[1.8.x] Kerbal Foundries -- Continued - Tracks, Wheels, and Gear

[Fletch4]

does kf work in 1.12.2?

[Fletch4]

new page!

[Tonas1997]

On 10/11/2018 at 3:28 PM, Shadowmage said:

@Apaseall I'm enjoying the conversation

Correct -- I designed the wheel collider system entirely in the Unity editor, where I don't have access to any of the KSP classes (source files), so there is no such thing as a 'Vessel', or a 'Part', etc.  These wheel colliders actually work far, far, better in the Unity Editor as compared to KSP; but tests revealed this was almost entirely due to the joints used to link different parts together -- joints cause all sorts of instabilities in the simulation (as the joints are, basically, just another spring-damper system that holds the parts together).

That is not to say that having more information couldn't make the simulation better (it can), but I wanted to start from a 'realism' perspective before jumping into hacky-land.  In real world physics, an individual wheels suspension knows absolutely nothing about the other wheels on the vehicle, or how much the vehicle weighs -- they for the most part, function entirely independently (anti-roll bars excluded).

But also... knowing the vessel mass by itself does me little good.  I also need to know the distribution of mass (moment of inertia? inertia tensors for the various axis? idk the term for it...), so that I could effectively 'predict' how the vessel would react to specific forces being applied.  Which is all fine in theory for a single-rigidbody setup; but again the Unity joints and 'each part is a rigidbody' setup completely remove any potential for that simulation to be entirely accurate.  It -might- still be a viable addition to the simulation, and I'm thinking that the additional information I could get out of it would likely be close enough to work in all but the most noodley of craft designs (sim would assume joints are rigid, so if someone was 'abusing' the terrible joints.... it would play havok with that part of the sim).  Something to investigate for the future when I have time and feel like learning some new physics concepts (rigidbody dynamics).

 

Good news on this front -- I did add in the code for this last night, and you can grab a .dll with the functions enabled from the dev branch on the KSPWheel repo -- (d/l link for dll --  https://github.com/shadowmage45/KSPWheel/raw/dev/GameData/KSPWheel/Plugin/KSPWheel.dll ).  More good news is that the new curve does increase effective friction -- so much that I was unable to spin out in a standard 4-wheeled vehicle no matter how I tried.  Drift a bit at high-speeds.. sure.  Tip over if CG was too high.. yep... more-so than before.  So perhaps the new curve was a bit 'too far'.... but was a good initial testing point.

I didn't implement it as a full 'float curve' setup, but rather it has the chance to input values for the three important points of the simulation (extremum, asymptote, and tail).  An example of the patch/config I was using for testing is below.  Replace the .dll in your KSPWheel folder with the one from the link above, and drop the patch in your GameData folder somewhere, and it'll patch all KSPWheel using parts with the new curve.

 

@PART[*]:HAS[@MODULE[KSPWheelBase]]
{
	@MODULE[KSPWheelBase]
	{
		//point = 'time' along the curve  (the x coordinate)
		//value = value at that time in the curve (the y coordinate)
		
		//there is no starting slip point or value, it is always 0, 0
		%asSlipPoint = 0.06
		%asSlipVal = 1
		%exSlipPoint = 0.35
		%exSlipVal = 1
		//there is no 'tail slip point' -- it is always 1.0
		%tailSlipVal = 1
	}
}

 

Do the latest DLLs for version 1.8.1 allow me to configure the friction curves like this?

[Axelord FTW]

Installed, then removed. Parts are there but I'm getting wonky jank if I try to right click on part in the VAB, or in the field. I get an incomplete box, and the right-click functions effectively locks up for all parts after, KF-related or not.
I could  try to hunt down the issue but KF isn't that important to me current career so I'll let it float for now. If anyone is having this strange issue, well you're not alone.

[OldMold]

working fine on 1.12x for me. Maybe dependencies/mod conflicts?

