[1.12.5] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.14.0 "металл" 30/Sep/2024)

[scottadges]

  On 3/19/2025 at 2:19 PM, Pappystein said:

That is in part why I tend to fly LDC Titan (Titan V in my parlance) over Delta IV.  

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Thanks for your response. Looking at the BDB Wiki on the Titan LDC, what are your thoughts on these various options?

Have you experimented with any of these? I'm wondering how useful the 3rd stage Inon D would be in getting various space station modules into LKO.

Launch Vehicle	First Stage	Boosters	Second Stage	Third Stage
Titan 3 LDC-2 (1966)	4x LR87-AJ11	2x UA1207 SRB	1x LR-91
Titan 3L2 / 4	4x LR87-AJ11	2/4x UA1207 SRB	1x LR-91	Inon D
Barbarian	5x LR87-AJ11	5x UA1207 SRB	1x LR-87

Edited Wednesday at 04:05 PM by scottadges

[GoldForest]

Posting some pictures from my new endeavor over in my Mission Thread. Saturn C-8C launching the second shield and core module of the Icarus International Solar Space Station. 

What makes the C-8C different than the C-8B? 

-New engines for all stages
-The Fairing was moved from the third stage to the second for better payload capacity, and better aerodynamics.

Full album: Imgur: The magic of the Internet

[BNSF1995]

C-8?! I thought BDB wasn't gonna have the C-8!

[septemberWaves]

  On 3/20/2025 at 11:08 AM, BNSF1995 said:

C-8?! I thought BDB wasn't gonna have the C-8!

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That looks very much like a kitbash. BDB is far too detail-oriented to introduce a rocket with engines superglued to the bottom of a tank instead of a proper engine mount.

Edited Thursday at 12:34 PM by septemberWaves

[GoldForest]

  On 3/20/2025 at 11:08 AM, BNSF1995 said:

C-8?! I thought BDB wasn't gonna have the C-8!

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It is a kitbash like September said. Only reason I'm really posting it is because the engines are BDB... and I want to show off the C-8 to spite some people. The "Friendly" spiting, mind you. I do it in a friendly manner. 

  On 3/20/2025 at 12:32 PM, septemberWaves said:

That looks very much like a kitbash. BDB is far too detail-oriented to introduce a rocket with engines superglued to the bottom of a tank instead of a proper engine mount.

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I mean, I could use one of the NF engine mounts, but it wouldn't look like the skirt I have on the C-8 now. I wanted to go for the actual C-8 skirt as it appears in the drawings and concept art. 

Edited Thursday at 03:37 PM by GoldForest

[ArgentBlue]

  On 3/20/2025 at 7:40 AM, GoldForest said:

Posting some pictures from my new endeavor over in my Mission Thread. Saturn C-8C launching the second shield and core module of the Icarus International Solar Space Station. 

What makes the C-8C different than the C-8B? 

-New engines for all stages
-The Fairing was moved from the third stage to the second for better payload capacity, and better aerodynamics.

Full album: Imgur: The magic of the Internet

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If you don't mind me asking, where did you get the deployable sun shield from?

[Pappystein]

  On 3/19/2025 at 4:04 PM, scottadges said:

Thanks for your response. Looking at the BDB Wiki on the Titan LDC, what are your thoughts on these various options?

Have you experimented with any of these? I'm wondering how useful the 3rd stage Inon D would be in getting various space station modules into LKO.

Launch Vehicle	First Stage	Boosters	Second Stage	Third Stage
Titan 3 LDC-2 (1966)	4x LR87-AJ11	2x UA1207 SRB	1x LR-91
Titan 3L2 / 4	4x LR87-AJ11	2/4x UA1207 SRB	1x LR-91	Inon D
Barbarian	5x LR87-AJ11	5x UA1207 SRB	1x LR-87

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I don't use "classical" LDC builds.   Instead I use Rocket Motor Menageries LCH4 STME engine for the first stage and LH2 with 2 or 4 LR87 LH2 Vacuum engines for the 2nd stage and only need SRB/SRMs of 120+" diameter to Build a ISS equivalent in typical orbit on JNSQ.  

Note with JNSQ I am launching from near Equator so I am not needing "AS MUCH" as people using KSSRSS2.5 or 2.7.  

My 3rd "tug" stage for some of the more insane parts like the Solar beams for ISS I utilize an Aardvark derived (with twin TR201 engines) tug + a RCS+Probe core and tanks end cap on the other end (the RCS/TANK/Core is utilized to reduce the mass movement arm of the Solar wing arm and is separated right before docking (which is tricky to do but safer than NOT having it.)     Both Tug and the RCS "endcap" then dock together and de-orbit.

