First impression from Scott Manley's gameplay video.

[runner78]

The tutorials voise reminds me a bit of the voice of Venti from Genshin Impact (male character, female english voice actor 30+), or a youtuber with a similar voice who creates Gensin Impact content.
The voice doesn't have to be pitched, Paimon from Genshin Impact isn't pitched either (english voice), she can speak like that.
In animes generally, children are spoken by adult women.

[Tweeker]

6 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

KSP 2 is aimed at ALL ages. So the voice has to be engaging to children. 

Though, I think I've come up with a solution. Have multiple voice actors. Have the game ask for your age group. 1-6, 7-10, 11-15, 16-20, so on and so forth, then have a specific voice actor for each group. 

That's the point, they are targeted to kids but off putting to older people. 

Having different tutorials or voices for different audiences would certainly be a good solution, much better than the "just grit your teeth a bear it " attitude that some have expressed. 

 

[mystik]

6 hours ago, RayneCloud said:

So you don't want children to learn about STEM and Space Flight then? I mean, I guess that's a stance to take, but I don't agree with it.

So, only rich kids should get into STEM, coz those graphic requirement are crazy. Also, STEM has been there before some obscure game existed and it will exist after the game becomes relegated to the "oldies" section. It's just a game. It does not have any moral obligations to society. Its purpose is to entertain. If some people get inspired by it to pursue rocket science, fine, bit that's a byproduct, not the purpose of the game. Even if the devs market the game as having higher goals, that's just marketing and PR. If they cared about STEM and "higher goals" they would give it for free to all the kids that might go into stem in the future. The fact that it is behind a paywall shows the real purpose. To make money. It is entertainment. As someone famous once sad: "They Don't Think It Be Like It Is But It Do."

[K^2]

25 minutes ago, Tweeker said:

That's the point, they are targeted to kids but off putting to older people.

I think the statistics in this thread show quite clearly that it's off-putting to a small group of people, not "to older people" in general.

The "I don't like it," and "This is something people don't like and shouldn't like," are two very different statements. Historically, when people claimed the latter purely based on feeling the former, some very nasty things have been done. I want to avoid political comparisons, but it's a very strong signal to re-evaluate what sort of an argument you're trying to make.

[kerbiloid]

3 hours ago, cfds said:

Well, considering that my family still uses the same set of dice for 30 odd years

Incorrect comparison.
The longer the dice are used, the more luck sticks to them. (Unlucky ones quickly have gone.)

1 hour ago, GoldForest said:

Honestly, after hearing the voice in this video, it doesn't sound like a kid's voice to me anymore. Sounds more like a female voice that's higher pitched than most others. 

A small woman. Maybe an Asian.

Spoiler

 

 

[Tweeker]

40 minutes ago, K^2 said:

I think the statistics in this thread show quite clearly that it's off-putting to a small group of people, not "to older people" in general.

The "I don't like it," and "This is something people don't like and shouldn't like," are two very different statements. Historically, when people claimed the latter purely based on feeling the former, some very nasty things have been done. I want to avoid political comparisons, but it's a very strong signal to re-evaluate what sort of an argument you're trying to make.

Rather then being open to hearing other people point of veiw it seems you'd rather marginalize anyone's opinion if its different than your's.  If your not willing to listen to people you'll never hear what they're saying. 

 

[K^2]

29 minutes ago, Tweeker said:

Rather then being open to hearing other people point of veiw it seems you'd rather marginalize anyone's opinion if its different than your's.

1 hour ago, Tweeker said:

That's the point, they are targeted to kids but off putting to older people.

And re-read the thread and see how many people are telling you they're not put off, look at the upvotes on these, then tell me again how I'm marginalizing anyone's opinions. Have you tried applying any of these criteria to your own posts?

[tstein]

58 minutes ago, Tweeker said:

Rather then being open to hearing other people point of veiw it seems you'd rather marginalize anyone's opinion if its different than your's.  If your not willing to listen to people you'll never hear what they're saying. 

 

Then make a poll,because it seems for me that  the majority do not care at all for the voice. The only concern I woudl have with voice is if it is  clear for peopel whose english is not their first language ( most of the planet)

[Gargamel]

Let’s keep the discussion focused on Scott’s video here.   Thanks. 

[Bej Kerman]

7 hours ago, Tweeker said:

Yeah, kids with money for a $1000 graphics card. 

I wish I didn't have to repeat myself. EA is NOT FOR A WIDER AUDIENCE. EA is targeted at people who are going to be reporting bugs and trying to make the most of the development period. It is not a release. In 99% of developer projects, juggling optimisation at the same time as adding things hurts efficiency, so expect that the current high demands are a result of rushing to get EA out and won't hold true closer to launch, or maybe even a few months from now, depending on developer priorities.

Key words: closer to launch. EA is not a launch. It's an open window into the development process. Just to make it absolutely clear that your expectations are not in check. The $1000 graphics card builds are not aimed at the kids you keep bringing up.

