Windows 10?

[GoldForest]

12 hours ago, siklidkid said:

That's good to know. I mean, Windows 10 is the most used OS, so i don't see why it wouldn't.

Windows 10 is not the most used OS. You'd be surprised how many people are still on 7 or even 8. And then you have linux and iOS. 

 

Moderator Note:  Not the Original OP from the original thread this was split from.

Edited October 13, 2019 by Gargamel
Moderator Note

[linuxgurugamer]

46 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

Windows 10 is not the most used OS. You'd be surprised how many people are still on 7 or even 8. And then you have linux and iOS. 

Actually, 

• Windows 10 is the most popular operating system for desktop and laptop computers.
• Android is the most popular smartphone operating system.
• iOS is the most popular tablet operating system.
• Variants of Linux are most widely used in the Internet of things and smart devices.
• Other variants of Linux are the most popular operating system on other web servers and supercomputers.

Read about it here:

https://www.computerhope.com/issues/ch001777.htm

[GoldForest]

Just now, linuxgurugamer said:

Actually, 

• Windows 10 is the most popular operating system for desktop and laptop computers.
• Android is the most popular smartphone operating system.
• iOS is the most popular tablet operating system.
• Variants of Linux are most widely used in the Internet of things and smart devices.
• Other variants of Linux are the most popular operating system on other web servers and supercomputers.

Read about it here:

https://www.computerhope.com/issues/ch001777.htm

Huh, I thought Windows 7 was still the most popular. And actually, I think they're taking how many people use windows 10 as how popular it is. 

I mean, they do that all the time for something. You look around the internet you'll see a lot of people don't like Windows 10, and yet websites will have you believing otherwise just because more people use Windows 10.

Most used =/= most popular.

If you ask me, Windows XP and 7 are tied for the most popular Windows. Can't speak for Linux OS's or IOS OS's because I don't use either.

[linuxgurugamer]

18 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

Huh, I thought Windows 7 was still the most popular. And actually, I think they're taking how many people use windows 10 as how popular it is. 

I mean, they do that all the time for something. You look around the internet you'll see a lot of people don't like Windows 10, and yet websites will have you believing otherwise just because more people use Windows 10.

Most used =/= most popular.

If you ask me, Windows XP and 7 are tied for the most popular Windows. Can't speak for Linux OS's or IOS OS's because I don't use either.

For this case, Most used == Most Popular.  It doesn't matter to the developers what OS people like, what matters is what they are using

[GoldForest]

2 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

For this case, Most used == Most Popular.  It doesn't matter to the developers what OS people like, what matters is what they are using

Eh, Most popular is always subjective in my opinion. You can't take most used to mean most popular, because you have things like Microsoft forcing people to switch because they don't want to support 7 or 8 anymore. And even then, they force upgraded a lot of people. 

Anyway, We're getting off topic. 

@siklidkid KSP 2 is confirmed to work on Windows. 

[Rejected Spawn]

Now that the OP has been cleared up maybe we can make some use of this thread for OS related things not debated elsewhere? The title kind of forces it towards W10 though, an operating system I despise to a degree that can't be accurately described in a family friendly forum. Still running W7 on all of my active computers because the forced rebooting is unacceptable, I have things running 24/7 on some of my rigs and a single sudden reboot can ruin several ongoing projects - even a planned reboot usually requires a procedure that takes several hours to get back to full capacity. Does anyone know of any W10 version that doesn't force reboots? (I know there are some "hacks" that can stop it but just NO, that's not what I want!) Would appreciate it immensely if I could get a hold of a no-scummy-reboots version somehow. Since W7 doesn't even work on new hardware I can only hold out as long as nothing breaks, the next time a PC gives up for good here I'll have to use either W10 or convert to Linux which is an entirely different world of hurt for someone who uses a lot of software that lacks counterparts outside Windows...

