Bought the game - Instant Regret - i hope this is a joke

[JoeSchmuckatelli]

1 hour ago, Moons said:

So after all the negative threads and reviews i still thought - hey maybe its half bad ... - and wow do i regret that

Sorry i have played a lot of EA games in the past years but never in my life have i played a game at such a price that was broken to this extent - i dont understand why people dont complain way more about this - sorry but at 50 USD i would call this a joke ...

Even the most basic functions are buggy - how can anyone with any respect for his fans release a product like this for 50 USD? It would have been even bad for 30 USD since it seems to be so broken ...

 

Lets start my journey:

• wow another awful launcher - hopefully i can just skip that in the future ...
• no UI scaling - nice looks awful at 4k - way too big and i dislike the design in general

But okay thats EA so i continued:

• performance was awful - and i actually have a rather high end PC

So okay thats EA that is to be expected:

• Moving on - lets build a rocket and launch it - okay after huge FPS drops and graphical glitches - to be expeted in a EA - but not in a 50 USD EA i make it to space BUT
• Rocket in space suddenly seems to have lost any means of changing directions and stabilize - for some reason that automatic thing seems to work to some extent and can turn the rocket while i hardly can do anything

Okay - lets just Revert to Launch or Vehicle Assembly - oh wait those Buttons do nothing - great

• Some time later i realize that even staging doesnt seem to work a lot of times so i actually have to do some staging manually with my mouse

So i think - hey maybe after i crash i can revert

• Guess what - no i cant - its still broken both options - and yes i have them enabled in settings etc

 

So i just build another rocket - want to test and change something directly after launch - GUESS WHAT

• now the launch Button stopped working ...

 

Im really sorry but EA is no excuse for such an utterly broken Alpha - especially at 50 USD - i feel like beeing taken advantage of as a fan of the series. Most of those bugs dont seem to be isolated and should have been pretty obvious to the DEVs and Publishers - releasing this game in a state like this at 50 USD is beyond offensive to the fans of this game.

 

 

Im sorry ive seen a lot of awful EA launches and absurd EA prices - but this game beats them all.

Oddly, you have been here long enough and active on the forums enough that you had to know what you were buying. 

I'd say that you don't qualify for a refund.  You were a knowledgeable purchaser. 

 

Enjoy your Bug Hunt - and remember, please keep your posts constructive and professional!

[regex]

27 minutes ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said:

I'd say that you don't qualify for a refund.

They still have time! Probably...

[Snark]

Some content has been redacted and/or removed.

Folks, please try to stick to the discussion at hand. Don't make personal remarks, don't comment on other users' behavior, and don't get into arguments about arguing. Also, please bear in mind that everyone has their own opinion, which they are entitled to just as much as you are entitled to yours. You can address substantive points or provide your own opinion, but other people's opinions are not yours to judge.

Thank you for your understanding.

[Moons]

3 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

Well, as has been mentioned, the Refund button is right there.  Whether or not you think the game should even be available is irrelevant; if it is this bad for you, just get a refund and move on.

You can always just use the game executable.  Or use the available mod.

There's a mod for this.

What settings did you use?

Yeah, this is a bug that has been reported several times over.  It could also be the design of your craft; what worked in KSP1 may not work here.

Also...RCS.  Did you have any on the craft?

Another bug that has been reported several times over.

You do realize that you will get access to all patches and forthcoming features, right?  Every fix, all the stuff on the roadmap, anything else they want to throw in up to 1.0...you get for no additional cost.

Sorry but i think its important that companies also realize that this isnt okay. And yes im thinking about a refund. And i also have an interrest that this game doesnt turn into a disaster and ends a niche game genre i enjoy. The recent cuts when it comes to the publisher and developers also dont seem positive to me - i doubt that this will lead to a bigger budget for the game.

Yeah i know that from the first game - i hope it stays that way.

I know i saw it but im not sure if i want to mod yet since its very likely that there will be lots of smaller updates constantly breaking mods - maybe i will try it after the first patch if i still have the game.

