darthgently Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 The world economy is completely different now and has been a mess for a few years. All bets were off when COVID and reactions to COVID swept through. I'm not going to split hairs on what any company said about s product in development over the last few years. I'm just grateful work continued, investors didn't bail, and we have a release date Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strawberry Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Alexoff said: So you assume that the development of the game is going according to plan, but in order for the game to become even more epoch-making, the developers decided to release a stripped-down version for us to thoroughly test it? Do you know that the publisher in their annual report promised investors to release the game before April 2023, and KSP2 is the most promising product of the private division? Money was invested in the game and the franchise, the publisher wants to make a profit, the game is not ready, the developer is sure that he will not be able to finish his career by February. Which exit? Release what is ready at a discount. It's not about the consumer or the product, it's about the money of the publisher and its shareholders. If the goal is to just bait consumers into buying a bad product then scramble and hide in a bush or whatever, why wouldnt they just do that lol. Like to clarify I dont think the game is entirely done and everything is sunshine and rainbows, theres probably still work that needs to be done regarding some of the solar systems, multiplayer is probably buggy, still some design space and mechanics theyre unsure about for colonies, etc. But like, you're pretending like they havent had plenty of opportunities to just like, do that already. Even if you think they have kerbol and half of deb deb done, and multiplayer isnt working, there's no reason why they couldnt just go "oh it was cut we didnt think it was fit" for the unfinished planets and just release it then? Sure you'll upset people, but if their goal is to just get money from the initial release and then be fine with it, then like the initial quality doesnt really matter much, just the hype. I get that you have different priorities then others, and its perfectly fine to be disappointed by having to wait, but to me ksp2 has a lot of potential and I'd like for them to maximize the chance of utilizing that (and also I love to write long suggestion dumps about things). Don't think that just because people have different values and perspectives means that theyre some sheep you have to enlighten and show them the way, the fact that you assume that I have not considered these things says more about you then it does about me. Edited October 22, 2022 by Strawberry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 hour ago, Scarecrow71 said: Did I miss something? No science in the early release? Is the whole thing just sandbox? The answers above are sufficient - but I kind of speculate that the first Milestone will actually happen fairly quickly. Science being an integral part of the current KSP, it's probably something that doesn't/won't take a lot more work to round out. The Early Access 'sandbox only' is probably the best and most massive play testing that will find not only the most obvious problems with the core game - but a lot of the little things they never thought about b/c of being 'too close' to everything. Once the bug hunting is done, adding in Science / whatever else they want with Step 2 basically brings us to a full-featured revamp of KSP1 - and all the other stuff is the 'new' features we've been excited by. My prediction is that we get that within a relatively short time after Feb (short months) after which they will probably add Colonies some long months after with Interstellar, Exploration and MP (plus the update to be named later) coming in '24(+). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexoff Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 5 minutes ago, Strawberry said: If the goal is to just bait consumers into buying a bad product then scramble and hide in a bush or whatever, why wouldnt they just do that lol. Like to clarify I dont think the game is entirely done and everything is sunshine and rainbows, theres probably still work that needs to be done regarding some of the solar systems, multiplayer is probably buggy, still some design space and mechanics theyre unsure about for colonies, etc. But like, you're pretending like they havent had plenty of opportunities to just like, do that already. Even if you think they have kerbol and half of deb deb done, and multiplayer isnt working, there's no reason why they couldnt just go "oh it was cut we didnt think it was fit" for the unfinished planets and just release it then? Sure you'll upset people, but if there goal is to just get money from the initial release and then be fine with it, then like the initial quality doesnt really matter much, just the hype. I get that you have different priorities then others, and its perfectly fine to be disappointed by having to wait, but to me ksp2 has a lot of potential and I'd like for them to maximize the chance of utilizing that (and also I love to write long suggestion dumps about things). Don't think that just because people have different values and perspectives means that theyre some sheep you have to enlighten and show them the way, the fact that you assume that I have not considered these things says more about you then it does about me. They probably don't do this because reputation means something to T2, releasing a game in the spirit of no man sky is not good for a corporation of this level. Well, I hope so. I'm skeptical of the game's developers as they talk a lot and show little. And I'm sure there's a lot left unsaid. I follow the progress in development from the very beginning and do not forget everything in a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strawberry Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 4 minutes ago, Alexoff said: They probably don't do this because reputation means something to T2, releasing a game in the spirit of no man sky is not good for a corporation of this level. Well, I hope so. I'm skeptical of the game's developers as they talk a lot and show little. And I'm sure there's a lot left unsaid. I follow the progress in development from the very beginning and do not forget everything in a week. What you're suggesting just seems worse for reputation long term? It's generally just best to rip that bandaid off quickly as then people tend to move on quicker. Not to mention, they really havent made that much promises (the depth of colonies hasnt been stated much and could easily just be made into glorified fuel depots, until today we havent had confirmation of a star system outside of Deb Deb, etc), and considering