If anyone wants to know why I can't allow rebooting:

Spoiler

I'm slowly churning away at a number of projects that can't be casually saved as regular old files because of the abysmal risk of anyone possibly getting their hands on the information. Some of the projects involve inventions that become impossible to file patents for if the information gets out, other projects involve design work that I'm preparing as part of an attempt at landing a very hard to get job I won't discuss here. Given that I sit on mountains of information that needs to be worked on but can't be saved to disk other than when I reach a good stopping point and can store the relevant data as raw numbers that nobody else can interpret, there is no choice but to leave the programs open and have the stuff exist only in RAM most of the time. I know it's possible to get to stuff in RAM too but it's at least significantly harder than grabbing a file from a disk. The PCs involved in these projects are not possible to airgap but they don't connect to anything even remotely risky, they mostly just work together with my own server and it's easy to send safe enough data to them from less important PCs on my network. But what if someone who visits my home steals the data, you wonder? Fear not, I'm a lone warrior of science! (Read: Pretty much nobody ever comes here, those who do know I'm a crazy scientist and they don't dare touch anything in case one of my experiments or prototypes gets ruined. This reminds me, I should really get a move on and build that Helium chamber I wanted quite a while ago, would keep the fire hazard to a minimum when dealing with reagents... feels silly to have 400L of Helium and not use it for anything.)

 

[paul23]

Also remember that windows 10 *will* be the last os microsoft creates. After windows 10 it's all just patches and no new main version you can buy.

[GoldForest]

1 minute ago, paul23 said:

Also remember that windows 10 *will* be the last os microsoft creates. After windows 10 it's all just patches and no new main version you can buy.

I feel they will give that up after sometime. 

[pandaman]

1 hour ago, GoldForest said:

I feel they will give that up after sometime. 

Windows 10K,  optimized for KSP.  With it's own unique kraken built in.

[DoctorDavinci]

17 minutes ago, pandaman said:

Windows 10K,  optimized for KSP.  With it's own unique kraken built in.

Windoh's 10 Kraken ... It's not a bug, it's a feature 

[Incarnation of Chaos]

5 hours ago, Rejected Spawn said:

Now that the OP has been cleared up maybe we can make some use of this thread for OS related things not debated elsewhere? The title kind of forces it towards W10 though, an operating system I despise to a degree that can't be accurately described in a family friendly forum. Still running W7 on all of my active computers because the forced rebooting is unacceptable, I have things running 24/7 on some of my rigs and a single sudden reboot can ruin several ongoing projects - even a planned reboot usually requires a procedure that takes several hours to get back to full capacity. Does anyone know of any W10 version that doesn't force reboots? (I know there are some "hacks" that can stop it but just NO, that's not what I want!) Would appreciate it immensely if I could get a hold of a no-scummy-reboots version somehow. Since W7 doesn't even work on new hardware I can only hold out as long as nothing breaks, the next time a PC gives up for good here I'll have to use either W10 or convert to Linux which is an entirely different world of hurt for someone who uses a lot of software that lacks counterparts outside Windows...

If anyone wants to know why I can't allow rebooting:

  Reveal hidden contents

I'm slowly churning away at a number of projects that can't be casually saved as regular old files because of the abysmal risk of anyone possibly getting their hands on the information. Some of the projects involve inventions that become impossible to file patents for if the information gets out, other projects involve design work that I'm preparing as part of an attempt at landing a very hard to get job I won't discuss here. Given that I sit on mountains of information that needs to be worked on but can't be saved to disk other than when I reach a good stopping point and can store the relevant data as raw numbers that nobody else can interpret, there is no choice but to leave the programs open and have the stuff exist only in RAM most of the time. I know it's possible to get to stuff in RAM too but it's at least significantly harder than grabbing a file from a disk. The PCs involved in these projects are not possible to airgap but they don't connect to anything even remotely risky, they mostly just work together with my own server and it's easy to send safe enough data to them from less important PCs on my network. But what if someone who visits my home steals the data, you wonder? Fear not, I'm a lone warrior of science! (Read: Pretty much nobody ever comes here, those who do know I'm a crazy scientist and they don't dare touch anything in case one of my experiments or prototypes gets ruined. This reminds me, I should really get a move on and build that Helium chamber I wanted quite a while ago, would keep the fire hazard to a minimum when dealing with reagents... feels silly to have 400L of Helium and not use it for anything.)