Everything maxed at 4k - Vsync disabled. The only weird thing is that Environment Prop Density and Draw distance always have 2 options marked - medium and high. I can change that but it will be at that double setting afterwards.

RCS - yes i think so the weird thing is using that thing besides the NAVBall the AI was able to normally stabilize and control my rocket. But someting seems to have broken in general in that save - if i load the save i get the flight UI - my vessle is in space but im just hovering with the flight UI somwhere above the launch site seeing nothing. The save-screenshot shows the rocket in space - so i guess im just going to delete that save. (i think it didnt have a reaction wheel but not sure since i cant load the save anymore and have now deleted it since i wasnt able to load)

Yeah but a bug so obvious that this shouldnt exist in the EA version.

Yes i do realize that - i will get access but according to EA all i bought was the game as is - meaning if they decided to stop after Patch 1 and cancel the game i would get nothing and cant even complain about it since all i bought for 50 USD is the version i got when i bought the game. Even for the game with everything 50 USD would be a lot - i doubt they will go higher with the price.

 

3 hours ago, LoSBoL said:

Maybe you should put the game away for a while, many have done so looking at the concurrent players on Steam.

The state KSP2 is in now is no more than a timesample, and it won't stay like it is now forever. There will even be a time coming that 50 dollars for EA access for KSP2 is going to be a steal, where that tipping point will be is personal.

But people and me paid that price now - not in the future.

And with all due respect -there will never be a time when this game will be a steal for 50 USD. 50 USD is the price of a full AAA game if they seriously will charge more at release 60 or 70 USD most people including me would probably completely ignore the game. We all saw what happened to a AAA game that thought it could just raise the price to 70USD - Forspoken - that game flopped so hard that they merged the Developer and it has already dropped below 100 players at times.

3 hours ago, Chilkoot said:

Heh - you think it looks bad at 4k, try it at 1440p.   They used integer scaling for many portions of the interface, which does *not* work with a pixel-art style lol.

The "all in the corner" instruments were a poor decision as well, IMO - takes visual focus away from the ship/environment, and makes the whole game feel like an IFR rather than VFR experience, which really diminishes the wonder at breaking through the clouds on launch, or descending onto a new celestial body for the first time.  Hopefully there are a lot of new options planned for the interface (I know some prefer the IFR experience - need options not forced changes).

OK, it's hard to deny it's in a very rough state - maybe the worst EA I've seen yet on Steam.  There's a significant patch planned for Thursday, so hopefully some of the worst problems you've encountered are addressed in that patch.

So, yeah, certainly not for everyone, but there's still a lot of optimism for the path forward.

Yeha i think so too - i even made a thread about it. I really hope that we will get a legacy UI or a highly moddable UI.

 

3 hours ago, Bej Kerman said:

I'd say that's more a testament to the benefits of this UI than anything else. In KSP 1 your eyes had to glaze over your ship to reach the altimeter from the velocity and navball, and vice versa. Inefficient. Don't have to do that in KSP 2 unless you specifically want to look at your ship, in which case your eyes are only under your own control.

I think this describes one of the issues nice - besides me not liking the interface the old interface actually made you look at your ship more when switching between info screens.

 

2 hours ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said:

Oddly, you have been here long enough and active on the forums enough that you had to know what you were buying. 

I'd say that you don't qualify for a refund.  You were a knowledgeable purchaser. 

 

Enjoy your Bug Hunt - and remember, please keep your posts constructive and professional!

I knew it had issues- but i didnt think the issues were that bad that even basic functionality would fail - and end in me haivng gamebreaking bugs even when i just did my first launch in space.

 

 

 

I know this topic is a bit direct and negative - and some people seem to think it would be better for the future of this game to keep a positive image. But in my opinion i think its more important to actually not pretend things are okay - selling this game in this state - and im really sorry but i m somewhat sure that most of those bugs were known before EA release and at that moment someone should have said "no we cant release it like that" or at least "no we cant release the game in this state at this price". This honestly destroyed all trust i had in the brand as a consmer and as i stated above i think its also a bit offensive to sell a game in a state like this for 50 USD to fans.