NOTE for space tug builds you want to AVOID LCH4 or LH2 as a fuel source unless you are doing something with insane electrical power like a Nuclear powered rocket.   The cost to keep them from boiling off is too great.   You want an AZ50/NTO or failing that LF/O tug for your station building

In the Classical LDC Builds Barbarian is kinda out of the realm of possibility... But the 4 engine 8 bell LDCs are perfectly possible (and is what is intended for you to fly.    I am using my hypergolic fuel patch in the extras folder so I have to use shorter stages (because fuel mass is higher than LF/O)  But I can do an OK job with it.  I have just been enjoying the less SRM performance of the STME CH4 booster engine with my launches (also I argue it is better for the environment)

The only way to do Barbarian requires you to use 3.75m or greater Dia tankage and kitbashing an engine mount together.

I went looking through my Imgur archive to see if I had any photos saved of a Push Pull tug arrangement as I described above... didn't find any (I have two archives of photos on my PC I will look through when I get home latter tonight but I DID Find this:

Lets see how bad Cobalt Cringes with this image:

My Original Flyback booster with the ORIGINAL Atlas V "Muo V" fuel tanks and engine!   This was used as an LRB for a Saturn V Heavy build

From the same time frame the original LDC engine mount setup with 4 LR87-AJ-11s (before the new art redo on the engines, the engines were about 1/10th smaller and the nodes for them were in less than perfect place hence the move node visible:

Edited Thursday at 07:03 PM by Pappystein

[GoldForest]

  On 3/20/2025 at 5:14 PM, ArgentBlue said:

If you don't mind me asking, where did you get the deployable sun shield from?

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There's also a bigger version, as seen in the last pic, that requires it to be built in space, or to be cheated into space after being fully assembled via VAB

Edited Thursday at 07:08 PM by GoldForest

[scottadges]

Thank you for your detailed response and examples of modifications. Good things to think about as I'm trying to scale up my rocket portfolio and working through the tech tree.

  On 3/20/2025 at 6:50 PM, Pappystein said:

I use Rocket Motor Menageries LCH4 STME engine for the first stage and LH2 with 2 or 4 LR87 LH2 Vacuum engines for the 2nd stage

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I'll look into that mod as I push things further out of Kerbin SOI. Historically for me in KSP, it's been a lot of SRBs and radial fuel tanks, but I'm trying to be more intentional and efficient with how I'm building rockets.

It's funny you mention this: 

  On 3/20/2025 at 6:50 PM, Pappystein said:

for space tug builds you want to AVOID LCH4 or LH2 as a fuel source unless you are doing something with insane electrical power like a Nuclear powered rocket

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I've been using the BDB Bossart (Atlas) LV-3C as I start getting heavier satellites (I'm using Probes Before Crew) and the LH2 2nd stage has been good for delivery to various orbits. But I can see the boil-off being a problem with extended usage. I don't want to add more weight with radiators and electrical generation just to move around some satellites or space station parts.

So I'm still experimenting in this area, but appreciate your advice.

[Pappystein]

  On 3/20/2025 at 9:03 PM, scottadges said:

I've been using the BDB Bossart (Atlas) LV-3C as I start getting heavier satellites (I'm using Probes Before Crew) and the LH2 2nd stage has been good for delivery to various orbits. But I can see the boil-off being a problem with extended usage. I don't want to add more weight with radiators and electrical generation just to move around some satellites or space station parts.

So I'm still experimenting in this area, but appreciate your advice.

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My current Science play-through has been with the Gradual Progression Tech tree which is kinda the same as Probes before crew but with the whole tree re-organized.   I mostly like it (a few quibbles on the BDB part location side of things but that is opinion etc etc etc) 

The biggest suggestion I have for you.  If you are doing a mostly BDB play-through is experiment experiment experiment.    If you have unlocked Titan  parts the Titan II/III/IV 2nd stage makes a great starting point for a larger space tug.  The LR91 engine has plenty of ISP in roll and it is smaller than 2.5m diameter which allows you to fit it under more Aeroshells.

 

There are ways to do some CRAZY fun things with BDB... just have to put your mind to it and "think outside of the box"

 

[Richmountain112]

It would also be cool if we had shuttle payload mounts and didn't have to kitbash one together.

Edited Thursday at 11:32 PM by Richmountain112

[Hank Kerman]

  On 3/20/2025 at 11:32 PM, Richmountain112 said:

It would also be cool if we had shuttle payload mounts and didn't have to kitbash one together.