 

I would look into Windows LTSB 

https://www.howtogeek.com/273824/windows-10-without-the-cruft-windows-10-ltsb-explained/

Technically it's not possible to buy it off the shelf, however given how experienced you are with tech i feel like you know what channels to search.

You could also try to obtain Windows Server 2016; this is available at retail at a fairly large expense. My school gave it out for free so if you're doing scientific work your tech department may be able to hook you up; from your description however it seems LTSB would be the ideal fit for your use case. As Windows Server still gets updates; even though you have way more control over them. 

[Gargamel]

Discussion split off from:

Hence the weird OP by @GoldForest. 

[pmborg]

Yes true, what linuxgurugamer said reflect the big overview of current situation, just adding more detail in Windows versions, WIN10 still have a stronger resistance in 2 groups:

• For old computers that can not be upgraded due obsolete HW specifications, specially computers with only 2GB of RAM.
• For computers used by small and very small companies that don't invest much in IT.

[Gargamel]

Notice in that graph how XP and 7 are above their successor, yet 10 is on the top of the chart?   Not only does that speak to the fact that Vista and 8 were total crap, but it also reflects how M$ forced win 10 on it's users if they wanted it or not. 

I wondered how that graph would be skewed if Vista and 8 were forced upon people. 

Now, don't get me wrong, I love 10.  Best OS I've had.  This was originally a 7 machine, and I'm happy with the upgrade. 

[linuxgurugamer]

11 hours ago, Rejected Spawn said:

Does anyone know of any W10 version that doesn't force reboots? (I know there are some "hacks" that can stop it but just NO, that's not what I want!)

Windows 10 Pro doesn't force rebooting if you set it right.  My main system at home is W10, I leave it on all the time, and have gone months without a reboot

[mcwaffles2003]

12 hours ago, Rejected Spawn said:

Now that the OP has been cleared up maybe we can make some use of this thread for OS related things not debated elsewhere? The title kind of forces it towards W10 though, an operating system I despise to a degree that can't be accurately described in a family friendly forum. Still running W7 on all of my active computers because the forced rebooting is unacceptable, I have things running 24/7 on some of my rigs and a single sudden reboot can ruin several ongoing projects - even a planned reboot usually requires a procedure that takes several hours to get back to full capacity. Does anyone know of any W10 version that doesn't force reboots? (I know there are some "hacks" that can stop it but just NO, that's not what I want!) Would appreciate it immensely if I could get a hold of a no-scummy-reboots version somehow. Since W7 doesn't even work on new hardware I can only hold out as long as nothing breaks, the next time a PC gives up for good here I'll have to use either W10 or convert to Linux which is an entirely different world of hurt for someone who uses a lot of software that lacks counterparts outside Windows...

If anyone wants to know why I can't allow rebooting:

  Hide contents

I'm slowly churning away at a number of projects that can't be casually saved as regular old files because of the abysmal risk of anyone possibly getting their hands on the information. Some of the projects involve inventions that become impossible to file patents for if the information gets out, other projects involve design work that I'm preparing as part of an attempt at landing a very hard to get job I won't discuss here. Given that I sit on mountains of information that needs to be worked on but can't be saved to disk other than when I reach a good stopping point and can store the relevant data as raw numbers that nobody else can interpret, there is no choice but to leave the programs open and have the stuff exist only in RAM most of the time. I know it's possible to get to stuff in RAM too but it's at least significantly harder than grabbing a file from a disk. The PCs involved in these projects are not possible to airgap but they don't connect to anything even remotely risky, they mostly just work together with my own server and it's easy to send safe enough data to them from less important PCs on my network. But what if someone who visits my home steals the data, you wonder? Fear not, I'm a lone warrior of science! (Read: Pretty much nobody ever comes here, those who do know I'm a crazy scientist and they don't dare touch anything in case one of my experiments or prototypes gets ruined. This reminds me, I should really get a move on and build that Helium chamber I wanted quite a while ago, would keep the fire hazard to a minimum when dealing with reagents... feels silly to have 400L of Helium and not use it for anything.)