I think the publisher and the developers (but probably mostly the publisher) seriously need to do more than they are doing now to get this game back on track - and especially looking at news about cutting costs etc.

Im sorry but 50 USD is beeing paid for the game as is - so the price doesnt reflect the quality and content of the game at all at this point and everything else doesnt matter since its not something the consumers have any guarantee for. And even at a cheaper price i would have expected that at least the most basic things - build rocket -> fly to orbit -> revert flights -> land etc. would function properly in 90% of cases. Everything else beyond that obviously would be different because its EA.

Edited March 12, 2023 by Moons

[Moons]

And there are more obvious big bugs. For example i just built a rocket - with 3 boosters with the mirror tool. I put them on decouplers - 2 for each booster. Everything works fine but 1 booster is moving arround like in a comic even when the rocket isnt even moving - its as if 1 booster isnt really connected to one of the decouplers even tough everything is just mirrored and should be the same.

 

I even tried using a third decoupler but that dint work either - it just showed me what seems to happen - instead of having the physics of a part fixed by 3 points the booster simply moves as if it was fixed in the middle of the booster - it acts like a seesaw.

 

I also had similar issues after getting in the third area of the height - indicator - all of a sudden the rocket started spinning (the center of sinning was the middle of the rocket) even with RCS and SAS. Even if i had forgotten something if something moves upwards with a lot of speed it wouldnt suddenly start to spin? I did everything pretty similar to how i do it in KSP1 and never had issues like this - is this a bug or am i missing some new mechanic?

Edited March 12, 2023 by Moons

[JoeSchmuckatelli]

44 minutes ago, Moons said:

I knew it had issues- but i didnt think the issues were that bad that even basic functionality would fail - and end in me haivng gamebreaking bugs even when i just did my first launch in space.

Sure you did.  I've but to go back through your pre-purchase comment history to see that you were all over threads where people talked about the plethora of bugs.  You couldn't have been on these forums for the last two weeks and been blissfully unaware of the problems with this release.

That said - Thursday is the target for Patch Day.  Should that day keep it's timeline, I suspect a lot of the glaringly obvious bugs will have been addressed.  More will remain.

We are effectively in a Painfully Obvious Paid Open Alpha for the time being.  I'm confident the next two patches will get us into Paid Open Beta territory.  Two more?  EA should begin.

Enjoy the ride!

Edited March 12, 2023 by JoeSchmuckatelli

[Scarecrow71]

22 minutes ago, Moons said:

I did everything pretty similar to how i do it in KSP1 and never had issues like this - is this a bug or am i missing some new mechanic?

This is not a bug.  I did the same thing at first - build how I build in KSP1...and watch the craft spin uncontrollably.  Why?  Center of Mass changes too quickly, causing the ship to lurch forward as a counter-balance.  This generally happens because you are using engines far too big for your craft.  Your TWR sweet spot at launch should be near 1.5-1.7; any higher than this and you get the spinners.

This is as designed.  SAS in KSP1 was far too tight, meaning you could get away with stuff like this.  And MJ really helped control this, which a lot of us relied upon.  Myself included.

So what to do?  Take a step back, deep breath...and remind yourself that this is NOT KSP1.  Think back to your earliest days in KSP1 and remember how you built stuff.  Small, low TWR, really light gravity turns.  I had to do this, and once I stopped treating this like the same game and scaled back builds, I was able to not only get into orbit, but to the surface of Duna.  Oh, and spam RCS; you need it, along with reaction wheels, to keep headings in orbit.

If you need help building something, just ask.  I can give you a few designs I've worked out that work.

[Fluke]

1 hour ago, Scarecrow71 said:

Take a step back, deep breath...and remind yourself that this is NOT KSP1.

I threw up my hands and alt-F4d in my first two hours because I was treating it like KSP1. Now I'm 35hrs in and despite the crazy bugs I'm having fun. There's some good mods too for the less annoying stuff in the meantime that helped me. I've landed on the Mun, Minmus, Duna and Eve. Can't wait for the Thursday patch, crossing my fingers!