[tonimark]

it works for 1.12.2 but unfortently older versions were better (since they contain more wheels and anti-grav repulsors)but it still a good mod

[Skywavestar]

On 2017/1/16 at AM5点33分, Shadowmage said:

KerbalFoundries - 续

重新发明轮子。字面上地。

这是 KerbalFoundries 延续的主要发布和开发线程，最初由 Lo-Fi 和 Gaalidas 创建，在原始作者的明确许可和原始许可条款下继续进行新开发。

这个模组为 KSP 添加了各种新部件，包括车轮、履带和反重力推斥器。有关此 mod 中车轮和履带可用的功能列表，请参阅 KSPWheels 文档 ( https://github.com/shadowmage45/KSPWheel/wiki )。目前包括四个轮子模型、八个轨道模型、三个反推器模型、一个单滑架/滑雪板、一个单螺杆驱动器和三个可调节的飞机起落架。

车轮或履带部件不需要或不支持 Tweakscale（尽管您应该可以毫无问题地安装它，但车轮不会使用 TS 进行缩放）。零件的缩放是通过 KSPWheel 插件的原生缩放支持完成的，并且包括所有缩放变量（rpm、负载处理、电机功率输出）的可配置缩放功率（在游戏内难度菜单中）。

许多选项都可以通过游戏内的股票难度选项菜单获得和配置。寻找 KSPWheel，所有选项都将在该选项卡下，包括缩放功率和损坏模型调整。

下载：
Github 上提供的版本 (  https://github.com/shadowmage45/KerbalFoundries2/releases )
 

问题/错误报告：
通过 GitHub ( https://github.com/shadowmage45/KerbalFoundries2/issues )报告所有问题。  
包括日志文件、问题描述和屏幕截图（如果它们有助于解释问题）。

Mod 依赖项：
Kerbal Foundries 包括（捆绑）以下库和依赖项。

• KSP轮
  • KSPWheel 是根据自己的许可 (GPL3) 分发的。源代码和许可详情可在以下网址找到：https : //github.com/shadowmage45/KSPWheel
  • 论坛页面：https : //forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/152782-18x-kspwheel-physics-based-alternate-wheel-collider-api-only/
• 模块管理器
  • Module Manager 是根据其自己的许可证 (CC-SA) 分发的。源代码和许可详情可在以下网址找到：https://github。com /sarbian/ModuleManager
  • 论坛页面：https ://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/50533-18x-module-manager-413-november-30th-2019-right-to-ludicrous-speed/
• 纹理无限
  • Textures Unlimited 是根据自己的许可 (GPL3) 分发的。源代码和许可详情可在以下网址找到：  https ://github.com/shadowmage45/TexturesUnlimited
  • 论坛页面：https ://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/167450-18x-textures-unlimited-pbr-shader-texture-set-and-model-loading-api/

 

文档：
有关 PartModules 的特性、功能和配置的信息，请参阅 KSPWheel wiki (  https://github.com/shadowmage45/KSPWheel/wiki )。

 

图片、截图、示例：

<被论坛更新删除，终有一天会回来>

更改日志：
 * 完整日志 --  https://github.com/shadowmage45/KerbalFoundries2/releases

已知问题：
* 零件平衡有点随意 - 可以根据反馈进行更改（尤其是缩放平衡）
* 缩放平衡是 WIP - 缩放功率尚未最终确定（电机、质量、速度、负载等），但可以在游戏内配置设置中配置。
* 车轮未接地时影响 GC 的问题 - 正在调查中。
* KSPWheel 存在的任何其他问题（请参阅 KSPWheel 存储库/问题列表）

 

未来计划：
* 更多清理配置和大量平衡工作。
* 额外的着陆腿变体。包括更多的“着陆器”风格。
* 额外的起落架变体。单轮直齿轮，多轮侧展开齿轮，大型货机式多轮可展开齿轮。
* 为 TU 重新着色配置；遮罩纹理、归一化参数或遮罩、纹理集配置以及补丁更新以启用重新着色。这些可能是一个额外的纹理集，它利用现有纹理以及新提供的蒙版纹理。


