KSP2 EA Grand Discussion Thread.

[MechBFP]

Flying a plane, quick save. Later on quick load and the wings rip right off the plane every time I load. You can still control the wings with w, and s strangely enough but the rest of the craft becomes an uncontrolled missile.

Eventually the camera gets too far away from both pieces of the craft.

Click the EVA and the Kerbal hangs on for dear life no were near the door that he was supposed to come out of but surprisingly never gets thrown off. Jump off and determine the terminal velocity of a Kerbal is 180m/s, quit the game.

Ya I’ve had just about enough of this for now. 

Edited February 25, 2023 by MechBFP

[Lisias]

8 minutes ago, Kubas_inko said:

Probably because Take Two (the publisher) wants some returns finally and wants to see if it will be worth it. So far it does not look that good.

Yep.

Problem is that by doing it, they are risking creating the failure themselves.

Most of the backslash is coming from the pricing being asked. Had they published a very minimalistic demo by 10 bucks, you can bet your mouse they would having way less criticism.

Software Development is way counter intuitive - the current state of affairs doesn't means necessarily that they screwed up. It probably means that their current customers are the Content Creators and not us, but then some pointed egg head forced the hand on publishing the thing as is and Kraken help us all.

The Content Creators need tools to do their job, and if the dev team spends time polishing the engine for us before the Creatives have their tools, we would have no Content at all.

[Rocket Farmer]

23 hours ago, regex said:

I find it amusing to see the comparisons to KSP1 considering just how little KSP1 had at 0.7.3 release. People have some really short memories.

Totally this!

I started in early 2013.  We didn’t have heat re-entry, missions, kerbnet communications, upgrades Le buildings, science and our atmosphere was referred to as the soupisphere as aerodynamics didn’t matter (I remember launching entire space stations on 25 rocket grids nicknamed pancakes of power) plus we had about 1/2 as many parts as KSP2.

[Wheehaw Kerman]

23 hours ago, tstein said:

No it doe snot. EA is a tradeoff..   we pay  the developers  early for something that is not ready..  in return  they  have to accept that we are going to WHINE . There is no reason for EA is  people are to simply shut up. The time to be vocal is EXACTLY  in EA. Anyone that pays for EA  gets the right to voice their concerns!

Disagree.  EA is the time for providing feedback like “I am getting [framerate] fps in [situation] with a [details on CPU/GPU]” or “I encountered [bug] that did [thing] in [situation]”.  We all of course have the right to express ourselves: why not do so like non-toxic adults?

[Alexoff]

2 minutes ago, Rocket Farmer said:

We didn’t have heat re-entry, missions, kerbnet communications, upgrades Le buildings, science and our atmosphere was referred to as the soupisphere as aerodynamics didn’t matter (I remember launching entire space stations on 25 rocket grids nicknamed pancakes of power) plus we had about 1/2 as many parts as KSP2.

In 2013, the game was developed by just a few developers for three years and cost like $0. I don't know for sure, I got acquainted with the game in 2015 and paid about $7. KSP2 began to be developed in 2017 by professional game developers under the patronage of T2. It is now in its sixth year of development and the game is 50$.

[Wheehaw Kerman]

3 hours ago, SilentSword said:

I’m most concerned by the kraken bugs that still remain rather than the lack of content. In my testing, the large ship physics seem just as bad if not worse than ksp1. That’s a core component of the game and likely not going to be patched in later. When they said they slayed the kraken, I have no idea what they were referring to. 

We’re on the second day of EA and the devs still haven’t fixed this?  The horror… the horror…

Edited February 25, 2023 by Wheehaw Kerman

[Vicis]

5 hours ago, mystik said:

Looks like they learned nothing from KSP. Especially the EULA part. You're installing spyware.

And that's a permanent deal breaker here.

I love Kerbal, I've got thousands of hours in it, but the feeling of loathing and hatred that these soul-less corporation invoke when they try to take more and more from us each year far outweighs any love I can have for a single product. 

Selling my system data? You know what, maybe I can even live with that so long as they're not lying about what they're selling. But claiming ownership of user created mods? Modding was the best thing about KSP1. Modding has been the best thing about some of my favorite games.

I can already see exactly where EULA's like this will lead to if people don't take a stand. Bethesda already tried it, and I guarantee you they'll all keep trying. Before you know it they'll be re-listing fan mods for $$$ and taking a cut of that profit. The same massive AAA developers that have intentionally cut mod support so they can peddle crappy DLC will then suddenly back pedal and claim "oh the technology has come so far, we can now add mod support!" and out-source the DLC cost entirely to the fans.

[Rocket Farmer]

14 minutes ago, Alexoff said:

In 2013, the game was developed by just a few developers for three years and cost like $0. I don't know for sure, I got acquainted with the game in 2015 and paid about $7. KSP2 began to be developed in 2017 by professional game developers under the patronage of T2. It is now in its sixth year of development and the game is 50$.