[RocketRockington]

18 hours ago, Moons said:

- i dont understand why people dont complain way more about this

Hope and hype are powerful drugs 

18 hours ago, Moons said:

Seriously - what were they thinking when they decided to release the game in this state at this price?

I told my boss it was unshippable. My boss told my boss's boss it was in really bad shape.  My boss's boss told my boss's boss's boss it needs work.  Eventually my boss's^5 boss heard it was awesome, and green lit the ship.

That, or they listened to Nate Simpson...   

Edited March 13, 2023 by RocketRockington

[Fullmetal Analyst]

12 hours ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said:

Oddly, you have been here long enough and active on the forums enough that you had to know what you were buying. 

I'd say that you don't qualify for a refund.  You were a knowledgeable purchaser. 

i think everyone should just get a refund without any questions asked since the game is so bugged

[-dbv-]

16 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

Well, as has been mentioned, the Refund button is right there.  Whether or not you think the game should even be available is irrelevant; if it is this bad for you, just get a refund and move on.

You can always just use the game executable.  Or use the available mod.

There's a mod for this.

What settings did you use?

Yeah, this is a bug that has been reported several times over.  It could also be the design of your craft; what worked in KSP1 may not work here.

Also...RCS.  Did you have any on the craft?

Another bug that has been reported several times over.

You do realize that you will get access to all patches and forthcoming features, right?  Every fix, all the stuff on the roadmap, anything else they want to throw in up to 1.0...you get for no additional cost.

[snip] There isn't even official mod support this game (despite it was promised) - and those existing mods don't solve the problems completly - they ease the pain and their pure existence shows that an official solution via patch is possible within hours .

Why are aksing for graphical settings? The answer has allways to to be MAX. You're on PC,first priority has to be maximum graphical settings.

Also:There is no refund button! Have you ever refunded a game in steam?

So you're telling him that he can be grateful to get all the patches and content for free over the next 4 years? He already paid a steep price for that. He get's nothing for free. 

Edited March 13, 2023 by Starhawk
Redacted by moderator

[Picard2]

40 minutes ago, -dbv- said:

Also:There is no refund button! Have you ever refunded a game in steam?

I have, it's incredibly easy. Steam has a dedicated page explaining their refund policy. To request a refund, select a game in your game library, click support, click 'it's not what I expected', click 'I'd like to request a refund', wait for them to process it. My experience, a day or two processing time. Basically every game now has a 2 hour full game demo. Their policy is not perfect, but it really takes a lot of risk out of buying games on Steam.

[-dbv-]

Pretty the same as a button - just 20 clicks later.

[Picard2]

16 hours ago, Moons said:

Lets start my journey:

• wow another awful launcher - hopefully i can just skip that in the future ...
• no UI scaling - nice looks awful at 4k - way too big and i dislike the design in general

But okay thats EA so i continued:

• performance was awful - and i actually have a rather high end PC

So okay thats EA that is to be expected:

• Moving on - lets build a rocket and launch it - okay after huge FPS drops and graphical glitches - to be expeted in a EA - but not in a 50 USD EA i make it to space BUT
• Rocket in space suddenly seems to have lost any means of changing directions and stabilize - for some reason that automatic thing seems to work to some extent and can turn the rocket while i hardly can do anything

Okay - lets just Revert to Launch or Vehicle Assembly - oh wait those Buttons do nothing - great

• Some time later i realize that even staging doesnt seem to work a lot of times so i actually have to do some staging manually with my mouse

So i think - hey maybe after i crash i can revert

• Guess what - no i cant - its still broken both options - and yes i have them enabled in settings etc

 

So i just build another rocket - want to test and change something directly after launch - GUESS WHAT

• now the launch Button stopped working ...

My impressions:

Launcher - annoying, but seen worse. Not asked me to create an account after the first time I clicked no thanks, loads fairly quickly most times. But agree any launcher just feels pointless.

UI - fine at 4k, bit big but nothing too bad. Though I'm using 'big screen' 4k rather than 'retina-style' 4k, maybe I'd feel differently on a smaller screen with higher pixel density, don't know. There's a mod for UI scaling but I've not felt the need to use it myself.