 

why not save files to a flash drive and keep that in a safe?

[RocketSimplicity]

Another source of Windows Market Share:

[Rejected Spawn]

Thanks so much for the replies, sometimes this forum is just the best.

@Incarnation of Chaos That version was certainly well hidden, I caught wind of something like it existing quite some time ago but the way M$ has since redirected me at every turn when I went on a hunt for it I started wondering if I'd gone crazy and just imagined the whole thing... or if I'd fallen for an urban legend or something. Been churning through this mess in my head for a few hours after a refreshing nap, I'm unaffiliated with any corporation so getting to stuff they don't want to sell to us mad scientists in early retirement might be tricky. There is actually a way around it by starting my own business, in Sweden it's possible to have a personal business that doesn't actually *do* anything, however it would require a deterring amount of paperwork to be handled yearly to keep it going without running afoul of any laws or regulations. Gonna keep thinking about this for some time, with all the food for thought you served me I must say thanks for the meal!  

@linuxgurugamer Are you absolutely certain that it doesn't force a reboot if you leave it running for a year though? According to specs and user experiences it doesn't force reboots on users other than for specific updates that are typically far between (if I understood things correctly) so it can easily behave for a long time but then suddenly throw a fit. All the work I do is so far unpaid (and even worse: much of it costs me a lot of time and money) and sometimes I just can't muster the motivation to keep at it for a while so at any given point in time I might just not touch the relevant PC for a week or month, during that time it might receive one of those priority updates and think it's being a good little OS giving me several days of warning to save the data... Typically my critical PCs are left running until they either start acting funny or the power goes out in my part of town, had one purring like a kitten for 500 days recently but then a power outage hit me...

@mcwaffles2003 This idea did cross my mind long ago but I shelved it due to knowing my own unreliability; I'll totally end up not disconnecting the storage because I either forget or think I need to save another file in a couple of minutes but then get distracted and forget, or because I get tired of having to juggle it all the time and leave it connected for days on end. Though given that some of the stuff I'm gunning for patents on is of a much more dangerous nature than design work I might end up going with a removable storage for those things at some point, or attempt to airgap... One of the more complicated projects is a propulsion system that should work with astonishing fuel efficiency and generate abysmal waste heat, while the TWR is terrible the top speed should be remarkable and it would be super well suited for extremely high altitudes. Why is such a thing dangerous? Put it on a rather simple drone and you can sneak a payload across a border without giving most radars the slightest chance of picking up on it, the drone can then drop that payload straight down anywhere you want and still manage to get out of the territory undetected which makes the culprit nearly impossible to identify. Has military, terror and smuggling applications, I shudder to think what some people would use it for. This is only one of several projects, some of which are way more dangerous if misused, that make me prefer being a paranoid lunatic jumping at shadows over taking any minor data security risks. Exciting life though I suppose, also at some point someone will try the same stuff I do and they may have a far less accurate moral compass so it would be better if someone like me manages to restrict usage of certain stuff by slamming a patent on things that should only be used for humanity as a whole - that way only the good guys like Elon Musk get to use it and anyone else caught messing with it can be shut down before they sell DIY kits on ebay.

[Incarnation of Chaos]

46 minutes ago, Rejected Spawn said:

Thanks so much for the replies, sometimes this forum is just the best.

