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[1.12.5] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.12.0 "Песок" 13/Jan/2023)


CobaltWolf
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14 minutes ago, qwery123 said:

But it has many gaps and only covers one side, and when I place it, the game says "Module ModuleCargoBay is not an IScalar Module"

There shouldn't be any gaps. You're either doing something wrong or have a problem with your install. Could you provide a screenshot?

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Old meets new.

20220505210359_1_by_pudgemountain_df4zt59-pre.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9NzIwIiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvNWNlZDA4NmItYTUwYy00YjFkLWJmZmItYmRhOWYxOTgyNzVmXC9kZjR6dDU5LWVjZDBhNjRmLTkyNGYtNDExNi04NTdmLWVkOTk3ZTA5YmYyYy5qcGciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9MTI4MCJ9XV0sImF1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19.u7Ja8Oh27-geKNlOHU4FivL2Jdnl3hWXAC5A8TqSUCo

Spoiler

I used the J-2X meant for the Aries on the S-IVB stage of a Saturn V. So far it's power and Delta V are great but due to the fact it's an old Loneseomrobot mod it means it runs on LF/O which makes it alot heavier and don't even try putting it on the S-II and S-IVB stages together it will be too heavy.

 

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21 minutes ago, Pudgemountain said:

Old meets new.

20220505210359_1_by_pudgemountain_df4zt59-pre.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9NzIwIiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvNWNlZDA4NmItYTUwYy00YjFkLWJmZmItYmRhOWYxOTgyNzVmXC9kZjR6dDU5LWVjZDBhNjRmLTkyNGYtNDExNi04NTdmLWVkOTk3ZTA5YmYyYy5qcGciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9MTI4MCJ9XV0sImF1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19.u7Ja8Oh27-geKNlOHU4FivL2Jdnl3hWXAC5A8TqSUCo

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I used the J-2X meant for the Aries on the S-IVB stage of a Saturn V. So far it's power and Delta V are great but due to the fact it's an old Loneseomrobot mod it means it runs on LF/O which makes it alot heavier and don't even try putting it on the S-II and S-IVB stages together it will be too heavy.

 

Why not use a REAL J-2X instead of the fake one!?   in 2x of it's 4 forms it is already in BDB (J-2T and J-2X)

 

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23 minutes ago, Pudgemountain said:

Old meets new.

20220505210359_1_by_pudgemountain_df4zt59-pre.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9NzIwIiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvNWNlZDA4NmItYTUwYy00YjFkLWJmZmItYmRhOWYxOTgyNzVmXC9kZjR6dDU5LWVjZDBhNjRmLTkyNGYtNDExNi04NTdmLWVkOTk3ZTA5YmYyYy5qcGciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9MTI4MCJ9XV0sImF1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19.u7Ja8Oh27-geKNlOHU4FivL2Jdnl3hWXAC5A8TqSUCo

  Reveal hidden contents

I used the J-2X meant for the Aries on the S-IVB stage of a Saturn V. So far it's power and Delta V are great but due to the fact it's an old Loneseomrobot mod it means it runs on LF/O which makes it alot heavier and don't even try putting it on the S-II and S-IVB stages together it will be too heavy.

 

If you want to use a J-2X there are much better ones in Cryoengines and Redirect that use LH2.

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21 minutes ago, Pappystein said:

Why not use a REAL J-2X instead of the fake one!?   in 2x of it's 4 forms it is already in BDB (J-2T and J-2X)

 

I do use the BDB I just did the Ares V J-2X as a test and I prefer the BDB one.

 

19 minutes ago, Entr8899 said:

If you want to use a J-2X there are much better ones in Cryoengines and Redirect that use LH2.

That is true.

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24 minutes ago, Stolas said:

is it possible to download the latest version of BDB, but not break all the craft files?