Performance - fine for me at 4k for first release early access. But I'm used to gaming at 30fps, it's a bit less than that on launches but in space it's OK. Everything maxed, antialiasing 8x, no vsync.

Rockets - generally decent. One did have some weird floaty boosters, but whatever. Not a big deal, just strutted it up. Everything else flew fine. Been exploring the Mun and Minmus. Totally doable without flight aids.

Not had any problems reverting or staging, or with lost inputs, but I've seen others have and it sounds very annoying indeed. Anecdotally, get the impression it may be affected by longer play sessions and repeated launces or something - in general my sessions are only 30 minutes so maybe that's why I've not encountered.

Personal impression: seems fine for first release early access. Not great, but everything I've launched has gone fine and I'm exploring the moons. Price is absolutely ludicrous, no way is it worth $50 for what is there right now, that's such a bizarre price selection. I genuinely don't understand why it's priced at $50 at this stage, but it is what it is and we all make our own choice. The big easy refund button is there for us all.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Picard2

[Superfluous J]

16 hours ago, Moons said:

i dont understand why people dont complain way more about this

I'm not 100% sure it's possible for people to complain more about it than has already been complained.

[LoSBoL]

14 hours ago, Moons said:

But people and me paid that price now - not in the future.

Off course there are 'people' who bought KSP2 with just expectancies due to its price, and I fully agree that what we've got now it isn't worthy of the 50 dollars and many have buyers remorse. I think surely everyone can agree that it needs to get better and the early release of the EA of KSP2 was to early. 

But in all honesty, I really do think that many people that bought it, bought it in mind of the given roadmap, and did buy it for what is prognosed, and not for its current state. Many people have been through this already with KSP1, and are familiar with the update cycle it had, KSP2 does not differ from that. They just have other expectations than you are having. 

I'm also not to happy that it was released to get short term income before T2's fiscal year ends, but T2 isn't crazy, they knew what they were doing and assessed that the short term rouse would not affect its long term income from the IP, they know that when they get it right its early release of KSP2's EA will be forgotten fast. 

When the EA trailer was released 4 months ago I was saddened, I wanted 'the whole shebang', to be enduldged by everything the  the full release had to offer, like KSP did for me. An updated and polished KSP2, not built on top layer after layer. I didn't want KSP's update cycle. But there at that moment, It set the expectation that it would. 

I really do emphasize with everyone that went in head first, missed the video, missed the EA content creator video's, missed the EA trailer and EA gameplay video, missed the roadmap and missed all the warning signs that were even on the page containing the buy button, they engaged to soon, mostly due to expectation only on price.

And therefore my advise to just put the game away for a while, because what you have now, is a timesample, not the end product. Every update will bring something, like it did with KSP, what will tick your box to feel comfortable, is again personal. 

The bad reviews now and the 'non recomendations' it has now on steam reflect KSP2 in its current state, another big 'buyer beware' flag has been rissen since the game's release, which is a good thing, I think in this point in time everybody that's new and investigates what they are buying, know what they are getting in to when they hit the buy button. 

 

14 hours ago, Moons said:

And with all due respect -there will never be a time when this game will be a steal for 50 USD. 50 USD is the price of a full AAA game if they seriously will charge more at release 60 or 70 USD most people including me would probably completely ignore the game.

That's why I said it's up to personal opinion, I would happily pay 50 Euro for an updated KSP1, and the first big update (Science and Progression) would bring it to that point, for me that is. I would be thrilled when colonies hit KSP2, and it would exceed what I expect for 50 Euro. Maybe it's because when I started gaming, I payed 45 to 50 Euro for Nintendo NES games, and thats more then 30 years ago. 60 to 70 dollars for a fully fledged game in 2023 does not sound bad, to me. 

Edited March 13, 2023 by LoSBoL
Typos

[Majorjim!]

16 hours ago, Bej Kerman said:

The refund button is right there.