5 hours ago, K^2 said:

Of course not. But if your entire criticism is built on, "I know what I'm doing, stop patronizing me," you can't exactly start claiming to be a new player.

Now, if you were in the demographic to whom the tutorials were targeted and you thought they were not helpful, we could have a constructive discussion about it. As it stands, you're just being upset that something in the game isn't made specifically for you.

This

They complain about being condescending but all they've done so far is complain about the fact a voice actor didn't have / didn't put on a deep voice on. I get the impression if they were face to face with the VA or the staff member they were a client for, they wouldn't be giving out all these strong words.

11 hours ago, whatsEJstandfor said:

It sounds to me, though, that you're discounting a character who's knowledgeable, personable, and passionate (P.A.I.G.E.) based on their voice. Video games, space stuff, and video games about space stuff are already extremely white-man-centric. This is about representation. All of us here are already fans of Scott Manley. But most non-white-male people I know find him smug (and, tbh, I often do, too). My wife can't stand him, for example, and she's exactly the kind of person who Intercept should be (and appears to be) targeting with these tutorials. Someone who loves casual gaming, and would probably have a lot of fun messing around in KSP if the learning curve wasn't a square wave.

Again, points for bringing up representation!

Inb4 men get upset over the leading figure for all the newbs learning KSP 2 not being some super manley ultra uber masculine goit

Note to moderation: "goit" refers to the British slang insult popularized by Red Dwarf, derived from goitre (i.e. a pain in the neck), not the Urban Dictionary definition. It is intended as a point of sarcasm, a joke, and is not intended to offend men outside those who would genuinely get annoyed by someone in a video game not being a man.

Second, slightly more important note to moderation: the forum directed me to page three of this discussion, and was not aware of the moderator request to "keep the discussion focused on Scott’s video here" - apologies!

[BeastHunter]

12 hours ago, RayneCloud said:

So you don't want children to learn about STEM and Space Flight then? I mean, I guess that's a stance to take, but I don't agree with it.

Never said that. Used as a tool for educators, yes, these tutorials could have potential. But for anyone who buys this game probably doesn’t need to be told what a rocket is, as in the first tutorial. I find it hard to see a kid downloading a $50 game without knowing what it’s about. All I’m saying is the tutorials probably could be a bit higher level.

5 hours ago, GoldForest said:

Though, I think I've come up with a solution. Have multiple voice actors. Have the game ask for your age group. 1-6, 7-10, 11-15, 16-20, so on and so forth, then have a specific voice actor for each group. 

This is a great idea. Have maybe a “basic” and an “advanced” tutorial, each covering the same basic info, while the basic one has all the humor and the voice acting, and the advanced one figs deeper into it so you know more.

[Bombaatu]

5 hours ago, GoldForest said:

Though, I think I've come up with a solution. Have multiple voice actors. Have the game ask for your age group. 1-6, 7-10, 11-15, 16-20, so on and so forth, then have a specific voice actor for each group. 

This would be a great feedback suggestion once the game goes live. Personally, I'd love to get the guy who does the Kurzgesagt videos:

 

[dmsilev]

I think some people have lost sight of the fact that the tutorial in question was the very very first one in the series. It covered yaw pitch and roll, and the keys to push to enable those actions. Things like that. Of course it comes off as very basic. That's the intent. 

Has anyone posted video of an in-game "go to orbit" tutorial yet? That'd be a better reflection of the level of audience that the tutorials are aiming at. 

[tstein]

Just now, dmsilev said:

I think some people have lost sight of the fact that the tutorial in question was the very very first one in the series. It covered yaw pitch and roll, and the keys to push to enable those actions. Things like that. Of course it comes off as very basic. That's the intent. 

Has anyone posted video of an in-game "go to orbit" tutorial yet? That'd be a better reflection of the level of audience that the tutorials are aiming at. 

Mostly important.. the tutorial about  usign the head of the kerbal  against the tip of a mountain to  reduce velocity and perform a litho capture.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, BeastHunter said:

But for anyone who buys this game probably doesn’t need to be told what a rocket is, as in the first tutorial. I find it hard to see a kid downloading a $50 game without knowing what it’s about.

Keep in mind that, as absurd as it sounds, rockets are actually pretty rare in space games.

People will come to KSP as fan of smace games, knowing everything about spaceships and FTL and nothing about what a rocket is.

[BeastHunter]

1 hour ago, Master39 said:

People will come to KSP as fan of smace games, knowing everything about spaceships and FTL and nothing about what a rocket is.

Never thought of it this way. That does make lots of since and explains the explanation. Maybe they should add a tutorial for those on a higher age level, but it’s impossible to please everyone. 

[angelatthetomb]

The tutorials are Very Kerbal.

 

What would a tutorial look and sound like if it were made by Kerbals? Exactly like the example in Manley's video. It feels entirely authentic to the game world.