@Incarnation of Chaos That version was certainly well hidden, I caught wind of something like it existing quite some time ago but the way M$ has since redirected me at every turn when I went on a hunt for it I started wondering if I'd gone crazy and just imagined the whole thing... or if I'd fallen for an urban legend or something. Been churning through this mess in my head for a few hours after a refreshing nap, I'm unaffiliated with any corporation so getting to stuff they don't want to sell to us mad scientists in early retirement might be tricky. There is actually a way around it by starting my own business, in Sweden it's possible to have a personal business that doesn't actually *do* anything, however it would require a deterring amount of paperwork to be handled yearly to keep it going without running afoul of any laws or regulations. Gonna keep thinking about this for some time, with all the food for thought you served me I must say thanks for the meal!  

 

Well if you need some assistance sailing the digital ocean to grab it; hit me up in PM's and i can point you in the right directions. *Wink*

[Daniel Prates]

On 10/13/2019 at 1:39 AM, GoldForest said:

Anyway, We're getting off topic. 

Conversation went off-topic because you passed on a mere guess of yours as a hard fact and @linuxgurugamer corrected you, prompting you to try to insist you were right, this time using semantics (which were, again, wrong). A mere "oh, I didn't know that, I stand corrected" would have been gentlemanlier!

Cheers!

PS: how can it be off-topic, if the merit of the discussion, which you yourself proposed, was to assertain wether w10 would be supported on the grounds of it being popular or not?

Edited October 14, 2019 by Daniel Prates

[GoldForest]

18 minutes ago, Daniel Prates said:

Conversation went off-topic because you passed on a mere guess of yours as a hard fact and @linuxgurugamer corrected you, prompting you to try to insist you were right, this time using semantics (which were, again, wrong). A mere "oh, I didn't know that, I stand corrected" would have been gentlemanlier!

Cheers!

PS: how can it be off-topic, if the merit of the discussion, which you yourself proposed, was to assertain wether w10 would be supported on the grounds of it being popular or not?

I did not create this thread.  This thread was created by @Gargamel by splitting another thread about Windows 10 regrading KSP 2. 

If you read my second response, I do kind of take the stand corrected approach, but then go on to state my opinion about popularity. I accidently changed the subject from most used to most popular. In fact, I made the first response on the basis of most popular and not most used. I don't know what I was thinking at the time. 

But I go on to state my opinion that I think popularity should be measured in subjective views, not download numbers.

I never insisted my opinion was right, I merely stated it was what I felt. 

Please don't confuse opinions with me trying to be all high and mighty, I'm not. 

[linuxgurugamer]

8 hours ago, Rejected Spawn said:

@linuxgurugamer Are you absolutely certain that it doesn't force a reboot if you leave it running for a year though? According to specs and user experiences it doesn't force reboots on users other than for specific updates that are typically far between (if I understood things correctly) so it can easily behave for a long time but then suddenly throw a fit. All the work I do is so far unpaid (and even worse: much of it costs me a lot of time and money) and sometimes I just can't muster the motivation to keep at it for a while so at any given point in time I might just not touch the relevant PC for a week or month, during that time it might receive one of those priority updates and think it's being a good little OS giving me several days of warning to save the data... Typically my critical PCs are left running until they either start acting funny or the power goes out in my part of town, had one purring like a kitten for 500 days recently but then a power outage hit me...

No, I can't say that.  

[TheSaint]

On 10/13/2019 at 8:08 AM, Gargamel said:

Notice in that graph how XP and 7 are above their successor, yet 10 is on the top of the chart?   Not only does that speak to the fact that Vista and 8 were total crap, but it also reflects how M$ forced win 10 on it's users if they wanted it or not. 

I wondered how that graph would be skewed if Vista and 8 were forced upon people. 

Now, don't get me wrong, I love 10.  Best OS I've had.  This was originally a 7 machine, and I'm happy with the upgrade. 

To be fair, I don't think that the dominance of Win10 in the marketplace is due to MS "forcing it on users". I think it is mainly due to MS giving it away for free. I think if MS had used all the same upgrade tactics and still insisted on $50 a seat to upgrade those graphs would all look very different.