[1.3.0] Kerbalism v1.2.9

[theonegalen]

Hey @ShotgunNinja, is it possible to set up certain cockpits in such a way that they couldn't be used in space? That is, some way of simulating pressurized vs non-pressurized cockpits? Would it be a good idea to mess with the climate control settings of certain cockpits? I'm mostly thinking a change to mod cockpits like the Firespitter ones.

Edited August 4, 2016 by theonegalen

[ShotgunNinja]

@theonegalen Well maybe it is possible to hack something (that is not pressurization at all) that allow a pod to not be usable above the 25kPA altitude: you explicitly set the pod to have 'zero' oxygen capacity. At that point, as soon as the vessel cross the 25kPA altitude, suffocation will start. This can made that particular pod incapable of going above that altitude, effectively. But only before the player is able to unlock the radial oxygen tank.

12 hours ago, theonegalen said:

Would it be a good idea to mess with the climate control settings of certain cockpits

Right now there is no kind of control on climatization. But the EC cost is proportional to difference between external and survival temperature, and it is zero inside the 'survival range'. You can tweak both these values in Settings.cfg.

[raxo2222]

Probes requires antennas to function with this mod installed. I found it in hard way.

Kerbalism control panel is obstructed by resource list on flight mode. It would be nice if it appeared somewhere else.

Edited August 4, 2016 by raxo2222

[ShotgunNinja]

@raxo2222 Is not obstructed, they are mutually exclusive like the stock panels.

 

Good news: I managed to optimize the rendering to the point that it make no differences in framerate, and at the same time upped the particle count to 200k.

 

Edited August 4, 2016 by ShotgunNinja

[Kerbos]

That's really awesome but also begs the question on how you did it, I've found KSP rendering very limited, specially with particles, but again I have no idea on coding.

1 hour ago, ShotgunNinja said:

ancient GPUs

2016 - Using a Gforce GT 240

[ShotgunNinja]

@Kerbos I'm not using Unity particle system, because like most Unity things it is a joke, not built for performance at all. Essentially I'm precomputing and compiling meshes of points only once, independent of view, body position or sun position. Then in a custom shader I draw 'point sprites' that have the smaller bandwidth requirement (each primitive only take 1 position in 3d space). Then, instead of sampling a 'particle texture', I'm generating one on the fly based on distance from the 'center pixel' of the point sprite, in the fragment shader. This reduce texture bandwidth to zero (is faster than using a texture because KSP rendering must be doing more texture lookups that math in its own shaders). This whole shebang result in 7 hardware instructions in the vertex shader (thus per-particle) and 5 in the fragment shader (thus per-pixel). This is not much, any GPU from this decade can digest it. In fact, the 200k particles limit is just because Unity has a limit on the number of elements in a mesh. BTW I'm running it on a Radeon HD5670: not exactly top of the line, comparable to yours I believe.

[DarkonZ]

22 hours ago, Kerbos said:

Finally manage to properly export a model, had to use your large food container to take measures for da model (100% totally not because I was completely lost on how to create a config file for it and just changing the name of the model was easier)
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Still gotta figure out the correct values for the bumpmap plus I was lazy and just stacked top and bottom at random on the UV map

Well, if you can perfect your modeling skills and get that wrapped up, I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to convince SN to include some of your models for the realism profile. Now that SN has taken my advice to identify the profiles for MM, you could create a model that serves both the default AND realism profiles within a single config file.

@crapstar Good to know. Too bad PR now mucks with mechjeb.

--

@ShotgunNinja I noticed you use ':NEEDS[EnableScrubber]' in the profiles. Just how important is that?. I'm wondering cuz in my KPBS realism config, I'd think that pesky air-filter shouldn't even show up if the user disables the scrubber(Don't know why anyone would). Would this do the trick?

:NEEDS[RealismProfile&PlanetarySurfaceStructures&EnableScrubber]

While I'm it, how come the Kerbalism GUI, (esp. in the VAB) doesn't provide a readout for LS resources for the "maximum" crew a vessel can have on it? Both TACLS and USILS have that luxury. Just before writing this post I built a giant 12 kerbal station to hyperedit to the mun. But I didn't have 12 kerbals to stick on board to figure how much LS I'd need for 6 kerbal months. That's when I had to stick a single kerbal on the station, pull out a calculator, and do some math to figure it out. Surely SN, you can add this? Those other two LS mods did.

[ShotgunNinja]

@DarkonZ 

17 minutes ago, DarkonZ said:

I noticed you use ':NEEDS[EnableScrubber]' in the profiles. Just how important is that?

I've added it just because some users were commenting out the '@Kerbalism:FOR[EnableScrubber]' line at the top, and then (probably correctly) expecting it to disable the scrubber completely. So now the scrubber module definition in the profiles NEEDS[EnableScrubber].

17 minutes ago, DarkonZ said:

I'm wondering cuz in my KPBS realism config, I'd think that pesky air-filter shouldn't even show up if the user disables the scrubber(Don't know why anyone would). Would this do the trick

Yes, that's the rationale why it was added in the first place. Essentially third parties should NEED[] a feature to be enabled before adding the respective module. I tried to explain that here.