 

OP is taking KSP too seriously. It's a game where you can do serious things, yes - I play with RealFuels and Kerbalism and DR and 2.7x OPM and all of the good stuff. Very science. Much hard. I still chuckle like an idiot when I screw up and everything explodes.

 

I also keep an unmodded install to play with my 5-year old. We build some monstrous contraption and he tries to make the Kerbals take their helmets off in space or jump out in the middle of reentry. We both chuckle like idiots when we screw up and everything explodes.

 

The audience for KSP 2 is both of these experiences. One needs a tutorial. The other probably doesn't.

 

It's a fun game. Let it be fun.

[Turbo Ben]

6 hours ago, K^2 said:

The "I don't like it," and "This is something people don't like and shouldn't like," are two very different statements. Historically, when people claimed the latter purely based on feeling the former, some very nasty things have been done. I want to avoid political comparisons, but it's a very strong signal to re-evaluate what sort of an argument you're trying to make.

That goes both ways. There is a lot of "I like it so it isn't an issue" going on here.

5 hours ago, K^2 said:

And re-read the thread and see how many people are telling you they're not put off, look at the upvotes on these...

If you like it, great. If you don't, that's a shame. If too many don't, that's a concern. Looking at the upvotes as you suggest it's maybe 3 or 4 to 1. That's still 25% to 33% of people that don't like it.

The target however shouldn't be 50%+, or 66%+, or 75%+. It should be 100%. You won't hit 100%, but it should still be the target.

Also bear in mind that this is a KSP forum for fans of KSP, so there is likely a bias towards people that are excited for the game.

 

To make my position clear, I dislike the tutorial voiceover, enough to make me avoid the tutorials. That isn't a problem for me, I know enough to jump in without them and know what gameplay to expect. I will be getting the game on Friday and hope to contribute to the development of the game.

My concern is new players that will need the tutorials. You don't want 25% being turned off at the first hurdle because:

1. The tutorial voice is unbearable and you skip the tutorials. The complexity of the game prevents any progress.

2. You conclude from the tutorials that the game is for young children.

Those people are just as likely to go straight for a refund and never think about the game again than go searching on youtube. Maybe they'll even leave a negative review on the way out.

[BeastHunter]

13 minutes ago, angelatthetomb said:

I also keep an unmodded install to play with my 5-year old. We build some monstrous contraption and he tries to make the Kerbals take their helmets off in space or jump out in the middle of reentry. We both chuckle like idiots when we screw up and everything explodes.

 

I learned the hard way, teleporting Jeb to Eloo after removing his helmet on Kerbin. Good times.

[modus]

If I may say something about Scott's video (you know, the actual topic of this thread ): I thought it was noticeably shorter than others, like Matt or everyday astronaut. He didn't really get to the details like the others imo.

I wonder if he will actually make ksp2 gameplay videos. I really hope so, I'm a fan (of what he does now, but also his old ksp stuff).

[Jarin]

I'm an adult, I thought the tutorial voice was fine. It fits the tone of the base game. "Serious" folks can mod it out just like they always have with RSS and RO.

[Vanamonde]

Since Manley is not doing the tutorial videos, a discussion of whether he should or not is moot and has been removed. 

[Drakenred65]

6 hours ago, Master39 said:

Keep in mind that, as absurd as it sounds, rockets are actually pretty rare in space games.

People will come to KSP as fan of smace games, knowing everything about spaceships and FTL and nothing about what a rocket is.

A number of KSP ers ( including me) ran into some of that. When people were first arguing about realistic space flight because NASApunk in  Starfield as being part of space flight in that game (on the reddit for Starfield) we were like um no your really not going to get that, for reasons why see KSP and several videos.( I know a couple of people who tried it, and they came to the obvious conclusion that trying to dogfight in orbit in space was dumb  )about various problems involving orbital interception maneuvering and flight . I know it came up in star citizen as well.

9 minutes ago, Vanamonde said:

Since Manley is not doing the tutorial videos, a discussion of whether he should or not is moot and has been removed. 

Well that ands Scott is already planing on doing KSP 2 videos for his own channel at his own pace.

 

 

[Superfluous J]

5 hours ago, modus said:

If I may say something about Scott's video (you know, the actual topic of this thread ): I thought it was noticeably shorter than others, like Matt or everyday astronaut. He didn't really get to the details like the others imo.

I wonder if he will actually make ksp2 gameplay videos. I really hope so, I'm a fan (of what he does now, but also his old ksp stuff).

He said somewhere in that video that he had problems and OBS crashed, and he didn't notice it until later. They only had 90 minutes, apparently. He didn't SOUND crushed, but if I were him, and flew thousands of miles to wait for hours or days to get only 90 minutes to play a game I've been anticipating for 3 years, and I found that over half my recording time had been lost to the ether... yeah I'd be crushed.

[modus]

Good point looking forward to more Scott!