I’m sure he’ll use it. I know how he feels, as a fan, kicked in the teeth. 

[LoSBoL]

1 hour ago, Majorjim! said:

I’m sure he’ll use it. I know how he feels, as a fan, kicked in the teeth. 

Everybody handles disappointment or dissatisfaction differently, even more so when being a fan. It's dealing with feelings and emotions. Everyone wanted, and wants the game they are attached to to flourish. 

[Snark]

Some content has been removed.  Please stay on topic and don't make things personal, folks.  The topic here is the game itself, not how you feel about other people's posting habits.

[K^2]

20 hours ago, Moons said:

Some time later i realize that even staging doesnt seem to work a lot of times so i actually have to do some staging manually with my mouse

I don't recall if this is one of the docking mode bugs - if so, hitting del should fix it. Otherwise, restarting the client does.

21 hours ago, Moons said:

now the launch Button stopped working ...

There's a bug with revert to VAB that puts the game into a broken state and will prevent launch and can stop you from saving. Avoid it. Use the fact that the game allows you to quick-save anywhere and keeps previous quick saves and use save/load instead of reverting. It's a bit of a drag, but not that significant of a time lost compared to reverting to VAB.

 

All of the problems you've encountered are well known in the community, and if you actually have been keeping up with early access games recently, you should know that checking fixes for common problems is a sort of thing that always makes your experience with these better.

There are a lot of reasonable complaints about how this game launched, but this thread is mostly full of complaints that shouldn't exist to an earlly-access title. It's rough and requires workarounds. That's what early access should be. If it needs just minor buffing out, release the game and patch it up to a full quality. Early access only makes sense if the game's being made by a team of five people or is a bigger game being released very early. You're looking at the latter case.

[Moons]

1 hour ago, K^2 said:

I don't recall if this is one of the docking mode bugs - if so, hitting del should fix it. Otherwise, restarting the client does.

There's a bug with revert to VAB that puts the game into a broken state and will prevent launch and can stop you from saving. Avoid it. Use the fact that the game allows you to quick-save anywhere and keeps previous quick saves and use save/load instead of reverting. It's a bit of a drag, but not that significant of a time lost compared to reverting to VAB.

 

All of the problems you've encountered are well known in the community, and if you actually have been keeping up with early access games recently, you should know that checking fixes for common problems is a sort of thing that always makes your experience with these better.

There are a lot of reasonable complaints about how this game launched, but this thread is mostly full of complaints that shouldn't exist to an earlly-access title. It's rough and requires workarounds. That's what early access should be. If it needs just minor buffing out, release the game and patch it up to a full quality. Early access only makes sense if the game's being made by a team of five people or is a bigger game being released very early. You're looking at the latter case.

Yes and i doubt they needed the communmity to find those bugs. I have lots of EA games but never got a game for th is price with so many obvious bugs in basic mechanics - especially not at that price.

The complaints in my thread are perfectly reasonable - EA means you purchase the product in the state it is when you do you purchase - they could simply stop development and i wouldnt be able to refund since the only thing i actually paid for was the game as is at the time of purchase. Therefore the price has to reflect the state of the product bought - i have lots of EA games and most for that reason sell their product at a price that somewhat reflects the state of the game at the moment. Since this game costs 50 USD i obviously expect way more than from a game that costs 30 USD.

And yes even if it was 30 USD i think the bugs would be too much - i would understand if those bugs would rarely occur etc. but some of th ose bugs are gamebreaking and so obvious that if someon would have playtested the game once or twice would have noticed them - and at that point it would have been the only right decision to lower the price a lot or delay the release.

To me its not even worth it reporting a bug since chances are all of those bugs are already known.

 

I dont even know how many EA games i own - just looked it up - almost 80 - this EA is by far the worst ive ever seen - and the only EAs i can compare this too were all way cheaper.

