[1.12.5] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.13.0 "Забытый" 13/Aug/2023)

[CobaltWolf]

45 minutes ago, Royalswissarmyknife said:

I have a question how long do you assume BDB 2 to come out for Ksp 2?

7 minutes ago, The Dressian Exploder said:

This is just a guess, but I think it's probably quite hard to know how long it'll take, as we don't know what the process for modding KSP2 will look like compared to KSP1.

Yeah, can't offer even a vague estimate without knowing how long it will take to get access to whatever modding tools are needed. I assume it would take years to fully port the content we've developed for KSP1, and that's without accounting for issues with dependencies (I don't think Blowfish intends on making an equivalent of B9PS for KSP2, for example)

[DeadJohn]

32 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

1 hour ago, Royalswissarmyknife said:

I have a question how long do you assume BDB 2 to come out for Ksp 2?

42 minutes ago, The Dressian Exploder said:

This is just a guess, but I think it's probably quite hard to know how long it'll take, as we don't know what the process for modding KSP2 will look like compared to KSP1.

Yeah, can't offer even a vague estimate without knowing how long it will take to get access to whatever modding tools are needed. I assume it would take years to fully port the content we've developed for KSP1, and that's without accounting for issues with dependencies (I don't think Blowfish intends on making an equivalent of B9PS for KSP2, for example)

The hooks you need to do a high quality version of BDB might not even exist in the early versions of KSP 2 Early Access. Some of the KSP 2 announcements promise better support for modding but it will be interesting to see what makes it into the game and when.

[CobaltWolf]

20 minutes ago, DeadJohn said:

The hooks you need to do a high quality version of BDB might not even exist in the early versions of KSP 2 Early Access. Some of the KSP 2 announcements promise better support for modding but it will be interesting to see what makes it into the game and when.

Yeah with the announcement that it will be Early Access and not a full release next month, I don't really think modding support will be a priority. I think it will come and be everything we dreamed, but probably not a priority when they are focusing on implementing the basic game features they promised still. So I don't anticipate being able to start right away.

[GoldForest]

Sorry this took so long, decided to take a break from screenshots. But here it is, Keyhole family!

Full album: Imgur: The magic of the Internet

Keyhole 1:

Spoiler

Keyhole 2:

Spoiler

Keyhole 4:

Spoiler

Keyhole 4A:

Spoiler

Keyhole 4B:

Spoiler

Keyhole 7:

Spoiler

Keyhole 8:

Spoiler

Keyhole 9:

Spoiler

Keyhole 10:

Spoiler

 

[Fisherton]

My IVAs are not working, I don't know what could possibly be wrong 

[GJdude]

Found a fun oopsie for the USI Life Support compatibility configs, notably there's two of them, one called "Supply" and one called "USI-LS". Both seem identical though one is slightly larger and various things are being applied twice, like flavour text and hab modules and the likes. Simply deleting one of them is the fix for that, tried it myself.

There was also this happening:

Spoiler

There's also resources like Water and Hydrogen/Oxygen showing up in some of the various AORV cargo parts alongside a glaring lack of some USI resources like Supplies (Other parts that should have Supplies in them like the Gemini service modules seem to be fine, so I assume this effected the parts that would only be ore containers by default). I did just uninstall TAC Life Support which is what might have put those there, but it's unusual that this stuck around even after I deleted my MM cache and started a new save for some fresh patching. (If it helps at all, the TAC-LS compatibility config is also called "Supply". Maybe something's not agreeing there?)

My thinking is it's just a leftover from something TAC applied since a look into the USI-LS configs showed no mention of water being added to anything.

I've just deleted the TAC-LS configs completely and booted up the game again after another cache wipe, but it still persists. I'm going to try deleting my part database, USI, BDB, anything else I think is suspect, booting the game without it all, reinstalling them and booting it up again. If it's still there then we know something is definitely wrong.

But I'm getting the idea that these resources aren't coming from TAC and are supposed to be on the cargo parts since they can be used with certain kinds of fuel cells, including the ones I'm getting from having Universal Storage II installed.

In which case, I still feel like there should be more USI resource options for these cargo parts since that's the main thing you'd be bringing up to a manned space station - Supplies or Fertilizer and the like. Some of the old versions of these parts had it so if it's planned to be added in a coming patch then that's fine.

Edited January 13, 2023 by GJdude

[hollyhalloway]

is there a list of sorts that breaks down the function of all the science experiments? like where to use them and which ones are redundant? 

[GoldForest]

Time for strawman!

Full album: Imgur: The magic of the Internet

[GoldForest]

Apollo Boilerplate + Pegasus!