法律和许可：
KerbalFoundries - 来自原始 Kerbal Foundries 的后续模型和艺术资产根据 KerbalFoundries 的原始许可在 CC-BY-NC-SA 许可下进行许可、发布和分发。
可调节起落架模型和纹理 - 最初由 BahamutoD 根据可调节起落架的原始许可在CC-BY-SA许可下修改和分发。
这个 mod 使用 KSPWheel API 用于车轮对撞机物理和 PartModules，并根据自己的许可条款（GPL 3.0+）重新分发它。源代码和许可证详细信息可在以下位置找到：( https://github.com/shadowmage45/KSPWheel )。
这个模组根据其自己的许可证（GPL 3.0+）的条款包括并重新分发 TexturesUnlimited。源代码和许可证详细信息可以在: (  https://github.com/shadowmage45/TexturesUnlimited )
此 mod 根据其自己的许可证 (CC-SA) 条款包括并重新分发 ModuleManager。源代码和许可详情可在以下网址找到：https://github。com /sarbian/ModuleManager

 

开发团队：
@暗影法师 - KSPWheels 编码、KF 配置、旧版 KF 和 ALG 零件的模型（重新）装配、PBR 纹理。
@TiktaalikDreaming - 新零件的模型和纹理。

 

致谢：
@lo-fi - 为 KerbalFoundries 模组和品牌的创建和开发，帮助弄清楚 KSPWheel 中使用的一些物理特性，以及他的持续支持。
@Gaalidas - 他对原始 KerbalFoundries 的开发以及 DustFX 代码和灰尘相机设置的改编做出了贡献。
@LitaAlto - 用于漂亮的新高分辨率 KF 徽标
@BahamutoD - 用于可调起落架资产和概念。
@damerell - 用于在 KSPWheels 开发中对物理和数学进行完整性检查。
@blowfish- 帮助找出实现细节并跟踪代码中的错误。
- KSPWheel 线程上的许多其他人帮助找出了车轮功能的一些物理和实现细节。

 

捐款：
我在高度竞争的业余时间从事改装工作。如果您想为我的励志咖啡因基金捐款，请查看下面的按钮。这纯粹是可选的（非常感谢），但可以帮助我保持动力和活力（=完成更多工作！）。

fantastic

I can't wait to download it on ckan

[eberkain]

Is Textures Unlimited absolutely required? 

EDIT: The landing gear will work without it, which is mainly what I was after.  It would be great if the other parts would also have some kind of basic texture without TU. 

Edited February 1, 2022 by eberkain

[TOMMY (JEB 2.0)]

having stability problems on wheels
(youtube for video hosting)

 

[NippyFlippers]

 

Quote

having stability problems on wheels

Is this mod still active?

I have the same problems as him. The Bug seems to be caused by manipulating the wheels in the editor.  Every time a wheel gets reattached or manipulated in the SPH/VAB the attachment node seems to drift/shift further out of whack, until it starts causing severe kraken attacks in flight.

[linuxgurugamer]

On 2/12/2022 at 10:28 AM, TOMMY (JEB 2.0) said:

having stability problems on wheels

 

3 minutes ago, NippyFlippers said:

 

Is this mod still active?

I have the same problems as him. The Bug seems to be caused by manipulating the wheels in the editor.  Every time a wheel gets reattached or manipulated in the SPH/VAB the attachment node seems to drift/shift further out of whack, until it starts causing severe kraken attacks in flight.

That usually means the wheels are overloaded

I don't know if @Shadowmageis active anymore, but I don't have any issues with this mod in 1.12.3

[NippyFlippers]

47 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

 

That usually means the wheels are overloaded

I don't know if @Shadowmageis active anymore, but I don't have any issues with this mod in 1.12.3

No, that is definitely not the case with my vehicles.

Steps to reproduce:

1. Place wheel parts on vehicle

2. Launch vehicle, maybe drive around a bit

3. Revert to hangar

4. Change postion of wheel parts, maybe rotate and scale them once or twice

5. Launch vehicle again, revert to hangar again

6. If you disattach the wheel part now and have them attached to your mouse cursor, you'll notice that they are offset, maybe even clipping far outside the hangar

7. Ctrl-Z and launch that vehicle! You will notice jittering, distortions and phantom forces; a full scale kraken attack right there on the runway.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 10, 2022 by NippyFlippers
Inserted picture

[damerell]

4 hours ago, NippyFlippers said:

No, that is definitely not the case with my vehicles.

Steps to reproduce:

In what version of KSP, with what mods? (And yes, a logfile would be more use, but I'm still at the "can we have any facts at all" stage...)