17 minutes ago, DarkonZ said:

While I'm it, how come the Kerbalism GUI, (esp. in the VAB) doesn't provide a readout for LS resources for the "maximum" crew a vessel can have on it?

Well there is pro and con in considering the crew capacity OR the actual amount of crew members. But I'm not going into details in this here. What I'm going to do instead is the following: in next version when you keep ALT pressed in the VAB, the planner will assume all crew capacity is used. This mean you'll be able to simulate both situations. Even betters than the other mods man! [sarcasm].

Edited August 4, 2016 by ShotgunNinja

[New Horizons]

Hi ShotgunNinja,

did you consider including the radiation belts (especially their visualization in map view) in a career progression? I suggest that you only can have this helpfull visualization only after scanning space around a planet after scanning it with the Geiger Counter, maybe - a completet contract can verbalize this requirement.

[Kerbos]

@ShotgunNinja Had to google half the words there, so if I understand correctly you're running a custom rendering inside Unity's rendering without the rendering itself but within the hard coded limitations of Unity's rendering? That means the "bubble" only loads 1 time when you load your saved game and go to the Tracking Station and turns dynamic on zooming? Wait until SCANSat see this when you release it

1 hour ago, DarkonZ said:

Well, if you can perfect your modeling skills and get that wrapped up, I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to convince SN to include some of your models for the realism profile. Now that SN has taken my advice to identify the profiles for MM, you could create a model that serves both the default AND realism profiles within a single config file.

Thx, my real intention all along was creating the MedBay module to cure radiation from kerbals that @Jasseji mentioned some time ago (or something like that), modeling is not really troublesome, I do it on basis for campaigns, publicity, etc and this model is incredibly light low polygon, mapping and texturing is, but I honestly think that my ignorance over the mechanics on rendering in KSP and Unity is what really making this hard for me, this is how it looks now, still fighting with the lights (and top side still looks like crap)

Spoiler

 

Edited August 4, 2016 by Kerbos

[ShotgunNinja]

44 minutes ago, New Horizons said:

Hi ShotgunNinja,

did you consider including the radiation belts (especially their visualization in map view) in a career progression? I suggest that you only can have this helpfull visualization only after scanning space around a planet after scanning it with the Geiger Counter, maybe - a completet contract can verbalize this requirement.

I agree. After this I would like to rework the science system a bit and probably this can be connected somehow. But if I end up not doing the science system then unlocking it after a 'landmark contract' is a great idea.

 

@Kerbos I just minimize the amount of calculations done, in many ways. One of these is to precompute whatever is possible, once. SCANsat probably do things in the same spirit. BTW nice model, I like that honeycomb pattern 

[Beetlecat]

9 hours ago, ShotgunNinja said:

@theonegalen Well maybe it is possible to hack something (that is not pressurization at all) that allow a pod to not be usable above the 25kPA altitude: you explicitly set the pod to have 'zero' oxygen capacity. At that point, as soon as the vessel cross the 25kPA altitude, suffocation will start. This can made that particular pod incapable of going above that altitude, effectively. But only before the player is able to unlock the radial oxygen tank.

Right now there is no kind of control on climatization. But the EC cost is proportional to difference between external and survival temperature, and it is zero inside the 'survival range'. You can tweak both these values in Settings.cfg.

Right -- exactly. Just like the cockpits that still require "space suits" (like the SR-71, etc.). They'll work fine in space -- just not in the usual way.

[DrPastah]

Is cannibalism a thing in this?

[Kerbos]

32 minutes ago, DrPastah said:

Is cannibalism a thing in this?

Well if not it's about to be, just landed a ship on Minmus using an old design and after saving realize that only the landing module had resources in it.

[BashGordon33]

12 hours ago, ShotgunNinja said:

@raxo2222 Is not obstructed, they are mutually exclusive like the stock panels.

 

Good news: I managed to optimize the rendering to the point that it make no differences in framerate, and at the same time upped the particle count to 200k.

 

That seriously looks amazing. I'm so hyped for the update . Seriously, make this Kerbalism 1.1, it's such an awesome feature it needs a new digit. And just an update, I'm nearly finished with the OPM science definitions. I'll have them finished in at least 2 days. 

 

[Vince_K]

On 29/07/2016 at 5:54 PM, nosscire said:

@New Horizons poked me about the config I made for TAC Life Support converters way back when. Turns out that I never actually posted them in this thread... Silly me.

If anyone are interested in the config, you can find it here:

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AuFEM7_Fm5Yk7F-J-xrIsSfXJrVn

The way to use them is to install TAC, but then delete the "TAC Life Support" folder under Thunder Aerospace. That will allow you to keep the parts. You will likely want to keep the other parts as well (containers), they work out of the box.
For this, it is naturally highly recommended that you use the TAC profile by Rhedd for Kerbalism as well, or it will not be balanced.

Sorry for forgetting to share this back when I made it

sorry...not sure to understand...and yes...I am a noob sometime and I don't speak very well in english...your config are for playing with TAC LS and the other stuf of Kerbalism? were you put your config? and ...if I delete all the ''TAC Life Support'' folder...this thing will continue to work?

or someone can help?