Full album: Imgur: The magic of the Internet

[OrbitalManeuvers]

6 hours ago, hollyhalloway said:

is there a list of sorts that breaks down the function of all the science experiments? like where to use them and which ones are redundant? 

If you're trying to plan which experiments to take with you based on what you've already done, and your current mission profile, there are two things you need. Once is the R&D building's Archive tab. And the other is this:

 

[DaveyJ576]

On 1/13/2023 at 5:20 AM, GoldForest said:

Apollo Boilerplate + Pegasus!

Full album: Imgur: The magic of the Internet

@GoldForest, excellent work as always. However, I must ask that you forgive a small picking of nits. The Pegasus missions were SA-9, 8, and 10. Those three missions flew with a revised shorter and lighter weight Version 2 of the Instrument Unit (IU). The one you used here is the Version 1 model and it flew only on SA-5, 6, and 7. Both versions of the IU are available in-game.

The Saturn I Block 1 missions (SA-1 to 4) had their flight avionics contained in several pressurized canisters attached to the top of the first stage, as the upper stages were inert mockups. I suppose this IU version could be called Version 0.  Version 1 (shown in your photos above) had the avionics components contained in two pressurized tubes that crossed in the center. An inert gas (probably nitrogen) filled the tubes, providing a simple environmental control that helped dissipate heat generated by the electronic components. Rapid advances in avionics and cooling techniques allowed the elimination of the tubes in the last three Version 2 units, enabling a reduction in height by half, and gaining a noticeable weight savings that improved booster performance. An enlarged and updated variant of the Version 2 was used on the Saturn IB and the Saturn V.

I have a weird fascination with the Saturn I. Admittedly it is kind of a homely child, but I love flying it. I have been able to put a short-fueled Block I CSM in a low (100 km) orbit in an attempt to replicate the planned manned Apollo Saturn I flights that were ultimately canceled in late 1963. A Saturn I Block 3 version (the original C-1 proposal) with the Centaur upper stage would have made a handy NASA launcher for lunar and Mars probes like Lunar Orbiter, Surveyor, and Mariner. 

Edited January 15, 2023 by DaveyJ576
Typo

[ra4nd0m]

46 minutes ago, DaveyJ576 said:

I have a weird fascination with the Saturn I

All of the Saturn familiy in my opinion are amazing. They are pinnacle of Von Braun's designs and were TERRIBLY underutilized. If STS was never considered OR cancelled (Like in ETS) we've had an amazing family of rockets with huge legacy that easily rivals Atlas and Delta. 

Just imagine all of these missions which can be launched atop saturn rockets. STS never having Centaur upper stage IMO gutted Shuttle's capiabilitiy in terms of deep space missions.

How NASA have been struggling in 00's to reuse STS' technology just to cut price in terms of infrastrucutre actually is kinda funny. You know, they got rid of all of the Apollo hardware, which can easily been reused and now, after 50 years that bit them in the back HARD.

Edited January 13, 2023 by ra4nd0m

[GoldForest]

5 hours ago, DaveyJ576 said:

@GoldForest, excellent work as always. However, I must ask that you forgive a small picking of nits. The Pegasus missions were SA-9, 8, and 10. Those three missions flew with a revised shorter and lighter weight Version 2 of the Instrument Unit (IU). The one you used here is the Version 1 model and it flew only on SA-5, 6, and 7. Both versions of the IU are available in-game.

The Saturn I Block 1 missions (SA-1 to 4) had their flight avionics contained in several pressurized canisters attached to the top of the first stage, as the upper stages were inert mockups. I supposed this IU version could be called Version 0.  Version 1 (shown in your photos above) had the avionics components contained in two pressurized tubes that crossed in the center. An inert gas (probably nitrogen) filled the tubes, providing a simple environmental control that helped dissipate heat generated by the electronic components. Rapid advances in avionics and cooling techniques allowed the elimination of the tubes in the last three Version 2 units, enabling a reduction in height by half, and gaining a noticeable weight savings that improved booster performance. An enlarged and updated variant of the Version 2 was used on the Saturn IB and the Saturn V.

I have a weird fascination with the Saturn I. Admittedly it is kind of a homely child, but I love flying it. I have been able to put a short-fueled Block I CSM in a low (100 km) orbit in an attempt to replicate the planned manned Apollo Saturn I flights that were ultimately canceled in late 1963. A Saturn I Block 3 version (the original C-1 proposal) with the Centaur upper stage would have made a handy NASA launcher for lunar and Mars probes like Lunar Orbiter, Surveyor, and Mariner. 

Yeah, I wasn't entirely sure which to use. Gunter just said "Saturn I Bk 2", but there's like 2 or 3 block 2 designs. I just now noticed they actually have a picture of Pegasus 1 on the page. I see that I also used the wrong color scheme. The bottom tank should have the black stripes. 