I looked in steam and I paid $25 in 2013.  I’m sure you bought it during a massive sale as regular price wasn’t anywhere near that low. 

I got 1,200+ hours out of KSP1.  I doubt I’ll play KSP2 that much however as a value proposition I know my entertainment will cost virtually nothing an hour with it (KSP1 was $0.02/hour).

So each to their own.  For me I only have to pay $50 to buy something that cost millions to develop and play as much as I want.  

[evileye.x]

I don't know why anyone can seriously argue about KSP 2 have more content, etc. than KSP 1 on it's start.

Yes, of course it does. But it was (or at least should be that way) built on KSP 1 's legacy, yes? 

But what KSP 2 now does better than KSP 1? The sad truth for now :

they have 2 cool trailers (teaser/release non-gameplay) selling the dream of the game that is not there yet (Starcitizen style) - and that's it.

Every other aspect of a good game - not there yet. KSP 1 with mods beats the crap out of EA  (Early Access?... Nope, more like Early Alpha) KSP 2. Except quite cool (annoying for someone more or less adult or even worse, teenagers) tutorial videos. And as I said trailers.

 

 

 

[Pthigrivi]

I don’t think we can blame folks for not having a good time. Im personally enjoying it because I have a high tolerance and weirdly like digging in and giving feedback but its not everyone’s bag. I do also think performance is still the biggest issue. Id certainly welcome higher framerates and its a huge bummer that so many other people can’t even play. It seems much less an issue on higher end machines but not everyone can afford that. The bugs are honestly to be expected and I have a lot of faith the worst of those will get cleaned up in the next couple of months. 
 

For those of you who bought in all I can say is have patience, and for those near or below the min-spec Id recommend holding off unless you’re really committed. 
 

I do think this is going to be an incredible game and the foundation design decisions are almost all really great. It just needs a lot of polish. 

Edited February 25, 2023 by Pthigrivi

[Missingno200]

5 hours ago, mystik said:

Publisher, please, do not refund any of the buyers. You get what you deserve!

You know to do that would be considered illegal in the EU and Australia, correct? What they did was also effectively false advertising, so we are within our right as customers to refund if we so please.

[Rayyeta]

To be entirely honest, it's about what I expected. The signs were there all along -- first, 2K poaching the studio, then the excessive marketing campaign, then the repeated delays, then the announcement that few key features would exist on launch. The red flags have been waving almost since development started; that said, I think more-or-less telling us straight-up that it would be like this on launch was a very good move on Intercept's part. They didn't just lie and act like everything was fine the way some other studios have done. That kinda seems like doing the bare minimum, but it makes me trust them a bit because they seem to be well aware of the poor state of the game and willing to communicate that to players.

Edited February 25, 2023 by Rayyeta

[Alexoff]

14 minutes ago, Rocket Farmer said:

I looked in steam and I paid $25 in 2013.  I’m sure you bought it during a massive sale as regular price wasn’t anywhere near that low.

No, just the regional price was like that. I bought the KSP1 on May 2, 2015, a few days after the release, when there were no discounts yet. And then I bought a funny game from an unknown indie developer, which turned out to be much bigger. And now a game from one of the largest game publishers at almost full price, which turned out to be much less than expected after years of delays and promises. If KSP2 were developed by our community on donations from patreon, then expectations would be more correlated with what happened now.

[Bej Kerman]

9 minutes ago, Alexoff said:

In 2013, the game was developed by just a few developers for three years and cost like $0. I don't know for sure, I got acquainted with the game in 2015 and paid about $7. KSP2 began to be developed in 2017 by professional game developers under the patronage of T2. It is now in its sixth year of development and the game is 50$.

KSP is missing a boat load of essential, borderline required features (see: persistent thrust, different fuel types bc the old liquid fuel NERVs are completely broken in regards to balance, ways to access parts that are inaccessible due to camera controls, a basic reactor, part classifications inside categories, etc) and £30 is asked for all that. I don't think the indie development really holds valid seeing as you had individual modders like Nertea coordinating the development of part assets and parts themselves far better than Squad was. I don't think it's a stretch to say that what's to be said about KSP 2 applies far more to KSP 1 than 2, especially seeing as <s> KSP 1's developers were so good at priorities </s> that they spent a good chunk of developer time remaking the part assets to be just as mediocre and even more bland than the old part assets. Yes, I'm bringing KSP 1 up for the 50th time. But I'm not a big fan of double standards and seeing people take kind stances about KSP 1 when it had many issues much worse than the, as Vl3d would say, mostly "cosmetic" bugs that I encounter playing KSP 2. On my first few weeks of coming back to KSP 1 towards late 2022, I had even small probes suffering from phantom forces and shaking themselves apart on successive rails warp > physics > rails warp cycles, all because I built a tiny bit of stuff around a tiny small cubic strut. You know, using a part built for part attachment to attach parts to places they otherwise can't be attached to. Again, this game in its entirety costs £30 and that's not a kind price point for an insanely cheap and broken game - the game's look, even with all the eye candy mods you can find, is stuck in 2011 and the bugs and lack of critical features make it feel like an early access game. Even seven years after its early access ended. Sure, KSP 1's tenuous list of planned features being checked makes it "feature complete", but that's a frankly useless metric given that many features you should need for e.g. ion engines were seemingly never planned. Yes, KSP 2's parts list takes a second to load and things are a bit slow, but it's certainly better than KSP 1 directing all of its resources to getting the parts loaded, which becomes a massive problem when using mods.

