would actually mean the percieved brightness for lights with similar energy would be 100x brighter.

[rbray89]

I'm still seeing the hard transition, but I have to actually look for it. So, it's still there, but it's a lot less noticeable.

Running through a launch now.

Hrm. 44 KM up, and the horizon is looking odd.

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From 100 KM, it's much less noticeable. Barely visible.

And from 150 KM, I'm not seeing it at all.

So, for a short period on ascent, the horizon looks odd, but other than that, this version is looking nice.

Yeah, I'm trying to figure out how to cull a surface once outside it... apparently more difficult then one might think.

[Superfluous J]

I can't stop taking screenshots when this mod really shines. Which is often.

Edited October 22, 2013 by 5thHorseman

[BFGfreak]

However, I don't think any of us would mind if you wanted to make that your next mod project after this.

Always wanted to see how Jeb would handle launching in the middle of a hurricane...

He'd wait until the eye passes over head, not because it's safer, but because it's more awesome to launch from the dead center of a hurricane.

[rbray89]

I can't stop taking screenshots when this mod really shines. Which is often.

Aww... Shucks... well hold onto your hats, cause I think I have another set of slight improvements coming.