the fact that small groups of modders have gotten similar things out in ksp1 in less time (albeit at an understandably lower quality then what would be expected for an AAA game), it would definitely be possible for them to scramble together something with unpolished functional multiplayer to where people vote on timewarp, another star system with underdeveloped planets, and a few new rocket engines that are mostly just number changes (though this would of course be lower quality then what's fully expected of an AAA game). This still definitely wouldnt leave people happy, but you could make it not a complete cashgrab and itd be far more disappointing then it is upsetting. Delays have a very understandable diminishing effect on hype because the fact that we are here shows that we care about this game, however that's very much known, and the fact that theyre not rushing to release it is to me is evidence against greed being a primary motivator here as developing games is expensive, so if you're going for short term profit as your goal, then youre going to want to rush it out of the door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLTay Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 At the far end of the roadmap on Steam (it is vertical there instead of horizontal on the forum page) there is a pixelated title. I rearranged the lines by slidin entire sections until they matched and it appears to say "new update" or "now loading." Anyone confirm? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pthigrivi Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said: The Early Access 'sandbox only' is probably the best and most massive play testing that will find not only the most obvious problems with the core game - but a lot of the little things they never thought about b/c of being 'too close' to everything. Once the bug hunting is done, adding in Science / whatever else they want with Step 2 basically brings us to a full-featured revamp of KSP1 - and all the other stuff is the 'new' features we've been excited by. With the notable exception of resource extraction, though, the more I think about it KSP2 will probably approach that process with way, way more depth than KSP1 did and it might be more of a distraction than a boon to foist in a placeholder mechanic than to consider prospecting, extraction, processing, and resource chains as its own animal. I think it's also easy to underestimate the challenge posed by science and progression, especially if they're ditching procedural contracts in favor of a more hand crafted, curated set of goals that elevate play from the first launch to building colonies and interstellar vessels. Edited October 22, 2022 by Pthigrivi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechBFP Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 hour ago, TLTay said: At the far end of the roadmap on Steam (it is vertical there instead of horizontal on the forum page) there is a pixelated title. I rearranged the lines by slidin entire sections until they matched and it appears to say "new update" or "now loading." Anyone confirm? Can you post the image you made? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLTay Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 32 minutes ago, MechBFP said: Can you post the image you made? I didn't save it. It was extremely pixelated and you had to zoom waaayyy out to even kind of make out what might have been the words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephensmat Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 I don't think it's a big secret that there'll be more DLC after 1.0 is finished. They could create a new system every so often, and keep this game going forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSchleep Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 I'll be honest, I wish that multiplayer would be at the beginning and not the end of the road map. Even if we accept that they need time and community feedback to polish the new features, I want to be able to experience those new features with my friends. It would be much more fun, in my mind, to play KSP2 with your friends and experience each new update as a group. For instance, imagine if I had a save with my bud and we finished exploring the Kerbolar system. When a new update with science or colonies or whatever comes out, we can jump right back in and keep enjoying the game. With the roadmap as it is, unless I wait until 1.0 I'll be playing with the new features already and have to do a new run through at the end once multiplayer is out. Basically, I don't want to see what there is to see and lose interest (at least in the short term) in the game before I get to play with my friends. Just my two cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laxez Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 2 hours ago, BigSchleep said: I'll be honest, I wish that multiplayer would be at the beginning and not the end of the road map. Even if we accept that they need time and community feedback to polish the new features, I want to be able to experience those new features with my friends. It would be much more fun, in my mind, to play KSP2 with your friends and experience each new update as a group. For instance, imagine if I had a save with my bud and we finished exploring the Kerbolar system. When a new update with science or colonies or whatever comes out, we can jump right back in and keep enjoying the game. With the roadmap as it is, unless I wait until 1.0 I'll be playing with the new features already and have to do a new run through at the end once multiplayer is out. Basically, I don't want to see what there is to see and lose interest (at least in the short term) in the game before I get to play with my friends. Just my two cents. Honestly multiplayer was the least feature I expected, but I can understand the hype, however I guess it's better to have a full game and then add multiplayer, rather than starting from multiplayer, also because if the basic features don't work, they can be fixed, but having to fix those + multiplayer requires more manpower. Without considering that most likely, as in KSP 1, every time there is a major update, a sort of "Wipe" will occur, forcing players to restart the game due to incompatible saves. I hope I'm wrong of course, but this possibility exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekerci Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 Hi everyone, this is going to be my first post and I was reading the forum for many years I just didn't feel to register and write something until now. I was waiting the game for so long like everyone in here. Finally we have a date but it is upsetting for me to have the game in these conditions. I will buy the game day one but I'm not planning to play it. I will just check around. 