 

Edited August 10, 2022 by damerell

[linuxgurugamer]

1 hour ago, NippyFlippers said:

No, that is definitely not the case with my vehicles.

 

23 minutes ago, damerell said:

In what version of KSP, with what mods?

Video and log file would be even more helpful

[NippyFlippers]

3 hours ago, linuxgurugamer said:

 

Video and log file would be even more helpful

Here are the log files from the simple demonstration, I took the screen shots from. The kraken inducing offset event happens shortly before I closed the game around 19:17 local time.

Player.log: https://file.io/RTNY6iIafIqp

KSP.log: https://file.io/shUmt45esflK

[linuxgurugamer]

4 hours ago, NippyFlippers said:

Here are the log files from the simple demonstration, I took the screen shots from. The kraken inducing offset event happens shortly before I closed the game around 19:17 local time.

Player.log: https://file.io/RTNY6iIafIqp

KSP.log: https://file.io/shUmt45esflK

Any chance for a video as well?

Also, using file.io to make files available isn't a great idea when there might be multiple people trying to download them to look, it deletes the file after the first download

For anyone else interested, I have these two files here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/70ogbj5ocrhom1z/KSP.log?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wxnpbk5ajpbr9uu/Player.log?dl=0

 

Edit:  You have nearly 100 mods installed, several of which could conceivably be causing some issues.  With just a brief look, I can say that you have a lot of problems with some of the B9_Aerospace parts not compiling.

You seem to have BDArmory installed, there are indications of it causing a memory leak, it's not the only one. EVE, Tweakscale, scatterer, and others also have the same issue.

 

Other than that, I don't see any red flags, a video would be helpful in reproducing it.

Also, try to make a minimal install and reproduce it.  If you can't, then add a few mods at a time until you can.  

Keep in mind that this isn't my mod, and I'm not going to spend unnecessary  time trying to reproduce something.  I have too many other things to be working on.

LGG

 

Edited August 11, 2022 by linuxgurugamer

[NippyFlippers]

8 hours ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Any chance for a video as well?

Also, using file.io to make files available isn't a great idea when there might be multiple people trying to download them to look, it deletes the file after the first download

For anyone else interested, I have these two files here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/70ogbj5ocrhom1z/KSP.log?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wxnpbk5ajpbr9uu/Player.log?dl=0

 

Edit:  You have nearly 100 mods installed, several of which could conceivably be causing some issues.  With just a brief look, I can say that you have a lot of problems with some of the B9_Aerospace parts not compiling.

You seem to have BDArmory installed, there are indications of it causing a memory leak, it's not the only one. EVE, Tweakscale, scatterer, and others also have the same issue.

 

Other than that, I don't see any red flags, a video would be helpful in reproducing it.

Also, try to make a minimal install and reproduce it.  If you can't, then add a few mods at a time until you can.  

Keep in mind that this isn't my mod, and I'm not going to spend unnecessary  time trying to reproduce something.  I have too many other things to be working on.

LGG

 

I will try to do a minimal install as you suggest plus video, but all that might take while, since I have to figure out how to do that without wrecking my current install and how to get the correct Player.log when running multiple installations. Maybe today evening, at the earliest (Europe).

Any suggestion where I can upload log files without having to pay a fee?

I greatly appreciate you taking time out of your day to help us lowly players.

[dok_377]

8 hours ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Also, try to make a minimal install and reproduce it.  If you can't, then add a few mods at a time until you can.  

This bug is definitely in the Kerbal Foundries itself, I can confirm it.

The simplest reproduction steps will be this:

1. Grab a wheel and attach it.
2. Resize it (this bug only shows itself when the wheel is at any size other than 1).
3. Save vehicle and reload it, then save it again. 
4. Repeat the previous step a couple of times, don't even need to launch the vehicle. 

After this, grab the wheel from the vehicle and see where the node is. It will be offset. There's something happening in the mod that makes the node drift to the side each time you resave the vehicle with the rescaled wheel. 

Edited August 11, 2022 by dok_377

[damerell]

53 minutes ago, dok_377 said:

This bug is definitely in the Kerbal Foundries itself, I can confirm it.