I notice my tangent is getting longer so I will stop there. I just wanted to address how insanely pricey KSP 1 is for how broken it is, and that people seem to forget, ignore or get apologetic about KSP 1's Knock-Nevis full of problems when it gets brought up in discussions about KSP 2.

So far, KSP 2 costs 15 quid more than KSP 1 (and is just about the same price as the full KSP 1 experience), and it's already dealt some serious blows in my eyes. I can't now go back to single-craft construction, a separate SPH, impulse maneuver editing and a navball that's afraid to be anywhere near the altitude readout, can I?

[MaxQ]

The drama was predictable, happens every time, but with an open mind and a positive attitude, the Early Access process is going to be a lot of fun. 

[ArmchairGravy]

Anyone else having an issue with SAS sending the ship spinning when coming out of time warp? This started happening to me in Mun orbit and lasted all the way down to the surface.

[Alexoff]

17 minutes ago, Bej Kerman said:

KSP 2 costs 15 quid more than KSP 1 (and is just about the same price as the full KSP 1 experience), and it's already dealt some serious blows in my eyes

I also got a similar effect after seeing clouds at night. The eyes are still bleeding.

[Azimech]

Also ... did anyone find the part files? Could be just me but browsing the folders I couldn't find any script files. Looks to me modding for the hoi polloi is out of the question.

[Fengist]

I've watched a lot of the videos on ksp2. In-space ship building, wind generators, roads  multi-player, etc.

I feel like I was told I was gonna get the BigMac that was on the fancy menu and what I paid for is a burger that looks like it's been smashed by steam roller.

[The Aziz]

Turns out you haven't seen the most important video, Feature Episode 6. Or read anything posted in the last 5 months. You'd know what you were paying for.

[Gorby1]

I mean... technically, they said you're getting a smashed burger right now but eventually they'll replace it with a Big Mac. If you don't trust them to finish the game that's one thing but they never said this release would be finished or even properly functioning.

[GregA]

A smashed burger or a Smash Burger?   Because Smash Burgers are awesome.

[uglyduckling81]

1 hour ago, Rayyeta said:

To be entirely honest, it's about what I expected. The signs were there all along -- first, 2K poaching the studio, then the excessive marketing campaign, then the repeated delays, then the announcement that few key features would exist on launch. The red flags have been waving almost since development started; that said, I think more-or-less telling us straight-up that it would be like this on launch was a very good move on Intercept's part. They didn't just lie and act like everything was fine the way some other studios have done. That kinda seems like doing the bare minimum, but it makes me trust them a bit because they seem to be well aware of the poor state of the game and willing to communicate that to players.

They didn't communicate it's current state at all. They said a few features aren't ready yet but we're very careful to hide just how bad it's current state is.

It's not a beta test. It's not even an Alpha. It's more like an advanced tech demo or proof of concept you might show to a potential publisher to get funding.

I've got a feeling TT might cancel the whole project. It's got years of development left just to get it to a playable state with the promised features. Wouldn't surprise me at all if this is just TT recovering some of their investment money before cancelling the whole thing.

[The Aziz]

1 hour ago, ArmchairGravy said:

Anyone else having an issue with SAS sending the ship spinning when coming out of time warp? This started happening to me in Mun orbit and lasted all the way down to the surface.

Yeah, also saved hundreds m/s of dv on landings since every timewarp exit reduced the speed. Fancy,  built in cheating without cheat menu.

Also, there's no way to tell transfer windows, is there? That would be first time I have to use external  software instead of TWP

[Stephensan]

1 hour ago, ArmchairGravy said:

Anyone else having an issue with SAS sending the ship spinning when coming out of time warp? This started happening to me in Mun orbit and lasted all the way down to the surface.

its not sas, the game decides to do a micro clipping/smashing the ship, and it makes it perceive its the SAS, the sas also cannot control that spin for some reason and it makes it 100's of times worse