BTW....good job for this mod...

Edited August 5, 2016 by Vince_K

[BashGordon33]

@ShotgunNinja Actually, I lied.... I got it done today :D. Got it done quickly, as a thank you for helping me fixing my dodgy modifications and just generally making this mod. Kerbalism definitely my award for greatest gameplay mod in all of KSP!

http://www.filedropper.com/kerbalismopm_1

I'm really sorry, but I couldn't get the patch file I made to actually change the science values in game :(. 

 

[ShotgunNinja]

I was able to render 4 million point sprites in real-time (around 30 fps). More realistically, I'm using 1 million point sprites now with very minor effects on frame rate.

This is probably possible only because the map view in fact is just showing a few textured spheres, some antialiased splines and a bunch of vessel icons. So in map view almost the whole GPU can be dedicated to this.

I moved the precomputation in another thread, that start in the main menu. The time required to precompute depend on number of planets and their magnetic field characteristics. For the stock solar system it is about 90 seconds.

When you first activate the field view in map view, if the results are not calculated yet a message will tell you to wait. But you can still do anything else in the meanwhile. Maybe in future I'll save the computation to disk and rebuild it only when required, but that's 12 MB per-body with a magnetic field.

Now what's left to do is to extend the heuristic function that determine field characteristics and testing/balance it against stock, OPM and RSS.

 

@BashGordon33 Thanks, I'll include those in next version. For the science values is better we don't change them, as OPM I believe already rebalance the body multipliers.

 

[DrPastah]

I cannot find oxygen, food, and water estimates for my rocket.

https://imgur.com/a/kTjTN

EDIT: Never mind, didn't realize there were requirements and was missing CommunityResourcePack. It should really be more emphasized with red letters.

Edited August 5, 2016 by DrPastah

[Toonu]

Hello all, I was long time waiting for USI LS patch for Kerbalism as profile. Meanwhile I slowly build it. My last version, third is very cut down to basics. It only contain radiation, malfunctions, climate control and control of energy and supplies level. I first tried to implement whole kerbalism food rules for it, but it was very complicated and incopatible with USI LS. So it only control levels of supplies and energy, not eat them instead USI LS. First time it eat supplies and USI LS eat them, so...  It also remove food and Ox storage tanks...and the small grey antenna, because it isn't working with RT2, so I decided to remove it too. Only greenhouse is working as greenhouse generating 0.5-year amount of supplies with use of mulch every 3/4 year. So it have 75% effectivity. Pretty effective for no-fertilizer thing (I won't use it probably, too cheaty...but if somebody have idea how to make it fair, just tell me...)

USI-LS Compatibility patch here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9dsekyreuo4to8p/USI-LS.cfg?dl=0

 

Edited August 5, 2016 by Toonu

[BashGordon33]

10 hours ago, ShotgunNinja said:

@BashGordon33 Thanks, I'll include those in next version. For the science values is better we don't change them, as OPM I believe already rebalance the body multipliers.

Actually, I meant science definitions. I couldn't get the definitions I made to manifest into the actual game. I basically copied coding from OPM itself, and their science definitions, but it must not work on experiments from mods.

[DrPastah]

Does radiation stay on Kerbins and carry over into other missions? I think it would be interesting that astronauts have a radiation limit like in real life. Also cannibalism feature when? Vid related.

 

Edited August 6, 2016 by DrPastah

[Drew Kerman]

17 hours ago, ShotgunNinja said:

Maybe in future I'll save the computation to disk and rebuild it only when required, but that's 12 MB per-body with a magnetic field.

are you worried about the file i/o being worse than just computing it every time? Because 12MB per body is a drop in the ocean for storage these days...

[ShotgunNinja]

@BashGordon33 Ok, I'll investigate. I have no idea why it would not be working. Try if this one does, somehow.

 

@DrPastah Radiation reset on re-entry to KSC for gameplay reasons. The player would just 'fire' the kerbal after a while otherwise. Cannibalism would be a bit too much...  BTW that game look cool, I'll try it.

 

@Gaiiden Sure is faster to load it from disk than recompute every time. But most users will never notice the time it take to generate: they need to go from main menu to mapview with magnetic field visualized in less than 90 seconds (15 seconds for low quality). I'll see how it goes this version, then in the next implement the store/load from disk (gzipped maybe) if necessary.

[Jacke]

14 minutes ago, ShotgunNinja said:

Cannibalism would be a bit too much... BTW that game look cool, I'll try it.

Oh, no.  Not "Tharsis".  That game takes a lot to get the hang of, and it's always brutal.  I was on the Space Game Junkies podcast a while back about it.  I played it for a while until I got reasonably good at it, but after once getting a full crew of 4 to Mars, I decided to never play it again.  I also think it can't be made any easier without losing something.  Interesting that they spent so much effort on the module internal visuals which you barely see in the game.  Tends to get to drowned out in the misery of survival spaceflight.

KSP is supposed to be fun.  That "detail" of survival spaceflight is anything but.  Not just grime but gruesome.