Edited January 13, 2023 by GoldForest

[ra4nd0m]

@GoldForest I have an amazing idea for another cursed rocket but my PC does not feel well so here's one for the taking. 

.

.

Saturn I block I thrust augmented. 

A family of rockets with SRBs instead of fins. And a heavy version with 3 cores. 

Use SIVb as the 2ndstage and SIV as the 3rd. Heavy can run Centaur as 4th stage.

Ultimate old hardware reuse.

Edited January 13, 2023 by ra4nd0m

[Royalswissarmyknife]

25 minutes ago, ra4nd0m said:

@GoldForest I have an amazing idea for another cursed rocket but my PC does not feel well so here's one for the taking. 

.

.

Saturn I block I thrust augmented. 

A family of rockets with SRBs instead of fins. And a heavy version with 3 cores. 

Use SIVb as the 2ndstage and SIV as the 3rd. Heavy can run Centaur as 4th stage.

Ultimate old hardware reuse.

I feel like @Blufor878 would be better for this

[DaveyJ576]

1 hour ago, GoldForest said:

Yeah, I was entirely sure which to use. Gunter just said "Saturn I Bk 2", but there's like 2 or 3 block 2 designs. I just now noticed they actually have a picture of Pegasus 1 on the page. I see that I also used the wrong color scheme. The bottom tank should have the black stripes. 

For the Saturn I Block 1 flights (SA-1 to 4) I use an AARDV control unit attached to the top of the first stage. I then build the "upper stages" attached to that. Fairings hide the AARDV unit so you can't see it. Works pretty damn well for these simple flights. I don't have the game up right now so I can't attach screenies. Unfortunately BDB does not have a "Version 0" of the IU, but that is not a problem. 

[CobaltWolf]

19 hours ago, Fisherton said:

My IVAs are not working, I don't know what could possibly be wrong 

Me neither. What do you mean? A lot of the parts don't have real IVAs, just the void.

 

18 hours ago, GJdude said:

Found a fun oopsie for the USI Life Support compatibility configs, notably there's two of them, one called "Supply" and one called "USI-LS". Both seem identical though one is slightly larger and various things are being applied twice, like flavour text and hab modules and the likes. Simply deleting one of them is the fix for that, tried it myself.

There was also this happening:

  Reveal hidden contents

There's also resources like Water and Hydrogen/Oxygen showing up in some of the various AORV cargo parts alongside a glaring lack of some USI resources like Supplies (Other parts that should have Supplies in them like the Gemini service modules seem to be fine, so I assume this effected the parts that would only be ore containers by default). I did just uninstall TAC Life Support which is what might have put those there, but it's unusual that this stuck around even after I deleted my MM cache and started a new save for some fresh patching. (If it helps at all, the TAC-LS compatibility config is also called "Supply". Maybe something's not agreeing there?)

My thinking is it's just a leftover from something TAC applied since a look into the USI-LS configs showed no mention of water being added to anything.

I've just deleted the TAC-LS configs completely and booted up the game again after another cache wipe, but it still persists. I'm going to try deleting my part database, USI, BDB, anything else I think is suspect, booting the game without it all, reinstalling them and booting it up again. If it's still there then we know something is definitely wrong.

But I'm getting the idea that these resources aren't coming from TAC and are supposed to be on the cargo parts since they can be used with certain kinds of fuel cells, including the ones I'm getting from having Universal Storage II installed.

In which case, I still feel like there should be more USI resource options for these cargo parts since that's the main thing you'd be bringing up to a manned space station - Supplies or Fertilizer and the like. Some of the old versions of these parts had it so if it's planned to be added in a coming patch then that's fine.

We don't maintain any of the compatibility stuff, we just keep them with the mod so they're available and people can submit updates for them (cough). The team doesn't use a lot of mods in our test installs, so we wouldn't be good judges of balance for mod resources like that anyways. Most of the stuff from the last year or two probably hasn't been added to those configs.

It looks like @Marcelo Silveira submitted the last update for those configs, if he understands why there's duplicates?

Does CommunityResourcePack include those extra resources you're seeing?

 

[Zorg]

UPDATE - BLUEDOG DESIGN BUREAU  v1.12.0 “Песок”

BDB v1.12.0 Release Album

GITHUB DOWNLOAD    |  SPACEDOCK DOWNLOAD

should also be available via CKAN soon.