EA doesnt mean you can simply do whatever you want and people shouldnt complain especially when selling long term fans a game in a state like this at that price. Most of the games features arent even in the game - not even re-entry heat etc. - yet even the small parts that are in the game have gamebreaking and obvious bugs that dont seem to be limited to special cases.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Moons

[Moons]

6 hours ago, LoSBoL said:

Off course there are 'people' who bought KSP2 with just expectancies due to its price, and I fully agree that what we've got now it isn't worthy of the 50 dollars and many have buyers remorse. I think surely everyone can agree that it needs to get better and the early release of the EA of KSP2 was to early. 

But in all honesty, I really do think that many people that bought it, bought it in mind of the given roadmap, and did buy it for what is prognosed, and not for its current state. Many people have been through this already with KSP1, and are familiar with the update cycle it had, KSP2 does not differ from that. They just have other expectations than you are having. 

I'm also not to happy that it was released to get short term income before T2's fiscal year ends, but T2 isn't crazy, they knew what they were doing and assessed that the short term rouse would not affect its long term income from the IP, they know that when they get it right its early release of KSP2's EA will be forgotten fast. 

When the EA trailer was released 4 months ago I was saddened, I wanted 'the whole shebang', to be enduldged by everything the  the full release had to offer, like KSP did for me. An updated and polished KSP2, not built on top layer after layer. I didn't want KSP's update cycle. But there at that moment, It set the expectation that it would. 

I really do emphasize with everyone that went in head first, missed the video, missed the EA content creator video's, missed the EA trailer and EA gameplay video, missed the roadmap and missed all the warning signs that were even on the page containing the buy button, they engaged to soon, mostly due to expectation only on price.

And therefore my advise to just put the game away for a while, because what you have now, is a timesample, not the end product. Every update will bring something, like it did with KSP, what will tick your box to feel comfortable, is again personal. 

The bad reviews now and the 'non recomendations' it has now on steam reflect KSP2 in its current state, another big 'buyer beware' flag has been rissen since the game's release, which is a good thing, I think in this point in time everybody that's new and investigates what they are buying, know what they are getting in to when they hit the buy button. 

 

That's why I said it's up to personal opinion, I would happily pay 50 Euro for an updated KSP1, and the first big update (Science and Progression) would bring it to that point, for me that is. I would be thrilled when colonies hit KSP2, and it would exceed what I expect for 50 Euro. Maybe it's because when I started gaming, I payed 45 to 50 Euro for Nintendo NES games, and thats more then 30 years ago. 60 to 70 dollars for a fully fledged game in 2023 does not sound bad, to me. 

The probem is - if they did that they were wrong. EA actually means you buy the beta the the time of purchase nothing more. Everything else is pretty much just a gamble - if this was a pre-purchase on the other hand this would be a different story.

Im not sure if they knew what they were doing - this has the potential to do long term damage to the brand. In the worst case it was a test if the game is even profitable because of the long development and switch of developers.

Well Nintendo was always overwpriced - it is beyond me how they still get away with it especially since their main consumers are kids ... (dont even get me started on their handling of virtual console titles) - or their anti-consumer and anti-fan practices in general - some of the things they do are real life comedy:

Twitter Post

They asked fans what their favourite Zelda Songs are - people posted youtube links and all of them were copyright striked ...

Anyways - to justify  a pricetag of 50 USD for the final version i expect the game to be free of bugs, full of content and a great base for modding. I think its a huge mistake to sell it at such a high price - this will just turn away many casual gamers - especially combined with the hardware requirements and this will also turn away modders in the long run. But obviously thats just my personal opinion.

 

 

And tosum up what i think could help the game - i think one of the most reasonable things to save the game to some extent now would be to:

- reduce the scope of the base game - and reduce the price

- put things in DLC and give it to EA-Buyers for free since they had the roadmap

 

That way they could concentrate on having a base KSP2 out sooner than later and concentrate on making that part of the game good and concentrate on all the other things later on - that way they could also sell the base game at a way more reasonable price that wont scare away new customers and people would also be way more tolerant when it comes to bugs if the price was lower - but i dont know if you can sell multiple EA versions at different prices? I also think you cant change the price of an EA game for some weeks according to steam.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Moons

[Scarecrow71]

4 hours ago, Moons said:

Yes and i doubt they needed the communmity to find those bugs. I have lots of EA games but never got a game for th is price with so many obvious bugs in basic mechanics - especially not at that price.