I don’t know how old your install is, but the most recent major update will break any previous craft that uses any apollo, saturn (with the exception of the F-1 and J-2 engines) or skylab part. Furthermore the rescale extra that came with previous versions of BDB no longer works.

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On 5/3/2022 at 9:52 PM, Zorg said:

  Im a little surprised by this since we've not had reports about reentry problems with the Apollo. The configs were fine tuned by JSO ages ago and should still be applicable to the new parts and the behavior seemed ok in our last round of testing. That said we can take another look but I'm curious if other people are having similar problems.

@Zorg As a matter of fact, I'm having heat issues with the Kane also, which may or may not be related.  Using JNSQ, RealChute, but not FAR and not DeadlyReentry or anything. Also using a lot of other mods, granted, though I've run pretty much the same set of mods with BDB without issues before.

Return from Mun using aerobraking with periapsis at 40km or so:

Using stock parts - no problem, the command pod barely heats up, the heatshield does its job properly (so it's not a PEBCAK issue).

Using Kane 11-3 (reference CSM design from unofficial BDB wiki) - the Kane immediately heats up and explodes, way before the heatshield even gets hot. 

I've also tried using the Kane CSM while replacing just the heatshield with a stock part but it didn't change anything, Kane still exploded immediately.

Also (this is from a while ago so take it with a grain of salt but) I believe that I used the same parts around December (from the github apollo revamp dev branch back then) for the same return mission in JNSQ without any such issues...

 

Edited by Grimmas
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Apollo should work fine with JNSQ. I've been testing it a lot recently and the only trouble I've had has been splashdown bounciness, which turned out to be a Scatterer issue rather than a BDB issue. I have been using FAR but it definitely works from lunar re-entries with that. I don't know of any reason it would perform badly without FAR.

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31 minutes ago, septemberWaves said:

On the note of craft files, is there a need for some new ones? I've been putting together a lot of the different Saturn variants, and I'm happy to upload them if desired.

We've updated the craft files with most of the key variants with the last release. If you feel there are interesting or important variants still missing happy to take a look at what you have :) 

Please do keep in mind craft files meant for inclusion must be made on an up to date KSP, on a clean install with just BDB and its dependencies (so there are no rogue modules, its generally harmless but it throws an error that alarms some people).

26 minutes ago, Grimmas said:

@Zorg As a matter of fact, I'm having heat issues with the Kane also, which may or may not be related.  Using JNSQ, RealChute, but not FAR and not DeadlyReentry or anything. Also using a lot of other mods, granted, though I've run pretty much the same set of mods with BDB without issues before.

Return from Mun using aerobraking with periapsis at 40km or so:

Using stock parts - no problem, the command pod barely heats up, the heatshield does its job properly (so it's not a PEBCAK issue).

Using Kane 11-3 (reference CSM design from unofficial BDB wiki) - the Kane immediately heats up and explodes, way before the heatshield even gets hot. 

I've also tried using the Kane CSM while replacing just the heatshield with a stock part but it didn't change anything, Kane still exploded immediately.

Also (this is from a while ago so take it with a grain of salt but) I believe that I used the same parts around December (from the github apollo revamp dev branch back then) for the same return mission in JNSQ without any such issues...

 

Uh can you check on a more recent version of BDB?

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Only about 2 years late, here's some variants of the Delta IV fairing and standalone payload adapter.

The fairing base can now switch their top nodes from 2.5m to 1.875m

The structural adapter can now switch from 3.125->2.5, 3.125->1.875 and 2.5->1.875

Image

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45 minutes ago, Zorg said:

  Uh can you check on a more recent version of BDB?

You misunderstood me, I'm having the issues above using the GitHub master branch from two days ago. 

Funny thing though, I tried it using FAR just now and it works fine using FAR. So it's likely to be an issue with the drag cubes.