4 years of development and the game has obsoletely nothing in it. if it was another game I wouldn't even dare to buy it. They mentioned so many features and non of them will be in the game. Yes, I get that they are going to check bugs etc but there are teams to do this job. They could at least bring the game with some of the features. I can't offer this game to my friends as well because it will have no game in it. I don't really care about multiplayer part but I was looking for other features. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve9728 Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 As the Chinese saying goes, it's never afraid that a delicious meal coming too late. So just keep going! Dare to screw something up is one of the most important parts in Kerbel Spoiler Place your bet: who will go first? SLS's first launch, or KSP2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 Spoiler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Aziz Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 47 minutes ago, Laxez said: as in KSP 1, every time there is a major update, a sort of "Wipe" will occur, forcing players to restart the game due to incompatible saves. Funny enough, the only time the saves were incompatible was during alpha, before gamemodes, and related lines in a savefile, were added. I bet I could still open my 0.90 science save in 1.12. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 hour ago, steve9728 said: Place your bet: who will go first? SLS's first launch, or KSP2? Ouch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Aziz Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 SLS should go in November (inb4: bad weather, not going, scrub for another month). I'm more concerned about Starship. Wasn't that supposed to fly in August? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 In August of what year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexoff Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 9 hours ago, Strawberry said: What you're suggesting just seems worse for reputation long term? Yes, this is a sharp negative movement of the company, which then intends to sell other games. It can also cause a chaotic sale of shares, which will not please the shareholders. And they can choose new directors of T2 at the meeting. And if you warn in advance that the game is very far from completion, then it will stretch in time and the negative effect will be smoothed out. Well, the stories that we were not actually promised this lie, we were promised a lot of things. In general, for years, with every delay, we were told that this was due to perfectionism, and not because even basic things could not be done on time. 41 minutes ago, The Aziz said: I'm more concerned about Starship. Wasn't that supposed to fly in August? https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/sep/27/elon-musk-spacex-mars-colony SpaceX founder Elon Musk has outlined his highly ambitious vision for manned missions to Mars, which he said could begin as soon as 2022 – three years sooner than his previous estimates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 Which KSP-2 release is supposed to be adding the Mun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarecrow71 Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 11 hours ago, Rutabaga22 said: In the second cell of the roadmap it says "Science" it mentions it will have progression in that update. Ah, I missed that. Thank you for pointing that out! 11 hours ago, Alexoff said: Step 1 - early acess Step 2 - science and tech tree... Step 1: Early Access Step 2: ??? Step 3: Profit! ... ... On another note, I'm not sure I understand why people are all freaking out about the exclusion of features in the Early Access release. Everyone was excited when the game was announced, and people got angry over the multiple and seemingly endless delays, with a few wondering why there wouldn't be an early access phase. Now Intercept and T2 have announced an Early Access version of the game, specifically to get community input on bugs and issues and what works and what doesn't...and people are mad that they aren't geting the full game and they think that Early Access is a joke? I get the sentiment about not having the features in the game you want to play through, such as multi-player or (even in my case) science and unlocking the tech tree. Or maybe it's specific parts, or planets. Or perhaps interstellar travel or colonization of the Kerbolian system. Yes, we want all of these features. But at what cost? All of this stuff will eventually come in time, and while you are waiting you get your hands on KSP2 at a reduced cost (I believe the original ask was going to be $60, and EA is now $50; correct me if I'm wrong) AND you will end up getting all of those features at no additional cost to you. Well, no cost other than you get to play the game without those features and learn how the game is going to function so when those features come out you are ready for them. But no additional out-of-pocket cash for these features. I'm not talking about DLC like with Breaking Ground/Making History, but core/stock features that will be included in updates. Which, really, isn't anything different than what they did with KSP, right? Science wasn't part of the original game. Neither was repairing stuff in space. Or inventory. Me, for one, I am excited as all get-up about Early Access. Day one, February 24th, I'm going to purchase this and play the bejeezus out of it. I won't care about the stuff that isn't there because I'll be too darned focused on the stuff that is. Edited October 22, 2022 by Scarecrow71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechBFP Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Scarecrow71 said: Now Intercept and T2 have announced an Early Access version of the game, specifically to get community input on bugs and issues and what works and what doesn't...and people are mad that they aren't geting the full game and they think that Early Access is a joke? There is a difference between this game being early access in 2020 compared to 2023. I’ll let you figure out the difference. Edited October 22, 2022 by MechBFP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 (edited) 52 minutes ago, Scarecrow71 said: Which, really, isn't anything different than what they did with KSP, right? Yes. Eight years ago. Spoiler And many mods ago, where you can steal the best part of settings and ideas already disputed, debugged, and tested by users. Edited October 22, 2022 by kerbiloid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just a random person Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 hour ago, kerbiloid said: Which KSP-2 release is supposed to be adding the Mun? I understood the whole Kerbol system will be in the first release Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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