The complaints in my thread are perfectly reasonable - EA means you purchase the product in the state it is when you do you purchase - they could simply stop development and i wouldnt be able to refund since the only thing i actually paid for was the game as is at the time of purchase. Therefore the price has to reflect the state of the product bought - i have lots of EA games and most for that reason sell their product at a price that somewhat reflects the state of the game at the moment. Since this game costs 50 USD i obviously expect way more than from a game that costs 30 USD.

And yes even if it was 30 USD i think the bugs would be too much - i would understand if those bugs would rarely occur etc. but some of th ose bugs are gamebreaking and so obvious that if someon would have playtested the game once or twice would have noticed them - and at that point it would have been the only right decision to lower the price a lot or delay the release.

To me its not even worth it reporting a bug since chances are all of those bugs are already known.

 

I dont even know how many EA games i own - just looked it up - almost 80 - this EA is by far the worst ive ever seen - and the only EAs i can compare this too were all way cheaper.

EA doesnt mean you can simply do whatever you want and people shouldnt complain especially when selling long term fans a game in a state like this at that price. Most of the games features arent even in the game - not even re-entry heat etc. - yet even the small parts that are in the game have gamebreaking and obvious bugs that dont seem to be limited to special cases.

You realize that a patch is coming this Thursday, right?

You realize that you get all patches, fixes, and roadmap features until the game hits 1.0 (and potentially beyond that, considering how KSP1 has been handled), right?

That $50 you paid right now isn't just for the game right now.  It's also for the patches, fixes, features, and other things that have been promised to us in the future.  Yes, I know your counter-argument:  They don't have to live up to those promises, and they could stop development, and you and the rest of the community would be out $50 each, and blah blah blah.  Do you honestly think that the developers would simply do that to this community?  Think long and hard about that.  Do you really think they would abandon this project, leaving us with this EA release and nothing more?

You've been on the forums [snip] PRIOR to your purchasing it.  So you knew what you were getting simply from reading the reviews people have left.  You also know what the developers and community managers have said.  You also know what the other side of the coin is saying (those people who are ok with the game that was released).  And at least one of us - me, to put too fine a point on it - has offered in this thread to help you through whatever it is you are going through with this game so that you can enjoy it now instead of having to wait until at least the first patch.  And I'll put the offer out there again:  If you want help, I (and many others) are here to help.

With all of that said, I will reiterate what's already been said:  Nothing is keeping you playing the game.  If it frustrates you that much, put it away until the first patch is released and then come back to see what changed.  Rinse and repeat until the game is in a state that you think it's playable.  Alternatively, you have time to get a refund.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Vanamonde

[Scarecrow71]

4 hours ago, Moons said:

Anyways - to justify  a pricetag of 50 USD for the final version i expect the game to be free of bugs, full of content and a great base for modding.

But this ISN'T the final version of the game.  Far from it.  That's what [snip] the people complaining about the game don't seem to understand just yet.  The game isn't finished.  Spending the $50 means that, provided development continues and patches are released, you will get the final game version 1.0 at some point.  You can't keep [snip] on "I paid $50 for a final version of the game that they didn't deliver" simply because this isn't the final version of the game.  If it were, we wouldn't be getting a patch on Thursday, and we wouldn't be getting the roadmap features at any point.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Vanamonde

[Wheehaw Kerman]

10 hours ago, -dbv- said:

[snip] There isn't even official mod support this game (despite it was promised) - and those existing mods don't solve the problems completly - they ease the pain and their pure existence shows that an official solution via patch is possible within hours .

Why are aksing for graphical settings? The answer has allways to to be MAX. You're on PC,first priority has to be maximum graphical settings.

Also:There is no refund button! Have you ever refunded a game in steam?

So you're telling him that he can be grateful to get all the patches and content for free over the next 4 years? He already paid a steep price for that. He get's nothing for free. 

Just to be clear, you’re saying that $50 is a steep price?