48 minutes ago, septemberWaves said:

Apollo should work fine with JNSQ. I've been testing it a lot recently and the only trouble I've had has been splashdown bounciness, which turned out to be a Scatterer issue rather than a BDB issue. I have been using FAR but it definitely works from lunar re-entries with that. I don't know of any reason it would perform badly without FAR.

I can think of a good reason - there must be some problem with the Kane's drag cubes, and since FAR does not use the drag cubes and instead builds its own model, the problem does not manifest when using FAR. I'm not really familiar with KSP's heat model but I bet reentry heating is related to drag.

Edited by Grimmas
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29 minutes ago, Grimmas said:

Funny thing though, I tried it using FAR just now and it works fine using FAR. So it's likely to be an issue with the drag cubes.

I can think of a good reason - there must be some problem with the Kane's drag cubes, and since FAR does not use the drag cubes and instead builds its own model, the problem does not manifest when using FAR. I'm not really familiar with KSP's heat model but I bet reentry heating is related to drag.

That would make a lot of sense.

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51 minutes ago, Grimmas said:

You misunderstood me, I'm having the issues above using the GitHub master branch from two days ago. 

Funny thing though, I tried it using FAR just now and it works fine using FAR. So it's likely to be an issue with the drag cubes.

I can think of a good reason - there must be some problem with the Kane's drag cubes, and since FAR does not use the drag cubes and instead builds its own model, the problem does not manifest when using FAR. I'm not really familiar with KSP's heat model but I bet reentry heating is related to drag.

Sorry I got your earlier comment backwards. I've managed to reproduce the issue but Im not sure whats gone wrong as it was fine earlier. Will need to dig into this.

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1 hour ago, Grimmas said:

You misunderstood me, I'm having the issues above using the GitHub master branch from two days ago. 

Funny thing though, I tried it using FAR just now and it works fine using FAR. So it's likely to be an issue with the drag cubes.

I can think of a good reason - there must be some problem with the Kane's drag cubes, and since FAR does not use the drag cubes and instead builds its own model, the problem does not manifest when using FAR. I'm not really familiar with KSP's heat model but I bet reentry heating is related to drag.

I've made a commit which prevents drag cube (and FAR voxel) recalculation with the B9 switchers on the capsules and heatshield variants. Its likely the addition of the switchers late in the dev cycle is what introduced the problem. It survived without any abnormalities under similar circumstances as my earlier test which was a lunar return in JNSQ with a 35km periapsis with both regular and offset CoM. Please have a look and let me know if its working for you (or anyone else with similar problems). The potential fix is on both master and dev.

Edited by Zorg
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3 hours ago, Zorg said:

Only about 2 years late, here's some variants of the Delta IV fairing and standalone payload adapter.

The fairing base can now switch their top nodes from 2.5m to 1.875m

The structural adapter can now switch from 3.125->2.5, 3.125->1.875 and 2.5->1.875

Image

Could we also get a version of the Delta IV fairing without the payload adapter, the bare ring is nice for kit bashing.

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So, I have decided that I'm going to be launching most if not all probes that BDB has to offer, and possibly more (Probesplus, Scansat, etc). And no, I won't be deorbiting them... so, yeah... skies going to get a little busy. 

Question is... do I do it Chronological by rocket, start with the smallest rocket LV and go to the biggest or vice versa, or launch all satellites in a series before moving on to the next (Start with Explorer family, move on to Transit, etc)

Thinking I might do satellites in a series... that or smallest rocket to largest.

Might even do the failures, so yeah, will have double the number of some satellites. Like Explorer 9 (56 and 56A)

Edit: Decided to do the one-off failures. So like if a satellite failed to reach orbit, but didn't have any backup units made or flown, than it will get a launch, but if there were multiple flown, only the successes will get flown, so like Vanguard 1 A, B and C, only C will fly. 

Edited by GoldForest
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@GoldForest you could try to launch according to the contracts in the History of Spaceflight contract pack, there are lots of probe missions in there specifically for BDB (and I think ProbesPlus also, not sure)

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