Changelog

New Content and Features
- Voyager Mars probe part set. Prestigious end game probe, which is dual launched on Saturn V, each probe consisting of a full fledged orbiter and lander.
- Includes new C-1 auxiliary engine, Saturn S4B dual payload adapter, star 24 deorbit motor, and 40 components making up the orbiter and lander including several new science instruments.
- Little Joe II.
- Orbital assembly components for Saturn S4B sized stages including in line docking interstage adapter, 4 way APS.
- Side docking guide rail which allows for up to 3 docking ports to easily line up for multi docking. Allows users to easily lash together S4B or SII sized stages side by side on orbit.
- SNAP 29 RTG with conformal radiator (sized for S4B diameter)
- Dedicated radiators for cryocooling Saturn stages
- Mitsubishi MB-60 engine in fixed and deployable variants, a concept engine once proposed as a Delta IV upgrade (and for H2A and possibly SLS)

Updates and Enhancements
- Soilscoop experiment definition from Coatl (MM patch will unify the def if Coatl is also installed)
- Add Centaur interface mesh to Atlas V 4xx interstage adapter
- Updated moduleBDBdepthMask to handle translucent shaders (Thanks to CineboxAndrew)
- New SRM upper stage plume (Thanks to Al2Me6 and Kochi for providing FX used in this plume), applied to all vac/upper stage SRB motors.
- Tweaked upper stage LH2 plume.
- Remove particle shader from F1 and E1 waterfall due to performance and look problems when clustered.
- Re-balance the science labs

Bug fixes
- Fix conflict between Extraplanetary launch pads compatibility patch and Simple Construction
- Fix Deadly Reentry compatibility with engine thermals patch
- Fix Filter extensions config when used without BDB Realnames Extras patch
- Fix Keyhole dual adapter decoupler direction
- Lunar shelter telescope can be used on atmospheric bodies now
- Fix for Deadly Reentry conflict
- Fix in flight texture switch in BDB Extras for 5 crew Apollo capsule
- Fix procedural fairings patch.
- Fix missing power tower dual solar array truss

 

Cool Voyager Mars cinematic

 

Two pics above are also credited to Steven

Edited January 13, 2023 by Zorg

[Blufor878]

1 hour ago, Royalswissarmyknife said:

I feel like @Blufor878 would be better for this

2 hours ago, ra4nd0m said:

@GoldForest I have an amazing idea for another cursed rocket but my PC does not feel well so here's one for the taking. 

.

.

Saturn I block I thrust augmented. 

A family of rockets with SRBs instead of fins. And a heavy version with 3 cores. 

Use SIVb as the 2ndstage and SIV as the 3rd. Heavy can run Centaur as 4th stage.

Ultimate old hardware reuse.

Yes, more opportunities to abuse Saturn components!

Also I technically did something like this already, but I gather we're wanting to use the Saturn IB engines as well?

Edit: Dang, pretty much the moment the next update was announced too...

Edited January 13, 2023 by Blufor878

[Royalswissarmyknife]

THE UPDATES HERE! 

Only problem is I have to wait for Skyhawk to update 

Edited January 13, 2023 by Royalswissarmyknife

[GJdude]

1 hour ago, CobaltWolf said:

Does CommunityResourcePack include those extra resources you're seeing?

It does indeed, strange for these particular ones to be included on the cargo parts but they're there. They are the three resources that hydrogen/oxygen fuel cells use - fuel cells which are present in BDB. I tried to have a go at adding some resources to them but couldn't wrap my head around it at all, unfortunately.

[ra4nd0m]

2 hours ago, Blufor878 said:

I gather we're wanting to use the Saturn IB engines as well?

yup. Three F1's are too normal I think…

I wonder how good delta 1st stage tanks would be as a side boosters if we slap F1 on it…

[Fisherton]

Im praying IVAs have been fixed in this update 

[Fisherton]

4 hours ago, CobaltWolf said:

Me neither. What do you mean? A lot of the parts don't have real IVAs, just the void.

 

We don't maintain any of the compatibility stuff, we just keep them with the mod so they're available and people can submit updates for them (cough). The team doesn't use a lot of mods in our test installs, so we wouldn't be good judges of balance for mod resources like that anyways. Most of the stuff from the last year or two probably hasn't been added to those configs.

It looks like @Marcelo Silveira submitted the last update for those configs, if he understands why there's duplicates?

Does CommunityResourcePack include those extra resources you're seeing?

 

the parts that DO have ivas Straight up don't even register in the crew cam

[Blufor878]

2 hours ago, ra4nd0m said:

yup. Three F1's are too normal I think…

I wonder how good delta 1st stage tanks would be as a side boosters if we slap F1 on it…

Don't you dare cast doubt on the God-Emperor F1!
For real, ask and you shall receive.



Bonus Little Joe II-derived smallsat launcher.