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On an unrelated topic, can there be a white paint partswitch for the AARDV Unpressurized Cargo Segment? The other parts do have it, so it sort of breaks it up.

[Quinby Kerman]

I am genuinely so confused about all the Gemini parts rn. They load in sandbox but not career pls help me

[Pappystein]

  On 3/21/2025 at 2:31 AM, Quinby Kerman said:

I am genuinely so confused about all the Gemini parts rn. They load in sandbox but not career pls help me

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If they load in sandbox but not career then you have a non BDB mod interfering ...    Search for LEO if you are in the vab

[Quinby Kerman]

I have, and in the RnD center.

[Quinby Kerman]

i feellike imlosingit

Edited Friday at 03:38 AM by Quinby Kerman

[Quinby Kerman]

  On 3/13/2025 at 11:36 PM, Quinby Kerman said:

@DeadJohn I checked every node, and they are absent (I haven't started the new save yet), and the parts load, yet the only parts I'm allowed to launch are the decoupler, heatshield, and capsule. All part variants (non-eject-able nose cover, fused fuselages, nose camera, etc.) are there, but crucially, retro motors, reentry rcs, and parachutes are necessary yet missing, as well as the OAMS, docking nose, retro module, and service module. How do I post a log?

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I am restating this, most "normal" parts needed to build Gemini are missing to me, yet other variants (also stated) are present. all parts are there in sandbox, but not a fully-unlocked science save. I have literally NO idea what is causing this. does @Pappystein, @Zorg, @CobaltWolf, @Mr. Kerbin, or anyone else have any ideas?!? Thank you for your time.

[DeadJohn]

  On 3/21/2025 at 4:07 AM, Quinby Kerman said:

I am restating this, most "normal" parts needed to build Gemini are missing to me, yet other variants (also stated) are present. all parts are there in sandbox, but not a fully-unlocked science save. I have literally NO idea what is causing this. does @Pappystein, @Zorg, @CobaltWolf, @Mr. Kerbin, or anyone else have any ideas?!? Thank you for your time.

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You need to share your log file. Put it on a file sharing site and post the link to it here. Read the "How to get support thread" if you don't know how to do that.

Maybe you installed BDB slightly wrong. Maybe you're using a bad tech tree. Maybe some other mod is conflicting. There are dozens of things that could be going wrong, and the log file will help narrow it down.

 

[KeaKaka]

Atlas II

[Zorg]

  On 3/21/2025 at 4:07 AM, Quinby Kerman said:

I am restating this, most "normal" parts needed to build Gemini are missing to me, yet other variants (also stated) are present. all parts are there in sandbox, but not a fully-unlocked science save. I have literally NO idea what is causing this. does @Pappystein, @Zorg, @CobaltWolf, @Mr. Kerbin, or anyone else have any ideas?!? Thank you for your time.

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you will need to post a log. But this is 99% a due to some patch by another mod affecting the tech placement or visibility.

Edited Saturday at 05:25 PM by Zorg

[Quinby Kerman]

Hmm, I'm testing a solution rn (probably won't work)

  On 3/21/2025 at 7:08 AM, DeadJohn said:

You need to share your log file. Put it on a file sharing site and post the link to it here. Read the "How to get support thread" if you don't know how to do that.

Maybe you installed BDB slightly wrong. Maybe you're using a bad tech tree. Maybe some other mod is conflicting. There are dozens of things that could be going wrong, and the log file will help narrow it down.

 

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Also, I can't find any other logs than KSP.log

[Quinby Kerman]

yeah it didn't work

[KeaKaka]

  On 3/22/2025 at 6:16 PM, Quinby Kerman said:

Hmm, I'm testing a solution rn (probably won't work)

Also, I can't find any other logs than KSP.log

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KSP.log is the one you want, I'd recommend just loading the game to the start menu, then closing the game from there and then grabbing the log file the game has generated just so it isn't too big.

[ItsUrsus]

Is there a mod that adds Martian spacecraft like Pathfinder/Sojourner, MER, Curiosity and Perseverance rover/lander parts compatible with BDB?

[Cheesecake]

  On 3/23/2025 at 12:15 PM, ItsUrsus said:

Is there a mod that adds Martian spacecraft like Pathfinder/Sojourner, MER, Curiosity and Perseverance rover/lander parts compatible with BDB?

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There was a mod with Curiosity about 10 years ago. But it will probably no longer work.
Rover mods are very rare.