The simplest reproduction steps will be this:

1. Grab a wheel and attach it.
2. Resize it (this bug only shows itself when the wheel is at any size other than 1).

There's no way to resize it if the bug can be reproduced with no other mods installed, which would be necessary to confirm it is in KF itself.

1 hour ago, NippyFlippers said:

I will try to do a minimal install as you suggest plus video, but all that might take while, since I have to figure out how to do that without wrecking my current install and how to get the correct Player.log when running multiple installations. Maybe today evening, at the earliest (Europe).

KSP has no DRM. You can just copy installs around. The correct Player.log is the one in the directory where the minimal install is located.

Edited August 11, 2022 by damerell

[NippyFlippers]

58 minutes ago, dok_377 said:

This bug is definitely in the Kerbal Foundries itself, I can confirm it.

The simplest reproduction steps will be this:

1. Grab a wheel and attach it.
2. Resize it (this bug only shows itself when the wheel is at any size other than 1).
3. Save vehicle and reload it, then save it again. 
4. Repeat the previous step a couple of times, don't even need to launch the vehicle. 

After this, grab the wheel from the vehicle and see where the node is. It will be offset. There's something happening in the mod that makes the node drift to the side each time you resave the vehicle with the rescaled wheel. 

Great, to know. That is a whole lot more to go on about.

[linuxgurugamer]

1 hour ago, dok_377 said:

2. Resize it (this bug only shows itself when the wheel is at any size other than 1).

I don't believe KF has code to resize the parts, so if you are resizing it, then you must be using TweakScale.

Once that's there, it's not a bug in KF anymore, but rather a bug  in (or definitely related to) TweakScale.  Assuming this is correct, you might be better served reporting this in the TweakScale thread rather than this, since TS does some interesting and weird things internally

[dok_377]

29 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

I don't believe KF has code to resize the parts, so if you are resizing it, then you must be using TweakScale.

I'm not. Kerbal Foundries has a rescale functionality separate from TweakScale. It might be inside the KSP Wheel, which is a dependency. 

51 minutes ago, damerell said:

There's no way to resize it if the bug can be reproduced with no other mods installed, which would be necessary to confirm it is in KF itself.

There is. It has its own code, where the issue most likely is. 

Edited August 11, 2022 by dok_377

[NippyFlippers]

21 minutes ago, dok_377 said:

I'm not. Kerbal Foundries has a rescale functionality separate from TweakScale. It might be inside the KSP Wheel, which is a dependency. 

There is. It has its own code, where the issue most likely is. 

T think he is right, scaling funcionailty is part of this mod, it is right up there in the OP of this thread: 

Quote

Tweakscale is not needed or supported for the wheel or track parts (though you should be able to have it installed without problem, the wheels will not use TS for scaling).  Scaling of the parts is accomplished through the KSPWheel plugin's native scaling support, and includes configurable scale powers for all scaled variables (rpm, load handling, motor power output) (in the in-game difficulty menu).

 

Quote

Known Issues:
* Balance on parts is a bit arbitrary - can be changed based on feedback (especially the scaled balance)
* Scaling balancing is WIP - scaling powers are not finalized (motor, mass, speed, load, etc), but can be configured in the in-game configuration settings.
* GC-impacting issue when wheels are not grounded - under investigation.
* Any other issues that exist with KSPWheel (see the KSPWheel repository/issues list)

 

[linuxgurugamer]

28 minutes ago, dok_377 said:

There is. It has its own code, where the issue most likely is. 

Been a while since I used that, not really something I take advantage of in my games

Ok.  You still need to make a minimal install to test it.  The fewer mods installed, the less noise to look at in the logs, as well as helping to make sure there aren't any outside influences on it

[dok_377]

1 minute ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Been a while since I used that, not really something I take advantage of in my games

Ok.  You still need to make a minimal install to test it.  The fewer mods installed, the less noise to look at in the logs, as well as helping to make sure there aren't any outside influences on it

It's in my previous comment, just a clean install with the dependencies for the mod. 


Don't know if you will find something, but here's the logs after doing my reproduction steps:
KSP.log: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nGehPwobApIAdRq1naPhY3Cs41NjBqQn
Player.log: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jrKhSm19ayGLCbnF6XqGTbxTVXw3mHJn

And here's the video: https://youtu.be/3TRLXESs6_w